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To: Dawnsblood
The italicized comments below are factually wrong on every point. That anyone could state them only demonstrates his own historical and theological ignorance or polemical intent. Obviously the writer has "a host of ideas and assumptions that [he] obviously drew from."

Go back to school, Dean. Get back with us when you've become sufficiently well-educated.

Understanding the Bible Dean In the first few centuries of Christianity, no one had any idea that there was anything called a "Bible." Indeed, at that time, there was no Bible. That didn't happen until the 3rd or 4th century, depending on how you look at it.
They knew the Law and the Prophets and considered, even in Paul and Peter's day, the writings of Paul to be as authoritative as any other Jewish scripture. The entire New Testament can be assembled from quotations in the writings of the ante-Nicene Fathers and were considered as authoritative scripture from the earliest days.


Most early Christians were probably illiterate. Indeed, it is very likely that many of the original Apostles were illiterate. There is even evidence in the New Testament that Peter, Paul, and the other apostles were illiterate. Peter and Paul and the other New Testament writers often seem to be dictating to someone rather than writing for themsleves. All you have to do is read the beginnings of most of the New Testament books to see that.
And people used to assume that the story about Moses couldn't have been true because no one could write back then. Ooops, then they found slaves' graffitti and realized their assumptions were wrong. People with alphabetic writing could read and write quite easily. And someone who is very busy has a secretary to whom he dictates letters? That is evidence of illiteracy? No, it's just evidence of sloppy thinking.

Yet they all had a host of ideas and assumptions that they obviously drew from.
Examine your own, Dean. You'll then have a chance of becoming enlightened.

Until Martin Luther in the 1500s said that the Bible was the wellspring of Christianity, no Christian ever believed such a thing about the Bible.
This is simply untrue.

1. As Peter wrote in a rustic Greek as befits a literate fisherman:
"Bear in mind that our Lord's patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction."--II Peter 3:15-17
2. As the extremly well-educated Paul said:
a. "For everything that was written in the past was written to teach us, so that through endurance and the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope."--Romans 15:4

b. "By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain." [Gee, this sounds sort of well-springy to me]

"For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures...."--1 Cor 1:2-4

c. "But as for you [Timothy], continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, and how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness...."--II Timothy 3:14-16

d. And last, but not least, from Jesus as quoted by someone who knew him well, as he confronted the ones who would later subcontract with Rome to kill him:

"You diligently study the Scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life."

"Your accuser is Moses, on whom your hopes are set. If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me. But since you do not believe what he wrote, how are you going to believe what I say?"--John 5:39-40, 45-47 [This sounds pretty much well-springy, too]
So where do modern American Evangelicals get this idea, do you think?
Uh, from the same place that Luther and everyone else in Christianity back to the beginning got them, from the Bible.

36 posted on 07/02/2006 5:05:19 AM PDT by aruanan
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To: aruanan

d. should be 3.


37 posted on 07/02/2006 5:09:23 AM PDT by aruanan
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