Feds Hide Social Security Deal With Mexico

My BP is spiking just reading this crap! SOBs!!

Karl Rove and La Raza

Looky, looky, looky:

The National Council of La Raza (NCLR), the largest national Latino civil rights and advocacy organization in the U.S., announced today that former President Bill Clinton, White House Deputy Chief of Staff Karl Rove, and Los Angeles Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa are among the confirmed speakers for the upcoming NCLR Annual Conference which will be held July 8-11 at the Los Angeles Convention Center in Los Angeles, CA.

Can someone tell Rove that speaking at a La Raza Event may not be in the interests of the United States of America. PATHETIC!!

Here's a link to Social Security's take on the matter. http://www.ssa.gov/pressoffice/factsheets/USandMexico-alt.htm
It has some interesting explanations.

>>The Totalization Agreement could allow millions of illegal Mexican workers to draw billions of dollars from the U.S. Social Security Trust Fund.<<

How!?

Have they paid into social security? If so, they are still losing money like all the rest of us.

See post #3 only after you have duct taped your head to keep it from exploding.

Background on La Raza

Can someone tell Rove that speaking at a La Raza Event may not be in the interests of the United States of America.
"May not be"? But it could be. We'll find out when he speaks.

You know he's going to sign it so our only hope at this point is that the house rejects it.

"President Bush has expressed his support for this Agreement, and we believe that regardless of the current immigration debate, his most likely window for signing it is immediately after the 2006 midterm elections when no one is looking,"

Once President Bush approves the agreement, which would be done without congressional vote, either house would have 60 days to disapprove the agreement by voting to reject it.

That being the case, supporters of this agreement should be hoping the Dems recapture the House.

The way this works...because I'm a US citizen working in Germany...is that I get a five year exemption from Germany...to keep paying into the US pot of social security. When that five year exemption runs out...which it did last year for me...I must start paying German social security (which is 2 percent higher than I was paying into the US pot). If I choose to leave Germany...whenever...I can have the money I put into the German pot...transferred over to the US social security side. The plus side is that I still keeping into some pot somewhere.

When you measure the deal with Mexico...which is basically the same deal...I'm guessing that every Mexican in the US refuses the five year exemption deal and immedately starts paying into the US pot. After working 15 years in the US system...you have a tremendous amount of retirement income at 65....compared to what you'd have in Mexico. Would matter if you worked another day in the US after 15 years....that retirement check at 65 would guarantee you a mountain of retirement cash...which you'd never get in Mexico.

As for us losing something out of the system...maybe...but then social security is bankrupt...as is the German social scurity program....and all the rest of these deals. So people can whine all they want...it doesn't make much difference. The only complaint you can make is that this is all part of globalizaion in some fashion. Where it leads to in 30 years will be the interesting part....people who born in one country...then migrate and work in another country....then retire in a 3rd country.

Did you know:
The United States currently has Social Security agreements with Canada, Chile, South Korea, Australia and most of Western Europe."
"Most of Western Europe" includes Italy, Germany, Switzerland, Belgium, Norway, UK, Sweden, France, Spain. Canada is also included. I didn't know any of this.

It's very smart strategy to try to influence a huge voting block. What would you have Rove rather do, tell them to go to hell? Rove has been extremely successful at winning campaigns because he does think like a perturbed little child.

Thanks friend for saving me the time and trouble. Was getting (all worked up) and ready to post this myself.

As a Seasoned Citizen, who is going to be filing for retirement benefits shortly, this is an abomination.

Worse yet, is for you younger Freepers, for while those who are now--or like myself who are about to begin-- collecting, we probably don't have to worry about having our benefits cut off.

However, for younger Americans, there are only two options to consider: Either they will have to pay more in SS withholdings or will [either] have "their" benefits reduced and/or have to wait until a later date (i.e. age 65 or even 67) to begin collecting.

The real shame is the Administration's complicity in this travesty, compounded, by their utter intransigence in their willingness to release the information relevant thereto.

