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No, this is not our war: Buchanan barf alert
World net daily ^ | July 22, 2006 | Patrick Buchanan

Posted on 07/22/2006 10:43:04 AM PDT by steadfastconservative

My country has been "torn to shreds,"said Fouad Siniora, the prime minister of Lebanon, as the death toll among his people passed 300 civilian dead, 1000 wounded, with half a million homeless.

Israel must pay for the "barbaric destruction," said Siniora.

To the contrary, says columnist Lawrence Kudlow, "Israel is doing the Lord's work."

On American TV, former Israeli prime minister Binyamin Netanyahu says the ruination of Lebanon is Hezbollah's doing. But is it Hezbollah that is using U.S.-built F-16s, with precision-guided bombs and 155-mm artillery pieces to wreak death and devastation on Lebanon?

No, Israel is doing this with the blessing and without a peep of protest from President Bush. And we wonder why they hate us. . . .

(Excerpt) Read more at wnd.com ...


TOPICS: Israel; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: antiamerican; antisemite; antisemitism; bucahanfirst; buchanan; coughlinjunior; demagogue; iran; israel; lebanon; patbuchanan; patbuchananhatesjews; patrickbuchanan; pitchforkpat; randsconcerntrolls; war
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To: steadfastconservative
Buchanan is a stupid moron. It's obvious that this time the Israeli's are taking care of business and then Buchanan comes out with crap about how bad Israel is and how bad Bush is for supporting them. If he's MSNBC's poster child for fair debate then it's no wonder MSNBC ranks the lowest.
41 posted on 07/22/2006 2:08:41 PM PDT by tobyhill (The War on Terrorism is not for the weak.)
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To: ChessExpert

A fellow named Adolph had ideas similar to Pat. I'm certain Adolph would approve of Hezbollah. It seems politics is a circle, the extreme right and the extreme left are not so far apart.


42 posted on 07/22/2006 2:16:51 PM PDT by razzle
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To: ChessExpert

"Jews have the same split as do Christians."

Christians are at least 60% Conservative Rebublican. I would guess Jews are close to 90% Liberal Democrat.


43 posted on 07/22/2006 2:21:19 PM PDT by razzle
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To: razzle
I would guess Jews are close to 90% Liberal Democrat.

Not quite, razzle. There are quite a number of Jews who are Republicans and the number is growing. If W got at least 25% of the Jewish vote in '04 (admittedly he deserved to get a lot more), your numbers don't quite add up. Furthermore, Ronald Reagan got something close to 40% among Jews in 1980, and I doubt if too many of those came from "Liberal Democrats."

When ChessMaster said, "Jews have the same split as do Christians," I would think that he was making a qualitative, rather than quantitative, statement.

As for your statement "Christians are at least 60% Conservative Republican," the accuracy of that would depend on whether you are using a narrower or broader definition of "Christian."

44 posted on 07/22/2006 3:17:48 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: razzle
I agree with you about Adolf and Pat. As I read the WND column posted here, I couldn't help see that Buchanan was much closer to the Democrat position on this than to the GOP. In fact, he slurred the (Jewish) RNC chairman as "Kenny Boy." Little doubt from this that Buchanan is indeed the antisemite that Bill Buckley concluded he was a number of years ago.
45 posted on 07/22/2006 3:28:10 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: razzle
"Jews have the same split as do Christians."

Christians are at least 60% Conservative Republican. I would guess Jews are close to 90% Liberal Democrat

Well, yes you may be right, but allow me to expand.

Let’s look at this from a worldwide perspective. Jews have participated both in free market and communist countries. But so have Christians and ex-Christians. For most of western civilization, Jewish and historically Christian people are the religious right. But in each case, many have succumbed to the allures of the atheistic left, specifically communism.

In America, Jews are liberal. Liberal does not equal communist. (But I do think that American communists are one of the Democratic party’s voting blocks.). Dennis Prager’s articles have convinced me that Jews were traumatized by the German Jewish Holocaust (one of many 20th century holocausts) and now fear the religious right. I’m convinced that they are confused and mistaken. Some religious Jews are coming around to see that they have a lot in common with American Christians. Jerry Fallwell is just one Christian who believes that Christians have a lot in common with Jews.

46 posted on 07/22/2006 3:37:26 PM PDT by ChessExpert (Mohammed was not moderate)
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To: steadfastconservative
Why is it that the irrelevant PB can stir up more than this guy?
47 posted on 07/22/2006 3:45:51 PM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: Mamzelle
Good question. You might want to post it.
48 posted on 07/22/2006 3:50:19 PM PDT by ChessExpert (Mohammed was not moderate)
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To: ChessExpert
re: Dennis Prager’s articles have convinced me that Jews were traumatized by the German Jewish Holocaust (one of many 20th century holocausts) and now fear the religious right.)))

Excuses, excuses. Self-aggrandizing attempt to turn bigotry into martydom and selling out Israel in the process. If the liberal Jews won't help Israel (and is anyone noticing a state with a large Jewish population about to kick out the only pro-Israel Dem Senator?), evangelicals will not be able to hold the line for very long.

49 posted on 07/22/2006 4:11:49 PM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: Mamzelle
If the liberal Jews won't help Israel (and is anyone noticing a state with a large Jewish population about to kick out the only pro-Israel Dem Senator?), evangelicals will not be able to hold the line for very long.

