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Evolution Ruling Tossed Out in Georgia
Atlanta Journal - Constitution ^ | 5/26/06 | Kristina torres, Bill Rankin

Posted on 05/25/2006 7:02:37 PM PDT by Hoodat

The federal appeals court in Atlanta on Thursday declined to rule on the constitutionality of controversial Cobb County evolution disclaimers because the court said it did not have enough information to make the decision.

The ruling was the latest twist in a nationally watched case that has raised questions of local authority over schools and whether Cobb's sticker -- which called evolution "a theory, not a fact" -- runs afoul of the First Amendment.

The ruling means more arguments from lawyers and, perhaps, a new trial.

-snip-

The 11th Circuit noted that all parties in the case agree that some evidence presented to Cooper during a four-day trial is now missing. "The problems presented by a record containing significant evidentiary gaps are compounded because at least some key findings of the district court are not supported by the evidence that is contained in the record," Judge Ed Carnes wrote.

(Excerpt) Read more at ajc.com ...


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events; US: Georgia
KEYWORDS: 11thcircuit; 11thcircuitcourt; cobbcounty; creation; crevo; crevolist; evolution; fakebutaccurate; georgia; intelligentdesign; lyingleftists; ruling; scienceeducation
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To: ModerateGOOPer
A lot of dumb people in Cobb County Georgia are trying to make sure their kids grow up dumb, too.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

No matter what any government decides regarding evolution or ID, that government WILL establish and uphold the worldview of some ( with religious consequences) while actively undermining the most cherished family traditions of others ( with religious consequences).

Also remember that for most parents and children government schools are not voluntary. They are compulsory. Funding them is compulsory as well. Armed police stand ready to enforce the will of the government and religious or non-religious belief traditions be damned.

The solution is to begin the process of privatizing universal K-12 education.
41 posted on 05/25/2006 10:14:19 PM PDT by wintertime (Good ideas win! Why? Because people are not stupid.)
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To: durasell
Savannah is really only hot in the summer.

I'm actually not all that sure that evolution has taken place in Savannah, Georgia.

42 posted on 05/25/2006 10:14:20 PM PDT by Alter Kaker ("Whatever tears one sheds, in the end one always blows one's nose." - Heine)
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To: AndrewC

And these are the guys who are making decisions for us in our best interest because they know better than the rest of us? No thanks.


43 posted on 05/25/2006 10:14:38 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: RunningWolf

Thanks. I'll check it out tomorrow,...er... later today.


44 posted on 05/25/2006 10:15:31 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Alter Kaker

Then why haven't the rest of the animals lost their fur?


45 posted on 05/25/2006 10:16:19 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: durasell

Actually, America rose to prominence in the world of science before the Supreme Court imposed the Lemon Test. The idea that we'll fall behind the Chinese, Indians, etc., because of failure to teach evolution as fact, as opposed to theory, seems rather silly.

The Chinese & Indians may be laughing at our educational system, but it's because our system is obsessed with egalitarianism, political correctness, diversity, and other such nonsense, which is mostly brought to us by the same people (ACLU, People for the American Way) who went to court to get those stickers thrown out.


46 posted on 05/25/2006 10:30:28 PM PDT by puroresu (Conservatism is an observation; Liberalism is an ideology)
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To: puroresu

There's a politically incorrect saying among academics in science these days that's whispered at symposiums and alike. It is: American universities exist to transfer scientific knowledge from old Jewish men to young Asians.

At present time we're tearing every level of our educational institutions apart with meaningless debate. This ranges from calls to eliminate public education and/or starve it of funds to idiocy like the sticker controversy and teaching kids about gay guys.

Meanwhile, on the other side of the globe, there are just a whole lot of people who aren't distracted. Americans take their scientific supremacy for granted, just like their took their car manufacturing supremacy for granted.

Science will march on, with or without America in the lead.


47 posted on 05/25/2006 10:39:49 PM PDT by durasell (!)
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To: metmom; durasell
"The Chinese, Indians, and every other country positioning themselves for 21st scientific dominance are In stitches over this stuff"

What another idiotic meaningless fluff pronouncement from an FR evo, yes one of the towering intelligentsia weighing there /sarc> That is just plain pathetic. It means nothing.

About these Chinese, Indians, and every other countries 'scientists' from the rest of the world that are supposedly positioning themselves to advance beyond the US..,

Where have they actually gave an indication of ever doing that? Everything we see is either a copy of US technology, and/or fabricated/falsified, or the US has decided it is not technologically economically feasible at this time IOW they have not.

Wolf
48 posted on 05/25/2006 10:40:15 PM PDT by RunningWolf (Vet US Army Air Cav 1975)
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To: Virginia-American

You stated that 99% of biologists think the theory of evolution is correct. I'm willing to accept your word on that. But how many of those biologists believe evolution is God's method of creation? That is, how many believe in theistic evolution (evolution guided by God) as opposed to purely naturalistic evolution (evolution which God has nothing whatsoever to do with)? Do you know of any surveys of biologists which show those numbers?


49 posted on 05/25/2006 10:43:56 PM PDT by puroresu (Conservatism is an observation; Liberalism is an ideology)
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To: RunningWolf

Nixon visited China in 1972. 34 years later they are our third largest creditor and we're running a massive trade surplus. These guys aren't fooling around and they know exactly where the future is to be found...


50 posted on 05/25/2006 10:49:41 PM PDT by durasell (!)
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To: durasell

I don't see any problem at all with that sticker. Constitutionally it's absurd to find any problem with it. Scientifically, do you really think anyone's GPA or SAT score will suffer any loss because of that sticker?