NATIONAL COUNCIL OF LA RAZA
1111 19th Street NW
Suite 1000
Washington, DC
20036

Phone :202-785-1670
URL :http://www.nclr.org/

Largest Hispanic organization in the U.S.
Lobbies for racial preferences, bilingual education, stricter hate crimes laws, mass immigration, and amnesty for illegal aliens
Named as a key member of the Open Borders Lobby in the pamphlet The Open Borders Lobby and the Nation's Security After 9/11, written by William Hawkins and Erin Anderson
Principally funded by the Ford Foundation

Currently the largest Hispanic organization in the U.S., the National Council of La Raza (“the Race”) was established originally in 1968 as the Southwest Council of La Raza, for the purpose of “improv[ing] life opportunities for Hispanic Americans.”The group was initiated by a research project funded by the Ford Foundation. Today La Raza has more than 270 formal affiliates serving 40 states, and a broader nationwide network of more than 30,000 groups and individuals who reach at least 3.5 million Hispanics in the U.S. and Puerto Rico. Notwithstanding this large base of support, more than two-thirds of La Raza’s funding comes from corporations and foundations, and much of the rest stems from government sources. Between 2001 and 2003, the Ford Foundation alone gave La Raza some $9.83 million, including a single grant of $8.05 million.

In turn, each year La Raza grants large amounts of this money to “Hispanic cornmunity-based organizations,” some of which are quite obscure. Of the $1.3 million it gave out in 1996, for instance, $126,000 went to El Hogar del Nifio, $9,000 went to Chicanos por la Causa, and $30,000 was earmarked for Cabrillo Economic Development.

La Raza’s politics are at the far left of the political spectrum. Its Policy Analysis Center lobbies for affirmative action, bilingual education, stricter hate crimes laws, mass immigration, and amnesty for illegal aliens. La Raza characterizes increased immigration control as a violation of civil rights, and the reduction of government handouts to immigrants as “a disgrace to American values.”

La Raza was a signatory – along with more than 120 other leftwing organizations – to a 2000 campaign to increase the minimum wage. La Raza was also a signatory to a March 17, 2003 letter exhorting members of the U.S. Congress “to oppose the Domestic Security Enhancement Act (DSEA), also known as ‘Patriot [Act] II,’” which was then under consideration. These signatories stated that the new legislation “fail[ed] to respect our time-honored liberties,” and “contain[ed] a multitude of new and sweeping law enforcement and intelligence gathering powers . . . that would severely dilute, if not undermine, many basic constitutional rights.” In addition, La Raza has given its organizational endorsement to the Community Resolution to Protect Civil Liberties campaign, a project of the California-based Coalition for Civil Liberties (CCL). The CLL tries to influence city councils to pass resolutions creating Civil Liberties Safe Zones; that is, to be non-compliant with the provisions of the Patriot Act.

La Raza has also endorsed the December 18, 2001 “Statement of Solidarity with Migrants,” which was drawn up by the National Network for Immigrant and Refugee Rights. The statement called upon the U.S. government to “[r]ecognize the contribution of immigrant workers, students, and families, and [to] end discriminatory policies passed on the basis of legal status in the wake of September 11”; to “[g]uarantee and provide relief to the loved ones of the victims and those unemployed in the World Trade Center attacks, regardless of immigration status, without intimidation or threat of deportation”; and to adopt “the Plan of Action from the 2001 UN World Conference Against Racism, Xenophobia, and Related Intolerance” – which was largely a forum for angry anti-American and anti-Israel tirades.

Furthermore, La Raza endorsed the Civil Liberties Restoration Act (CLRA) of 2004, which was introduced by Democratic Senators Ted Kennedy, Patrick Leahy, Russell Feingold, Richard Durbin, and Jon Corzine, and Democratic Representatives Howard Berman and William Delahunt. The CLRA was designed to roll back, in the name of protecting civil liberties, vital national-security policies that had been adopted after the 9/11 terrorist attacks.

La Raza is also a sponsoring organization of the Immigrant Workers Freedom Ride Coalition, which seeks to secure ever-expanding rights and civil liberties protections for undocumented workers, amnesty for illegal immigrants, and policy reforms that diminish or eliminate restrictions on immigration.

