Experts find site of Zulu siege

BBC ^ | 22 Aug 2006 | Stephen Stewart

[Brit1]

Yes we do thank God every day.

Then I watched some real film of the 8th in their B17s carrying out a mission over Germany in WW11. No dialog no noise just Glen Millers music. Very emotional.

To all Americans.... why do you need our 'heroes' when as above you have so many of your own?

[Tulsa Brian]

At the risk of coming across as churlish, we don't own history revisionism. I will say one thing to you folks over there, when you steal, you steal BIG... :D

http://www.troy-in-england.co.uk

[smaug6]

I laughed when I read this also.
Weapons=Bad (any context)
Many 'educated' people choose to ignore reality and live encased inside a cocoon of self reinforcing fantasy about the world. This is the root of many of our problems. Maybe the intrusions of the jihadis will get to an unavoidable level and rattle enough cages to awaken our society. I think this is our 'best?' hope at this point. If a few western cities go up in mushroom clouds maybe we will deal with the threat posed by 'they who must not be named'.

[Bear_Slayer]

There is an outfit in Montana that makes good repors of them

You may not be speaking of the one I am familiar with, but there are a few well-known gun/knife makers in my area. I am acquainted with the gentleman that made Quigley's knife; the one shown in the beginning of the movie, shown as he sheaths it.

He also makes replica guns and spurs. His work is high dollar and well respected.

[ZULU]

I was referring to the Shiloh outfit somebody else referred to.

I didn't know anyone made Sharp's guns on an individual level. I thought they were machine tool products.

I do know there are a lot of great muzzle-loading gunmakers ( I hoped to be one before I got married - but marriage ended that) and Knife and swordsmiths out there today.

[higgmeister]

To all Americans.... why do you need our 'heroes' when as above you have so many of your own?

LOL, because there could never have been another Sir Admiral Lord Nelson. "Kiss me, Hardy!"

Then again, I am an Englishman eight plus generations removed, and my mother was a Nelson!

[higgmeister]

I've been a wrestling hold all my life.

[Ghost of Philip Marlowe]

I fear you may be right. Or, once again as so many times in the past, the 30 per cent who know what's going on, want to defend liberty, and have the courage to do so, will carry the weight of the 60 per cent who are clueless and hate liberty or don't care one way or another.

[Brit1]

"Kiss me Hardy" ..."but where " gasps Hardy watching in horror at the surgeon struggleling to remove Nelsons pants......

[Brit1]

Hey Tulsa Brian don't take it too seriously.

My Father was a bomber pilot in WW11. Lancasters and B24s.He will tell you as he has told me how thankful the whole squadron was returning from a raid knowing that 'The little brothers' were providing some 'Top Cover' by Dawns Early Light.

[Lonesome in Massachussets]

Television killed history

I doubt that television distorts history any more than Homer did. Popular history tends to simplify and romantize events, no doubt, but it will also inspire some to dig deeper to examine the underlying evidence.

[Tulsa Brian]

Hey, Brit1, No offense taken!

It's more a question of education. Why aren't schools teaching history? Generally speaking, I seriously doubt anyone in Hollywierd has the knowledge, let alone the desire to acquire the knowledge to tell history as it happened. By that I don't mean taking the necessary 'license' to translate a WW II story into a manageable 90-minute timeframe, but just the basic facts of that particular story they want to recount. I really don't think anyone anywhere takes Hollywierd as a credible source of instruction.

The upswing, of course is if anyone's imagination was sparked enough by that movie, I'm sure they did some independent research and learned the truth. And the open sewer that is Hollywierd of the last forty years looses a few more patrons.

Before I step off my soapbox, I thank your father for his having the courage and moral clarity to plant his feet and beat back the barbarians at the gate of his generation. My father was in the Pacific Theater and I’m still astounded by the scope of that war.

[Brit1]

Hi Tulsa Brian...no problems and may I return the compliment to your father, many here know of the sacrifice made by US forces in the Pacific.
You might ask why our schools don't teach history , thats simple almost every student is convinced they are going to make one rap doggerel noise, sorry 'disc', and become a millionaire overnight and the teachers let them think this way because it makes for a quiet life

Just a quick personal question what did you make of 'Saving Private Ryan'? FRegards.

