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To: dirtboy
"But the rhetoric clearly escalated once the legislative process started."

I disagree there. The escalation of the rhetoric, especially after the ports deal, is what prompted the legislation. You'll remember the states which refused to cooperate with the Fed on "students" who came here, went to one or two classes but were AWOL for the rest of the terms even after their student visas had long expired? Or the mayor who ordered city cops not to cooperate with the INS (I'm pretty sure it was still the INS then) when they wanted to do a sweep of illegals? Sure, we were sweeping for terrorists...that's evil now, too....but a lot of illegal, non-terrorist Mexicans would have been swept up in it too just because they're illegal and that would have been a GOOD thing for us.

A lot of us on FR were outraged then, but nowhere near as outraged as some of us have suddenly become with just Mexicans. Otherwise, we might have been able to force our local governments to cooperate with the Fed a couple of years ago, which would have resulted in more immigration reforms a LOT sooner.

And what about the fence which keeps getting tied up in court with frivolous lawsuits over whether it'll interfere with the migration of the Mexican Spotted Owl or whatever and the lack of drinking fountains and porta potties for illegals? Where was the support for the Fed against the wackhjobs? It was non-existant, because people were too busy screaming about the lack of a fence to support it. It makes no sense.

Why do we hold governors who pass E.O.'s and sign Legitimate (I mean having been passed by dure under, under the rules of parlaimentary procudure, by durly elected representatives) legislation accountable for things like tuition breaks, driver's licensing - which brings us to motor the voter insanity which my commonwealth has just voted to keep, BTW - and forget that abuse of state's rights is part of the reason the fed can't fully enforce the law even when they try to?

I've read a lot of your posts over the years, and you and I have a lot of common ground on this issue. I'm trying to point out that if we degenerate into tactics which cloud the real issues and prevent real solutions from being implimented, we ALL LOSE.

I mean...when someone is shrieking in your ear, are you going to listen earnestly to whatever argument they're currently making in their newest attempt to win the entire argument or break your eardrum, or are you going to plug the offended ear and instinctively get ready to swat the individual shrieking in your ear? Because that's what the entire border debate has turned into since a little before the ports deal.

3,027 posted on 05/18/2006 1:25:34 PM PDT by cake_crumb (Drugs? Illegals? Legalize and Tax 'Em All, Right? Right??)
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To: cake_crumb
I've read a lot of your posts over the years, and you and I have a lot of common ground on this issue. I'm trying to point out that if we degenerate into tactics which cloud the real issues and prevent real solutions from being implimented, we ALL LOSE.

I agree. But I have discussed this with other serious-minded freepers as well, and we're all puzzled why Bush just can't table the guest worker program for a year or two and see if improved border security can work. His refusal to do this is what is driving the rift.

3,031 posted on 05/18/2006 1:31:49 PM PDT by dirtboy (An illegal immigrant says my tagline used to be part of Mexico)
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