In addition to the Ford Foundation, La Raza also receives funding from: the American Express Foundation; the AT&T Foundation; the Carnegie Corporation of New York; the Annie E. Casey Foundation; the Fannie Mae Foundation; the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation; the Joyce Foundation; the W. K. Kellogg Foundation; the John D. & Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation; the Open Society Institute; the David and Lucile Packard Foundation; the Rockefeller Foundation; and the Verizon Foundation.

Per some reports, this Trialization bill would allow the relatives of illegals, no matter where they are in the world, to apply for US Social Security benefits, too.

It is a massive bill.

Who keep selling the US out to Mexican interests????

Specter allowed Levin (IIRC) to insert that amendment into the Senate Immigration bill that mandates Mexico be consulted on border matters.

If the goal is to merge the US, Mexico, and Canada, at least have the cajones to tell the American people --- and give them the opportunity to vote on this, rather than doing it behind our backs, in secret agreements.

Once again, Rove has his head up his ass.

Social Security actuaries estimate that a totalization agreement with Mexico would have a negligible long-range effect on the Trust Funds.
Costs to the U.S. Social Security system are estimated to average about $105 million per year over the first five years. These costs are for additional benefits to eligible U.S. and Mexican workers and reduced Social Security tax contributions under the dual taxation exemption.
To put this in perspective, in 2002, costs to the U.S. system for the existing agreement with Canada were about $197 million.

There is NO way that there's more Canadians working in the US than Mexicans - no freaking way.

So throw that $105 mil in the garbage and triple (at least) the $197 mil paid to Canucks, which is $591 MILLION. There's also no way in HELL that some 30 million Mexicans making minimum wage and below, could ever, ever, ever pay that much INTO the system. Their whole extended family will be sucking the SS system dry in five years - period!

Aztlan's Partisans
By Steve Brown and Chris Coon
FrontPageMagazine.com | September 10, 2003

The fight over what to do with the 8 to 10 million illegal aliens in our country has begun to come to a head, and the advocates for open borders, blanket amnesty and legal rights for those already here appear to be winning. In recent weeks increasing numbers of cities are implementing unlawful sanctuary policies. State officials are pushing for drivers licenses to be issued to illegals. Congress is debating amnesty for the children of aliens and the acceptance of Mexican consular identification cards seems inevitable. The White House is in discussions with Mexico to grant an amnesty for up to 2 million migrant workers. Flying in the face of recent polls that show Americans want tougher enforcement of immigration law, politicians are buckling to the demands of the radical immigrant lobby. And now one of their believers, Cruz Bustamante, is the current front-runner in the California governor's race.

Who are these groups that are able to exert this type of political pressure? What are their motivations and what kind of company do they keep?

Some of the most vocal and active advocacy groups come from the Mexican-American community. They include La Raza (The Race), LULAC (the League of United Latin American Citizens) and MALDEF (The Mexican-American Legal Defense and Education Fund), all of whom fight for civil rights of residents (legal or otherwise) of Latin American decent. In an effort to increase their political base they fight for the acceptance of policies that would all but eliminate the southern border and allow a mass exodus to American shores by illegal aliens.

They all offer the usual mix of “solutions” to the problems they claim face their special interests; from acceptance of the foreign ID cards to the granting of in-state tuition breaks for illegal students to the allowance of government entitlement benefits. Their demands read as a laundry list of budget busting causes and national security nightmares.

Funded largely by leftist organizations, such as the Ford Foundation, these advocacy groups have found common cause with those who call for liberal policies such as Affirmative Action, voting by non-citizens, labor union organization, increased funding for federal programs such as Head Start, Women Infants and Children, increased after-school programs, expansion of Social Security benefits and other welfare initiatives.

Naturally, the Democratic Party is home to those who think this way, but the Green Party, Workers World Party and other neo-Communist political organizations have embraced the concerns of those who wish to destroy our national sovereignty.