[Tulsa Brian]

Sorry this reply is so late.
I thought the opening landing scenes were some of the most horrific (i.e. 'realistic') playacting I've ever seen in a movie before.
I wish they would have told the true story, though. But it's only a movie and I guess they felt they had to maximize their investment by improving on reality to drive home the point they were making. :)

[Brit1]

Take your point. Then I suppose unless you have been shot at in reality you won't ever feel that fear.

I'm trying to get some sense or understanding of how Americans feel about their own culture and how its projected through Hollywood so may I try another track.

How do you feel about 'The Right Stuff' and Apollo 13.

[Tulsa Brian]

Take your point. Then I suppose unless you have been shot at in reality you won't ever feel that fear.

Yes, that's very true. I wasn't aware that was what you were looking for.

I'm trying to get some sense or understanding of how Americans feel about their own culture and how its projected through Hollywood...

I can't speak on behalf of all Americans, but this one is immeasurably proud of our history and culture. Let me be the first to say we've made many mistakes and we have gone a long way in correcting those mistakes. 600,000 dead Americans and a South more throughly devastated than Germany after the Second World War is payment for the evil of slavery. I'm sick to death of race baiter's and non Americans throwing Jefferson and slavery in our faces as if it weren't rectified yet. You could make a very good argument that being born in America (or anywhere else in the West) and not Africa is a very good thing. Same goes for Indians. They were fratricidal and every bit as fallen as other men. They lived in balance with nature out of sheer necessity, not out of some altruistic love of nature. Who can say how long they populated the Americas? Where are their inventions? Literature? This is one quarter Cherokee talking, mind you.

I believe that the U.S., as defined by the Declaration of Independence and written Constitution is the greatest flowering of Western Judeo-Christian expression in history due to the aforementioned values held by the Founding Fathers and their willingness to learn from histories examples, both failed and successful. Not because Americans are intrinsically superior. With real leadership, the West will rise again. rant/

As to how American history is portrayed through Hollywierd's diseased mind's eye. It's very leftist/socialist and it's a rare film in the last 45 years that tries to tell an uplifting story about America or even the West. Facts are often suborned to either further the point a film maker is trying to make, made up out of whole cloth, or ignored.

The most recent films I've seen that didn't leave me with a bad taste in my mouth are the Ken Burns PBS series on the Civil War, Glory, The Zodiac and Gettysburg, in addition to the two you mentioned. As you might guess from my tastes, I'm a long standing history/true crime student. All are very well done and, I think most importantly, done by people who genuinely care about the history being depicted.

[Brit1]

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply.

It seems we as individuals share much common ground.

I do take your point about Jefferson and slavery now left a long way behind in your history. As for being born in the West for that I am very thankful. Not meaning to be flippant..but I was reliably informed by an American history professor that there was never one example of a wagon train forming a circle to defend itself against an Indian attack (excluding the 'wagon box fight')and the reasons why..sounded completely logical to me. Such is the power of the 'dream factory'to be 'untruthful'.

Watched 'Gettysburg'for first time a couple of years ago after spending 7 weeks as a'guest'of The National Health Service..very very emotional stuff, .Have that as well as '13' and 'The Right Stuff' on dvd and have watched them all many times Always thought they were a far better and more accurate expression of American achievement and spirit which I champion whenever I get the chance. Once again thank you.

[Tulsa Brian]

Once again thank you.

My pleasure. Enjoyable 'speaking' with you, too (common heritage separated by common language aside). :D

[PoorMuttly]

"Its also interesting archaeologically to have something designed to kill transformed into something constructive."

A few months ago a ranch hand and I were way out on the fence line, doing repairs. We needed to brace a steel pipe, so that the barbed wire would not pull it over. The batteries for the drill were empty, and we needed to drill a hole.

Out of the pickup truck comes a Russian Mosin Nagant 7.62 caliber carbine marked 1944.

One shot, kneeling, straight through.

"Served the purpose."

[TWfromTEXAS]

Almost every male member of my family has served, back to the time we were shooting Red Coats. All those who are still alive love and honor you Brits and your military. I have a friend now serving in the US Air Force stationed in the UK.