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To: Vicomte13
It's so simple and so clear: what angry conservatives want is a border fence. Just agree to that this year and start building it, while kicking the can of amnesty down the road for a debate next year, and the conservative coalition will be put back together and in good shape for November.

No it's not that simple. It's only being presented as that simple for the moment.

As soon as a border fence is agreed to we'll get the next bit of agitprop. Several hundred thousand people a year enter this country with travel visas and they don't leave.

They will be the new cause celeb and the the new unreachable goal post location will be -- mass deportations.

352 posted on 05/08/2006 8:44:38 PM PDT by FreeReign
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To: FreeReign
As soon as a border fence is agreed to we'll get the next bit of agitprop. Several hundred thousand people a year enter this country with travel visas and they don't leave. They will be the new cause celeb and the the new unreachable goal post location will be -- mass deportations.

First of all, you have a false premise. Securing the borders is not "unreachable". The politicians just don't want to reach it, despite all their assurances that they do.

Secondly, you're probably right that no matter what the Republicans do, there will always be some people who are unsatisfied. The question is numbers. The number of people who want to see the border secured is far greater than the number of those who want to see mass deportations, and it even includes a great many Hispanics. There is no excuse whatsoever not to do it.

366 posted on 05/08/2006 8:49:43 PM PDT by inquest (If you favor any legal status for illegal aliens, then do not claim to be in favor of secure borders)
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To: FreeReign
They will be the new cause celeb and the the new unreachable goal post location will be -- mass deportations.

Exactly. At this point, these goobers are out for as much as they can get.

The deportations thing is a non-starter. Even Tancredo has said there's no way to deport millions of people.

This is a hair-on-fire issue. They were so busy ranting and raving over Cinco de Mayo, they missed the fact that the UAE took over nine plants in the US last week as their purchase of Doncasters was approved by CFIUS after a 30 day review and Bush signed the approval.

The UAE can't shuffle paper at port terminals, but the screamers were so distracted they failed to notice that the UAE now controls plants that manufacture critical parts for the M-1 tank, among other pieces of military equipment.

387 posted on 05/08/2006 8:56:18 PM PDT by sinkspur ( I didn't know until just now that it was Barzini all along.)
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To: FreeReign

"No it's not that simple. It's only being presented as that simple for the moment.
As soon as a border fence is agreed to we'll get the next bit of agitprop. Several hundred thousand people a year enter this country with travel visas and they don't leave.
They will be the new cause celeb and the the new unreachable goal post location will be -- mass deportations."

Agitprop?
You don't take the border conservatives as seriously as I do.
I seriously doubt that it would be as you suggest.
I think it would be like the pro-lifer stress over Miers followed by the rush back to the colors when Alito was named. Sure, there were a handful of malcontents who tried to question Alito's credentials and pro-life commitment, but most pro-lifers are sincere conservatives and want to see the party do well. They WANT to support Republicans. Miers made that impossible, but Alito returned them to the fold.

I believe that the identical thing will be true of the border conservatives if they're given their fence this year. Listen to them right on this thread and others. They're not out there spewing general propaganda. They have AN issue of singular importance to them, which the Republican Party OUGHT TO BE with them on anyway (we already have immigration laws that are being broken, and which ought to be enforced). The GOP seems to be stiff arming them, and they are mad as hornets. I get no sense from these folks that most of them WANT to be angry with the GOP. I think most of them are scared that everything is coming apart, just like you ought to be if you care about the GOP's fortunes, because everything IS coming apart.

But what it's coming apart about, now, is illegal immigration. This is fixable. Vote for, fund and start building the fence. You will get these people back and the party will win. Sure, there will be some who really hate the GOP on principle, but not most, not at all.

Anyway, it's your only hope of holding onto the majority, so you'd best reconcile yourself to it and give it a shot, because otherwise, defeat is certain without these folks.


456 posted on 05/08/2006 9:18:35 PM PDT by Vicomte13 (Paris vaut bien une messe.)
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To: FreeReign
Good thing we'll be able to avoid all that since a fence will not be allowed in the first place. So you dont need to worry about a fence being built. No reason to move that goalpost.
1,201 posted on 05/11/2006 1:32:25 AM PDT by mthom
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