"California is going to be a Mexican state; we are going to control all the institutions. If people don't like it they should leave." That chilling warning was given by 1998 Presidential Medal of Freedom recipient and founder of MALDEF, Mario Obeldo. Praised as a great American and a “hero” by then First Lady Hillary Clinton and California Gov. Gray Davis, Obeldo has refused to back down from his racist forecast. Between 1996 and 1998 MALDEF raised over 9 million dollars from the Ford Foundation, the Rockefeller Foundation and the Carnegie Corporation to advance this goal.

MALDEF was key in the gutting of Californian Prop 187, which would have placed restrictions on illegals receiving state social aid. Putting legal and political pressure on Davis, they forced the state into dropping the appeals to overturn the district court decision striking down the referendum. On their website they trumpet their role in the usurpation of the people's power by the courts, “MALDEF is pleased in this victory of basic human and civil rights.”

One of the many goals of MALDEF is to prevent the spread of English-only laws, fighting to keep ineffectual bilingual education programs and multi-lingual election ballots. They have provided legal assistance and amicus briefs in a variety of cases that have resulted in the implementation of “reforms” legislated from the bench.

In a recent policy paper, MALDEF has presented what they call a constitutional argument against the use of local and state police enforcement of federal immigration law. Citing concerns of racial profiling and the disparity of enforcement against Mexican illegals they claim that local law enforcement agencies are not trained to deal with the sensitive nature of protecting the civil rights of naturalized citizens.

“The reason that we don’t want state and local police involved in immigration enforcement…it’s very, very bad for public safety,” MALDEF Immigration Rights Attorney Katherine Culliton told Frontpagemag.com. “If immigrants are afraid that they may get deported, they don’t report crimes. We know of cases of domestic violence where people don’t call. The overwhelming problem is that when immigrants don’t report crimes because they are afraid, then we’re all a lot less safe.”

But Houston Police Officer John Nickell, whose city has a sanctuary policy, disagreed when he testified before the House Judiciary Committee in February:

Here we have a many contradictions within law enforcement itself. First, we know that "undocumented alien" is someone who has either entered this country illegally or has overstayed his or her visa. If an individual is considered an "illegal alien," in any aspect, then we must allow all law enforcement officers to pursue every lawful action when this individual is taken into custody. Second, the Houston Police Department General Order states "we must rely upon the cooperation of all persons." Is it reasonable to even think we can expect cooperation from an individual whose first act in this country was to violate its entry laws? Should we expect cooperation from someone that refuses to adhere to the agreements of their visa and overstays their legal visitation? The third and possibly largest contradiction in this matter is the "pick and choose" type of association with other agencies. Police agencies, nationwide, enthusiastically join with the FBI and Drug Enforcement Agency for drug busts and other high profile cases. However, we refuse to even consider working with the INS for politically expedient and correct reasons.

LULAC, one of the oldest Mexican-American associations began as a pro-American, pro-citizenship patriotic group. Up until the late 1950's they called for assimilation to the “Anglo” culture and acceptance of English as the primary language of the United States. But the radical politics of the 1960's and the need to compete with more liberal groups like La Raza for funding from the major foundations led to a 180 degree turn in their mission. Supporting the deportation of illegal Mexicans during President Eisenhower's “Operation: Wetback” in the 50's, LULAC displayed the understanding that the flood of illegals to our nation lowered the opportunities for those who came here legally. In contrast José Velez, the head of LULAC 1990-1994 used his “special status with the INS” to submit false papers for over 6,000 illegals seeking amnesty. He reportedly made millions of dollars from this action, fleecing those he claimed to represent and earning himself a conviction for 10 counts of immigration fraud.

Today, LULAC embraces the race-based initiatives popular in the liberal community, allied with groups such as Jesse Jackson's Rainbow/PUSH coalition and the American Civil Liberties Union, they seek to expand and protect affirmative action programs and the expansion of legal rights and “economic justice” for the millions of Latin illegals living here.

