Posted on 05/15/2006 4:13:02 PM PDT by devane617
Edited on 05/15/2006 4:38:26 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
I searched but did not see a thread already open for tonights speech. I think this is the most important speech the President will probably make for the remainder of his term.
Mod Note:
This could turn into a whack-a-troll thread. All immigration trolls that would like to participate should post here. It'll be interesting to see if we mods can whack the trolls faster than they can sign up new accounts.
Jim
Closed minds, determined to create their own truths.
You should get together with the others who oppose this who say there is no jobs americans can't do. If there's no jobs americans can't do, then certainly we can do the job of policing a guest worker program.
It's got to be easier than capturing and deporting 12 million, or 20 million,people.
This is exactly right. This is where both the President and Congress completely fail to have true compassion for their constituents and for the illegal aliens.
There is no compassion in filling a man's stomach or his pocketbook by relieving him of his responsibilities in life. Illegal aliens have abandoned their own house in order to be comfortable in ours. By so doing neither can be the master of his own house and both will be enemies in the street. This is our house, the U.S. of A., and it is our responsibility to set the rules in it.
The issue of a guest worker program is separate from the issue of illegal aliens. If illegal aliens take jobs from Americans (and they do) they take even more jobs from foreign nationals who apply by the legal route to work here and wait years for the chance. Illegal aliens steal that chance from them.
They are different groups of people, regardless of their country of origin, and the political issues that concern them are different in their effects and needs. Confusing the two may be lethal to our society, economy and sovereignty.
We already have a guest worker program, which may indeed need to be reformed. But illegal aliens are those who have not applied to be guest workers. There are 11 million of them by some estimates, 20 million by others. The only thing needing reform concerning illegal aliens is to enforce the existing laws respecting their presence and their employment here. Our sovereignty and rule-of-law demand it.
Border security is the number one problem in this debate. The flood of illegal aliens is a major factor in relation to our lack of border security but it is only one factor. There is also a matter of national security in a time of war and in an age when terrorists have set their sights on inflicting mass destruction on our society.
After the issues of border security and millions of illegal foreign nationals on our soil the matter of guest workers is very small in comparison. Until the first two problems are thoroughly and firmly addressed the guest worker issue should not even be discussed.
The President and the Senate need to get that message with unambiguous resolve.
The best methods to control the border have been studied and debated for a long time now. There are many good ideas and proven solutions. What is lacking is only the will to do it. The cost of controlling our borders will be insignificant compared to the price we will pay, both in security and economy, if we do not.
It would be nice to help everyone in the world lift themselves up out of poverty. But we cannot take that responsibility upon ourselves especially if we ignore our own welfare to the point that we are no longer prosperous.
Other nations of the world have an obligation to help their citizens every bit as much as we have to help ours. It is one thing to help other nations prosper it is quite another to relieve them of their own responsibilities. Beyond that it is simply not realistic to think that poverty can be ended around the world. We still have some in this great nation.
We must stop pandering to American employers who criminally employ illegal foreign nationals. Dry up the jobs and illegal foreign nationals will go home. Home where they can do what they must to put their house in order just as we must put ours in order.
Which he appeared to do.
I did.
Hodar, what percentage of American businesses do you wish to bankrupt? How many of the Fortune 500? What percentage of hotels, restaurants, construction companies do you want to bankrupt?
You're talking like an idiot. Intentionally fining American corporations into bankruptcy.
That's just too stupid to argue with.
Great post...thanks!
Ditto to your tag line.
Pity!
And if the truth is too emotional for you to handle, then more's the pity.
Employers would be forced to pay higher salaries and the price of certain goods and services would rise if illegals were expelled or greatly reduced in number. The market would adjust accordingly. The increased costs must be offset by the lower taxes that would result from the lesser need for taxpayer funded social services such as schools, health care, etc. Most illegals pay little in the way of taxes, yet are a major expense due to the need to educate their children, take care of their critical medical needs, etc.
Additionally, America is a nation with defined borders and a culture. Uncontrolled immigration makes a mockery of the borders and, in many places, overwhelms the culture with a Third World environment.
Oh great post. I will have to read that blog more often. I think he is right on in some respects. Especially as to Michelle Malkin. People forget what people like Malkin and others represent and what there purpose is. They represent at times a extreme viewpoint thats helpful. The extremes are helpful in clarifying the boundaries of the issue are and helps the process along. But heck, nowadays people are posting ,or on TV NEWS, have Michelle Malkin and other bloggers and pundits like they are God Blessed Wall Street Journal, The NYT , and the Torah all wrapped up into one. If they say it it must be true.
This is a good proposal. We are closer to a true good bill on immigration reform than I ever imagined at the start of this debate. OF course the problem won't t magically go away if the bill passes but its a good start.
IN the end this President is showing leadership. He knew this would be unpopular but he is not shying away from it. Thats a real leader to me.
"The "rabid conservatives" here who have successfully disrupted the forum don't generally post on other "conservative" threads."
The "spineless RINO's" here who have successfully disrupted this CONSERVATIVE forum don't generally post on other "conservative" threads, thank goodness.
I am not as intrested in what he says. I'm want to see WHAT HE DOES
Yes
Carl Sandburg could not have said it better.
Did you think it was a good thing that so many morons voted for Ross Perot. You were happy with slick willie?
What can you point to that would make voting third party a sane decision?
Tsk! Tsk!
For shame.
;)
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