Another “No Amnesty” Amnesty

National Review ^ | June 13, 2006, 6:32 a.m. | Mark Krikorian

[dalereed]

The illegal employers, at least in construction, will make sure your #6 & #7 will never happen. Cash wages save them over 100%.

[stephenjohnbanker]

Well, so much for conservative credentials.................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

[roverman2K6]

No deal. At this point any law they pass will make things worse. Just talking about Amnesty caused more illegals to run here.
This would be the most costly thing ever undertaken in the history of the US.
It would be far better to Annex Mexico and use the money to rebuild their infrastructure and add the natural resources to the mix

[GrandEagle]

I found the proposal to be interesting.
Personally, I don't like allowing those who have proven they have no respect for the law to stay, however I will concede that we will not win that issue at all. This proposal requires everyone who wishes to be legally in the country to go home before getting the necessary documents to enter legally. This would serve to get, I just guessing here, half the criminals to register.
I doubt very seriously if the private sector will comply very easily because the advantage to hiring illegals is that you don't have to abide by the labor laws. This part will not change without debilitating consequences. Fines are minor because of the substantial savings of hiring illegals.
Another issue is having current employers "smooth the way" by getting all the paperwork done ahead of time. They are supposed to try and hire US workers first. Not going to happen; again for the same reason. There is no shortage of US workers. What there is a shortage of is workers who are willing to work for $4.00 and hour with no benefits, and no social security paid, in a job that normally pays $10.00 an hour.
Having said this, I will agree that it is probably the best we can hope for. At least we will get 50-55% registered.
I disagree intensely with removing the part that makes it a felony to enter illegally. I also believe that, in addition to debilitating fines for hiring illegals, those responsible should also be criminally charged with aiding and abetting a felon.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Here we go again.

FReepers really need to read Pence's plan and stop with the disingenious comments about it. And learn how to play poker.

- Pence's plan is nearly identical to Tom Tancredo's own plan

- Pence's plan passes HR 4437 in its entirety and certifies the borders are secured BEFORE any guest-worker provision begins

- Senate isn't going to pass an enforcement-only bill, and the House will never accept the Senate's AMNESTY plan. Hence, the reason for conference calls and negotiations (which some FReepers don't understand in their black-and-white cocoons)

- Pence's plan calls the Senate/Bush administration's bluff and forces them, on record, to either back the guest-worker provision or reject the bill outright, in which case they'll look like fools and get PWN3D at the polls

- Pence's plan is NOT an amnesty, nope, nada, zilch path to citizenship for illegals. Guest-worker provision is strictly enforced with no guarantees of completing the full six-year term as outlined by Pence.

- Illegals have to go home and apply for guest-worker cards. Dept of Labor regulates the number of guest-workers per year. There won't be 12-20 million people applying for guest-worker permits.

FREEPERS NEED TO TAKE THE 90%, WHICH SEALS AND MANAGES THE BORDERS NOW AND STFU OR KEEP WHINING ABOUT NOT GETTING THEIR PRECIOUS 100% BORDER ENFORCEMENT-ONLY.

[dennisw]

If Mark Krikorian say the Mike Pence bill is bllsht then it's bllsht. Mark is a very honest longtime critic of the immigration invasion

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

What will be the course of action when the illegals don't leave?

Borders are secured under Pence's plan. Interior enforcement is stepped up. Jobs will dry up. Illegals will go home to get a chance at obtaining a guest-worker permit.

Granted, they won't get a GW card. But, what will the feds do to those who don't sign onto the program?

Once they're apprehended they get deported without any chance of ever coming back into the country.

We can't round them up because they haven't registered.

Who says anything about "rounding up" illegals? Illegals will self-deport under the Pence plan. The hard-working illegals who just want to work will self-deport to get a crack at a guest-worker permit. The gang-banger MS-13 illegals will be rounded up and deported due to stricter interior enforcement.

Under Pence's proposal, how will we deal with these lawbreakers when they don't play the game according to Pence's rules? (Or, Bush's. Or, McCain's)

They get deported and barred from future contact with the U.S.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

I too see this as another form of "shamnesty" but I'm curious if Pence has said anything specifically about the fraudulent use of documents that these people have been using over the years. Wink and a nod?

Private companies will have better security measures for guest-workers than the federal bureaucracy.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

No deal. At this point any law they pass will make things worse.

Pence's plan modernizes immigration laws and forces the administration to enforce them.

Just talking about Amnesty caused more illegals to run here.

There is no amnesty under the Pence plan, for the millionth time. The borders must be certified secured (HR 4437) before any guest-worker provision begins.

This would be the most costly thing ever undertaken in the history of the US.

It is the most cost-effective, common-sense immigration proposal put forth. Pence's plan seals the borders and simultaneously deals with the what-to-do-with-the-illegals already here problem. A master stroke.

It would be far better to Annex Mexico and use the money to rebuild their infrastructure and add the natural resources to the mix

Why don't we just annex Central and South America too while we're at it.

Dude, have you been drinking?

[GrandEagle]

Pence's plan is NOT an amnesty
I would disagree with this assessment. It allows the criminals to check first and see if they can legally get amnesty. Then if they can, they make a short trip across the border to pick up their paperwork and bingo they are right back in. It is amnesty with a twist.
HOWEVER, I do agree with you in that it is probably the very best we will get, and for the 50-60% that do actually become legal, it will help keep up with them. It also seems to give us most of what we want to close the border (however the skeptic in me doesn't really believe that the globalist will actually close it). I do wish that it would continue to make invading our nation a felony. However, given the current political climate, and the lack of hope of getting anything better, I'll - with reservations, jump on board.

Cordially,
GE

[Ol' Dan Tucker]

Borders are secured under Pence's plan. Interior enforcement is stepped up. Jobs will dry up. Illegals will go home to get a chance at obtaining a guest-worker permit.

Hel-lo... Enforcement is what the executive branch says it is, not the legislative branch.

We've already got tough laws. They just aren't being enforced.

Perhaps you could explain the shortcomings in the existing immigration laws that needs reforming?

[editor-surveyor]

All they have to do is start punishing the employers, and the rest will happen automatically.

[TheLion]

The Government can't even stop the millions of overstayed visas in this country, how can any new progam have any chance.

We already have laws, and they should be enforced first.