La Raza, perhaps the most influential Latino rights group, formed by the Ford Foundation in 1968, uses a combination of foundation grants and government subsidies to conduct its Policy Analysis Center, a clearing house for radical ideas to be promoted within the Hispanic community. They have made it clear in the past that they will not hesitate to seek reprisals against elected officials that fail to support their positions, which include the right to vote by illegal residents. While demanding the blanket amnesty for illegals from Central America they warned “elected officials should not be surprised if their failure to act on reforms of these terribly unjust laws is met with a firm response at the ballot box.''

Since 9/11 they have cooperated with Arab and Muslim groups such as the American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee and the Arab American Institute to protest the deportation of those Arabs found to be here illegally, as well as socialist/Marxist groups such as Refuse&Resist!, a protest organization that equates the detention and deportation of those in our country illegally with concentration camps in Nazi Germany. They compare those lawfully arrested and deported with the “disappeared” political prisoners of banana republics. The level of rhetoric would be amusing, were they not so deadly serious in undermining Homeland Security.

Their motto reveals much about the cause they represent; “Por La Raza Todo, Fuera de La Raza Nada." ("For the Race, Everything; Outside the Race, Nothing.")

All three of these groups have fought the will of the majority and spoken out against protective measures such as the Patriot Act.

“One of our major concerns is that immigration will be seen through the eyes of terrorism,” MALDEF’s Culliton said. “We know that not all terrorists are immigrants and that terrorists could be citizens or immigrants, so it doesn’t make sense to make immigration the issue. Since September 11, more than 60 measures have been taken against immigrants, including Latino immigrants…such as firing people from their jobs in the airports if they weren’t citizens, although it’s fine if they serve in the war, and not one has resulted in finding any terrorists. That’s proof of our point.” It is?

Less interested in bringing about change through simple social action, a fourth Mexican identity group has far grander designs. MEChA, Movimiento Estudiantil Chicano de Aztlan (or Chicano Student Movement of Aztlán) is a Latino neo-Marxist organization with chapters supported by tax dollars and student funds and operating out of local high schools, as well as some of the most prestigious state and private colleges in the nation. Most Cal State colleges have chapters. Stanford University, Mills College, Yale, MIT and Georgetown host chapters as well. In all, MEChA has chapters in more than 15 states and the District of Columbia. And Cruz Bustamante, California's Lt. Governor and the lone Democrat in the recall race, has long been associated with the organization as a member and sympathetic politician.

They have been active in fighting the California referendum Prop 187, as well as seeking the abolition of Bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement (formerly INS), and the eliminating the border with Mexico entirely. They honor Mexican revolutionary war hero Ernesto Zapata and Cuban revolutionary Che Guevara.

Their most chilling demand is the call for “La Reconquista” or the retaking of the Southwestern states (Arizona, California, Colorado, Nevada, New Mexico, Texas, and Utah) to form an independent nation called “Aztlan”.

Equating the 1848 Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo which ended the two-year Mexican War and granted the United States control over Texas and other parts of the Southwest with the outright theft of their land, the MEChA members believe they are justified in demanding the territories be returned to them.

On Fox News Channel’s “O'Reilly Factor,” MEChA chair Ron Gochez detailed their scheme regarding what they call the “stolen land.”

“This is indigenous land. This is native land, you know, Mexicano land,” Gochez asserted. Asked by O'Reilly “If I gave you Arizona would you be happy with that?” Gotchez replied “They took a lot more than Arizona.”

Miguel Perez, representative of he Cal State Northridge MEChA chapter has stated that the form of government preferred would be “closest to communist”, and the expulsion of non-Chicanos would be a priority. “Opposition groups would be quashed because you have to keep the power.” Perez has stated.

Their manifesto, EL PLAN DE AZTLÁN, paints a disturbing picture. Using revolutionary rhetoric lifted straight from Marx and Stalin, they make clear who they consider their enemies. The plan begins, “In the spirit of a new people that is conscious not only of its proud historical heritage but also of the brutal 'gringo' invasion of our territories...Aztlán belongs to those who plant the seeds, water the fields, and gather the crops and not to the foreign Europeans.”

