Posted on 05/11/2006 12:30:13 PM PDT by demlosers
Washington is agog today with the disclosure that appeared in USA Today that Verizon, AT&T and Bell South have been providing domestic phone call information to the National Security Agency on millions of residential and business phone calls made by Americans.
It’s all part of the spy agency’s quest to create a huge database of caller information it could data mine in order to find patterns that might reveal terrorist communications. But it has raised enormous privacy concerns in the minds of many.
The USA Today report, coming after last year’s disclosure in the New York Times of the NSA’s warrantless electronic surveillance of phone calls it deems to be connected to terrorism ginned up the debate over how far is too far in the Bush administration’s efforts to protect the American people from al Qaeda and other terrorists.
The newspaper’s disclosure modified a lot of plans today. President Bush, on his way to give a commencement address in Biloxi, Miss., stopped in the White House’s Diplomatic Reception Room to deliver a brief statement to the press.
By the way, the president’s rapid response was remarkable. When other bad news has hit, say Dubai Ports World or the initial revelations of the NSA surveillance last December, there was a noticeable lag which allowed White House critics to define the debate.
The president’s quickness before today might be attributable to Tony Snow, the new press secretary. Or it could be that the White House is so nervous about the president’s ever lower poll ratings that he and his advisors felt he had to speak and quickly.
PRESIDENT BUSH: After September the 11th, I vowed to the American people that our government would do everything within the law to protect them against another terrorist attack. As part of this effort, I authorized
(Excerpt) Read more at newsblogs.chicagotribune.com ...
I do recall widespread outrage against Carnivore here on FR during the Clinton years, which I believe was to do something similar.
Yes and if I am bringing people into my house that might, if revealed, cause me great embarrassment, it would be a danger.
I am simply following your analogy.
I agree that people would be upset at Carnivore, but was it raised to the national level of outrage aimed at bringing down a President? That was also during a time of peace, and we are now at war.
-PJ
The NSA is not looking at the content of the phone calls, only at a record of what number called witch other number. If they decide something is interesting, they must get a court order consistent with US law to tap the line and listen in. The phone records for most phone calls are compiled in Israel.
Maybe some know a basic right when they see it. My telephone touchpad is not protected by the 4th amendment.
Build a shelter, raise carrier pigeons, and stay there. So Libertarian.
NSA was doing this 30 years ago. This is a non-issue.
Oh, we would have gladly included it in articles of impeachment against Clinton.
That was also during a time of peace, and we are now at war.
And I do agree things are different - that is why I support the warrantless NSA wiretaps. But there is at least some level of probable cause involved there, so there is a check and balance.
But there is no probable in the entire Verizon call list - and IMO we cannot let the government continue to engage in searches with utterly no probable cause involved. That, IMO, leads the country in a direction that is just as dangerous as the enemy we are fighting.
I just happen to have personal knowledge of a "secret" program in which government operatives have access to records of everyone's personal phone numbers, home and business, along with addresses and business contacts that might be involved with those private citizens.
It's called the YELLOW PAGES, you freaking idiot Democrats.
Really, these numbnut liberal Democrats think its a crime for someone to check a list of phone numbers to see if someone in America is talking to terrorist networks overseas.
Gawd, asking that the government adhere to the Bill of Rights is Libertarian? What the hell does that make you?
NSA was doing this 30 years ago. This is a non-issue.
Sure, just cheer on the expansion of government powers. I'm SURE you will never be the eventual victim of such.
Well, when the Bill of Rights was written, we weren't under attack from extremist Muslim terrorists, we didn't have telephones, and the average citizen didn't have access to such things as atomic bomb plans. Get real -- we are in a war and we have to win it, even if we have to surrender a couple of minor "rights" that never existed in the first place.
What if? What if?
Get real. NSA has been monitoring communications since the Carter era, probably before that.
Gawd, once again, these are calls, not phone numbers. I've seldom seen such a lame and inane defense on FR as I have seen with this nonsensical talking point. And lately, that's saying something.
The Bill of Rights was written to protect us from extremist federal government. Which can be just as dangerous, if not more dangerous, than Muslim terrorists. Just ask the ghosts of the hundred million killed by governments last century.
You seem quite paranoid. Who have you been calling lately?
If the data is simply a record of two numbers making a connection....how is that a recording of a conversation?
Phone companies have been collecting connection data for YEARS!!!!!
So you too, think actual conversations are being collected?
It is still a search. Gawd, what is so difficult to grasp about that? Unless I am suspected of some kind of criminal or terrorist action, the government has NO BUSINESS looking at who I have called. There is NO PROBABLE CAUSE in obtaining the entire Verizon phone list - and I blame Verizon as much as I blame the fedgov for this one. They should have refused to provide the entire file.
I have no problem with calling records being provided due to probable cause. In a time of war, I would even be willing to lower the bar for what constitutes probable cause. But not the entire file. That is just a complete stomp on basic rights against unwarranted searches.
Lordy, Lordy, dirt. You really are a screaming libertarian, aren't you?
Next, you'll be griping about drivers licenses and license plates.
HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT?
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