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To: elfman2
Are you saying it’s somehow immoral to mouth whatever words someone wants while holding a gun to your head in order to gain release, knowing that few if anyone will believe them and they can be recounted when free?

"Immoral" is a subjective judgement for me to apply to them that I won't make. But even speaking logically, teaching the Muzzies we believe in nothing and will say anything to save our own skins will be very costly in the long run. I wouldn't do it.

For those who are Christians, Y'shua made it clear what the cost of denial would be.

Matthew 10:33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

That's just how it is. Believe in Him and one must accept the consequences, our watered-down understanding of Christianity notwithstanding. Stephen understood that when Shaul of Tarsus conducted his execution:

59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit. 60 And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep.
23 posted on 08/27/2006 7:09:44 AM PDT by Carry_Okie (There are people in power who are truly evil.)
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To: Carry_Okie
" Matthew 10:33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven "

If you think God would consider that “conversion” video at gunpoint as a denial, that’s you’re warped belief alone, and not anything biblically supported.

36 posted on 08/27/2006 7:24:14 AM PDT by elfman2 (An army of amateurs doing the media's job.)
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To: Carry_Okie; Disturbin

I thought pretty much the same thing when I heard that.

While the news of their release was wonderful, the fact that they had to embrace Islam was something that truly put a damper on the jubilation. While we all know that they just did so because their lives were in danger, it was still devastating to see that that's what they had done. The Scripture you cited from Matthew came to my mind immediately, as well.

There was one, or maybe two girls, from Columbine High School who would NOT renounce their Christian faith when threatened with their lives, and they, of course, were killed in that horrible massacre. I kept thinking of them and their actions, HOPING that I would be as strong if put in the same set of circumstances.

Meanwhile, both of these men should be kept in our prayers.


62 posted on 08/27/2006 8:55:14 AM PDT by Joann37
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To: Carry_Okie
"Matthew 10:33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven."

Well, Peter didn't do too badly, did he? Denying Christ before men three times to escape immediate prosecution, becoming the chief apostle of the one he denied.

Don't we deny Christ every time we go against His Word? Of course we do. Probably everyday, at least in thought, and that is where the sin lies -- those pre-occupations that separate us from God and the will of God. We are prosecuted for breaking man's law, but we have a greater judge which judges the heart.

The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. The unforgivable sin is blasphemy -- claiming to be God, which is far worse than saying there is no God or even saying there is no 'god' but Allah (a one-dimensional, non-existent, mythological entity which is un-manifest in the real world and only has substance in the minds of the sex-depraved who hate life.)

Say what you will, but every man a liar and only God be true. Do we take an oath but only to break it? Sure we do, for oaths are a test of the strength of our resolve and are fated to be broken to prove to us our weakness.

But nevertheless, our Redeemer lives. And because He lives, our sins are forgiven daily. That is butter on our daily bread.

So to be a muzzie for a day or two is no big deal. Try the spirits.

80 posted on 08/27/2006 11:27:47 AM PDT by Eastbound
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To: Carry_Okie
Matthew 10:33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

you know I hate to say it.... but I was thinking all the while that they said that they'd been forced to denounce their God...as bad as this may sound..they've sinned if you believe in the bible.

Now I'm not saying that I wouldn't do the same, I'm a coward and very poor Christian... but Christ did say that men will come to threaten you with DEATH and that you SHALL NOT DENY ME.

You can make excuses (as we all do for all of our sins) but the bottom line is don't deny your God.

If you say that this is rare... I ask you to remember the 2 young girls among several at columbine highschool that was asked with a shotgun to their heads if they believed in God... their answer...yes... some lived some died..but they didn't deny God..

sad huh?

86 posted on 08/27/2006 11:38:36 AM PDT by Dick Vomer (liberals suck......... but it depends on what your definition of the word "suck" is.)
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To: Carry_Okie

Terrorist are not men, they are gun holding false god worshipers.

Before mankind they said they made statements at the point of a gun.


126 posted on 08/27/2006 5:38:55 PM PDT by A CA Guy (God Bless America, God bless and keep safe our fighting men and women.)
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