America rose to world prominence in science BEFORE we had all these ludicrous federal court rulings secularizing the public schools, or ordering schools to teach evolution as a fact while barring alternatives from being discussed.

Our educational system is collapsing largely because of the activities of the very people who want those stickers removed. Teacher's unions, federal judges, the ACLU, People for the American Way, and the whole liberal crowd.


51 posted on 05/25/2006 10:53:28 PM PDT by puroresu (Conservatism is an observation; Liberalism is an ideology)
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To: puroresu
America rose to world prominence in science BEFORE we had all these ludicrous federal court rulings secularizing the public schools, or ordering schools to teach evolution as a fact while barring alternatives from being discussed.

Our educational system is collapsing largely because of the activities of the very people who want those stickers removed. Teacher's unions, federal judges, the ACLU, People for the American Way, and the whole liberal crowd.


Bump and double bump.

Wolf
52 posted on 05/25/2006 10:58:23 PM PDT by RunningWolf (Vet US Army Air Cav 1975)
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To: RunningWolf

Read between the lines of this press release issued by the chinese gubmint...

Govt to increase investment for scientific research(12/22/05)


China plans to increase the proportion of funds for scientific and technological research and development from 1.44 percent of its GDP in 2004 to 2.5 percent in2020, said a white paper released in Beijing on Dec.22.

"China must rely on itself to solve the problems in its development," and "it is an important principle that guarantees that China will follow the road of peaceful development," said the white paper, titled "China's Peaceful Development Road" and published by the Information Office of the State Council, China's cabinet.

In promoting scientific and technological progress and strengthening the ability of independent innovation, China has made medium and long-term plans, setting forth the objectives and tasks for the next 15 years, the white paper said.

Meanwhile, the paper said China will unswervingly push forward reform in all aspects, enhance marketization of its national economy and establish institutions and mechanisms conducive to an overall, coordinated and sustainable economic and social development.

China keeps up its driving force to maintain sustained economic development through its huge domestic demand and domestic market, which has "determined that China should, and most likely, rely mainly on domestic demand for its development," said the white paper.

As for strengthening the human resources, the paper said, from 2006 to 2010, the secondary vocational schools will train 25 million graduates, and the higher vocational schools, 11 million. The enrollment rate of China's institutions of higher learning will reach 40 percent by 2020.

"China is not only a big energy consuming country, but also a big energy producing one," said the paper. Since the 1990s, China has obtained 90 percent or more of its energy from domestic sources.

In its environmental protection efforts, China persists in putting precautionary measures first in its development, the papersaid.




53 posted on 05/25/2006 10:58:57 PM PDT by durasell (!)
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To: puroresu

teacher unions have been around for a long time. So has the ACLU.

The thing that's collapsing the schools is an unwillingness to pay for them for whatever reason.


54 posted on 05/25/2006 11:01:48 PM PDT by durasell (!)
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To: durasell

China's indeed a threat to us, but not because their Communist government believes in evolution. Every Communist regime believes in evolution (yes, Stalin was an evolutionist, though he believed in a variant form of evolution that didn't rely on natural selection), but most of them go belly-up financially and lag behind scientifically. China's leadership is changing all that by dumping socialism for capitalism. That's why they're now a threat to us in the worlds of finance, business, science, and technology.

It has nothing at all to do with any desire in America to allow alternatives to evolution to be discussed in science class. In fact, the courts haven't allowed that to happen in decades (Dover being a recent reaffirmation of the Lemon policy) and it's been during those very decades that the Chinese have gained ground on us.
I'm not saying we lost ground to the Chinese because of the Lemon test. Just that dumping Lemon and allowing alternatives to evolution to be discussed wouldn't have any negative impact whatsoever on our scientific standing in the world.


55 posted on 05/25/2006 11:08:38 PM PDT by puroresu (Conservatism is an observation; Liberalism is an ideology)
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To: RunningWolf

Thanks!


56 posted on 05/25/2006 11:09:34 PM PDT by puroresu (Conservatism is an observation; Liberalism is an ideology)
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To: durasell
Civilizations/cultures wax and wane ebb and prosper, that is the nature of the world.

Yes Nixon visited China in 1972, that is quite a leap you made there. You left out a few pieces for sure.

No one knows the future on global levels. Some have a vision of a world they want to see. As to the millions getting 'science degrees' only certain personalities would believe that their vision of the future is its reality.

Wolf
57 posted on 05/25/2006 11:13:20 PM PDT by RunningWolf (Vet US Army Air Cav 1975)
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To: durasell

How radical were teacher's unions fifty years ago? How much influence did the ACLU have on our public schools fifty years ago?

As much as some people around here might desire to blame our educational system's decline on "Bible-thumping fundies", it's hard to think of a single harmful thing they've ever done to our schools.

However, entire books could be written on the damage the left has done to our schools.


58 posted on 05/25/2006 11:14:21 PM PDT by puroresu (Conservatism is an observation; Liberalism is an ideology)
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To: RunningWolf; puroresu

I apologize, I haven't made myself clear. Let me very clearly state my position on the stickers, fundies, liberals, etc.

I don't care. I really don't. Remember the scene in The Fugitive where Tommy Lee Jones says, "I don't care..."? That's me when it comes to this stuff.

What I do care about (passionately) is the U.S. losing its edge because of all this nonsense. This stuff drains time and diminishes the credibility of these institutions.


59 posted on 05/25/2006 11:23:11 PM PDT by durasell (!)
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To: metmom
Then why haven't the rest of the animals lost their fur?

Some have, others haven't. Compare elephants with wooly mammoths. It depends on what's best in their niche.

60 posted on 05/25/2006 11:49:12 PM PDT by Alter Kaker ("Whatever tears one sheds, in the end one always blows one's nose." - Heine)
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