You won’t get any argument from me.

50 posted on 07/22/2006 4:22:39 PM PDT by ChessExpert (Mohammed was not moderate)
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To: justiceseeker93

"There are quite a number of Jews who are Republicans and the number is growing."

I hope you are right. As you say, it seems odd that the Conservatives are usually (except the Bucannan crowd) very pro-Isreal and get only 25% of their vote. Could the pro-America thing be a turnoff to the Jews. I hear of some American Jews saying they have more allegience to Israel than America and they have been here many generations.


51 posted on 07/22/2006 4:31:59 PM PDT by razzle
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To: razzle
I don't know of too many American Jews who have been here many generations who say they have more allegiance to Israel than America.

Most American Jews are from families that settled in the US in the late 19th and very early twentieth centuries from eastern Europe (before Israel existed as a nation). They are Americans first, but don't see any contradiction between support for the US and support for Israel, since both are fighting a common enemy for the most part and have been allies for years. The pro-America thing is a turnoff to some Jews just as it is a turnoff to many whose politics were formed in the Vietnam antiwar movement. But leftist Jews, like others who swallowed much of the American counterculture back then, are - as a group - NOT particularly inclined to be pro-Israel, especially in its current war effort vs. the Islamofascists. (Of course, there are exceptions to every rule.)

If you measure allegiance to Israel with population movements, American Jewish migration to Israel is much lower statistically than Jewish migration to Israel from many other countries.

52 posted on 07/22/2006 5:39:02 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: Mamzelle; ChessExpert
If the liberal Jews won't help Israel,...evangelicals will not be able to hold the line very long.

Disagree. Evangelicals don't give a hoot about others who may not help Israel. Their support for Israel is sincere and derives from Biblical teachings which are not subject to change by the whims of other groups.

53 posted on 07/22/2006 5:53:55 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: justiceseeker93
re: Disagree. Evangelicals don't give a hoot about others who may not help Israel)))

What do hoots have to do with it? Whatever hoots evangelicals continue to give, and they'll continue--it's not enough to stem the tide that has turned against Israel. The Democrats used to be pro-Israel. US Jews (liberal, too) used to be pro-Israel. Europeans used to be ashamed of their antisemite past. All that has changed. The religious right in America is not big enough to turn the ship of state in Israel's direction indefinitely.

54 posted on 07/22/2006 7:19:52 PM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: ozzymandus

Unfortunately Pat's viewpoint is solely focused on American isolationism and he'll whistle in the wind and cover his eyes until the battle is waged on our shores. Then he'll consider limited action.

He's old and cranky and not liable to want to take the battle to the enemy.
While he recognizes the enemy, he could easily write an article countering his isolanist position.

But we won't see it. Not until it's much too late. Then no one will care what he says. I know at this point I don't.

You either believe the battle must be taken to the enemy or you don't.
And Pat is now in the latter category with all the liberals, leftists, anarchists, Quakers and appeasers.

I wish him a happy retirement.


55 posted on 07/22/2006 7:45:01 PM PDT by romanesq
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To: razzle

You should not count your 90% percentage of Jews as liberal Democrats.
That is unless you are using New York City as your model where original thinking is not permitted or the US as a whole.

The Jews in Israel are most certainly not Liberal Democrats. And they are the Jews who count the most, because they will fight for their survival.


56 posted on 07/22/2006 7:47:16 PM PDT by romanesq
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To: Always A Marine

Excellent analysis of the Pat Buchanan problem. The good news is that the more he talks the more he makes a fool of himself.


57 posted on 07/22/2006 7:57:44 PM PDT by JanetteS (http://CommonSenseRunsWild.com)
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To: Mamzelle
Don't quite agree with you on that one as well.

The fact that Democrats used to be pro-Israel but are no longer - as a broad generalization - has no relevance to US Middle East policy until and unless they are in the White House. Hopefully, that won't happen again in our lifetimes, if ever.

When you claim, "the religious right in America is not big enough to turn the ship of state in Israel's direction indefinitely," that might depend on other factors, assuming the GOP is in control of the executive branch. Those would include: (1) Do Israel's and America's global interests mesh, as they apparently do now - in the common war on terror? (2) Does the religious right retain sufficient political clout within the GOP base to have a strong voice within the future Republican administration? (3) How much influence will other pro-Israel parts of the GOP base - e. g., neocons, the defense establishment, and secular hawks - have on that future administration?

Fortunately, things seemed to be aligned in a direction favorable to Israel right now, and hopefully they can continue that way at least until the war on terror is won.

58 posted on 07/22/2006 9:02:55 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: romanesq

Excellent analysis in both posts # 55 and # 56.


59 posted on 07/22/2006 9:06:38 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: romanesq
re: You should not count your 90% percentage of Jews as liberal Democrats. )))

Well, RReagan got over thirty percent of the Jewish vote. Bush got 25-26%. If there's a less pro-Israel Senator than Kerry...?

76% of the US Jewish vote going for Kerry may not rise to 90%, but when you realize that only 25% are conservative...!

60 posted on 07/22/2006 10:23:17 PM PDT by Mamzelle
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