Calling for unity of all the “brothers” of the “bronze continent,” they seek a nationalist movement: “Nationalism as the key to organization transcends all religious, political, class, and economic factions or boundaries. Nationalism is the common denominator that all members of La Raza can agree upon.” Neglecting the differences in Hispanic nations of origin or the difference in various Indian populations within Mexico and the American Southwest, they cling to a false nationality comprised of “bronze” skinned peoples.

Their economic model is a mix of nationalistic Marxism, stating that their “cultural background” will “contribute to the act of cooperative buying and the distribution of resources and production. Land and realty ownership will be acquired by the community for the people's welfare. Economic ties of responsibility must be secured by nationalism and the Chicano defense units.”

Their goal is clearly spelled out: to “drive the exploiter out of our community and a welding together of our people’s combined resources to control their own production through cooperative effort.”

MEChA also calls for reparations, asking for “Restitution for past economic slavery, political exploitation, ethnic and cultural psychological destruction and denial of civil and human rights.” The manifesto seeks to repaint “acts of juvenile delinquency” as political “revolutionary” acts.

Recognizing the fact that under current immigration and population trends Latinos will soon occupy the majority in the targeted states they warn “Where we are a majority, we will control.”

The former speaker of the California Assembly, Antonio Villaraigoza was a member of MEChA during his studies at UCLA in the 70's. While head of one of the most powerful state bodies in the country, he pushed for and advocated policies that grant rights to illegals. His dual loyalty is clear, and he is not alone.

Other former members of this radical student group hold positions of power in California. Lt Governor, and new candidate for governor in the recall election of Gray Davis, Cruz Bustamante was a member of MEChA during his years at Fresno State University. Often described as a moderate Democrat, Bustamante has enjoyed a rather non-controversial reputation. “I wasn't the most radical Mechista.” he has claimed. How reassuring.

At a press conference to discuss immigration reform for California, then a state assemblyman representing the Fresno area Bustamante caused a stir when he stated "We could not conduct business without the immigrant." Reporters, looking for clarification asked if he was referring to illegal immigration. Many were shocked at his answer. "My district requires it [illegal immigration]." Fresno, a large farming community in southern California draws a majority of its workers from south of the boarder. Following that uproar he limited press conferences regarding the issue to Spanish language media.

MEChA has led demonstrations calling for state legislatures to enact laws and proclamations decrying the federal government’s current immigration policy, and this anti-American seditionist organization has spoken out against what they claim are unfair deportations resulting from the 9/11 attacks. Often they are joined by other “progressive” student groups who do not seem phased by the racist call to rid these states of Anglos. Chapters have enjoyed the support of groups such as the Filipino American Student Organization, the Black Student Union, Free Mumia, the Coalition/Anti-Racist Action, and Commission of the Michigan Student Assembly (MSA), the National Lawyers Guild, the Caribbean People's Association and the International Socialist Organization. Dozens more student ethnic-identity and left-wing groups have demonstrated with MEChA for common causes such as Affirmative Action.

As has been clearly shown, these "dissident" organizations, backed by large donations from groups such as the Ford Foundation, or worse by our own tax dollars constitute a united front to destroy the very freedoms that define our nation and sets United States citizenship as the unique, special status it has earned throughout the globe. Wishing it away will not stave off the mounting storm, nor will reliance of politicians whose career ambitions preclude them from any serious preventive initiative. Unless some widespread groundswell of public opinion or grassroots activism rises to thwart this juggernaut dedicated to tearing down our borders, we could wake up one day to 14 percent of our nation gone, usurped by a racist state called Aztlan.

Per some reports,
It would seem to me that the rules for Mexico in this deal would have to be the same as those for persons in the nations I listed in post #11. Can relatives of people of those countries do what you say? Seems like we need some facts here.

An after thought: Just how many of the estimated (depending on who's numbers are accurate) 12 - 20 million Illegals in the US have "VALID" Social Security numbers?

Duh!!

If they do, how did they get them?

And for the ones who don't (which I am going to assume are the majority) just HOW, can they claim benefits when they retire?

I hope the answers are in the report the State Dept and SS Admin are refusing to release and we somehow (Where are the leakers/whistelblowers when we really need them) get to see it?