Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Rutan Takes Aim at NASA's CEV Plans, Likens it to 'Archeology'
SPACE.com ^ | 5/4/06 | Leonard David

Posted on 05/04/2006 6:24:09 PM PDT by anymouse

LOS ANGELES, California - A vibrant suborbital space travel industry, including space hotels, and treks to the Moon and beyond are attainable, but only if governmental regulations don't stifle creativity and breakthroughs in building affordable and safe public spaceliners.

Those are a few of the views Burt Rutan, head of the Mojave, California-based Scaled Composites--and leader of the team that designed, built and flew the milestone making SpaceShipOne, the first privately financed suborbital rocket plane--shared today with attendees of the the 25th International Space Development Conference. The event runs here May 4-7.

Rutan also took the time to fault NASA's Crew Exploration Vehicle project--a key element of the space agency's Moon, Mars and beyond strategy--describing it as a taxpayer-funded research that makes absolutely no sense.

Dilemma in the making

Rutan and his Scaled Composites team are now busy at work on a fleet of suborbital spaceliners, as well as two giant carrier planes, under a deal with Sir Richard Branson's Virgin Galactic enterprise.

Rutan said that he remains worried about the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) commercial space transportation regulations, tagging it a dilemma. There remain several sticky, red tape rules that may well cripple experimental research and development of passenger-carrying space planes.

Such rules are inhibiting the prospect that a sustainable suborbital space travel industry can be established, Rutan said.

Harsh words for NASA

While busy trying to make safe suborbital spaceships, Rutan said he has another goal: "I want to go to the Moon in my lifetime."

Rutan had harsh words for NASA's Crew Exploration Vehicle program--and the space agency's revisit of the Moon. He likened NASA's efforts to archeology.

"They are forcing the program to be done with technology that we already know works. They are not creating an environment where it is possible to have a breakthrough," Rutan advised. "It doesn't make sense," he said, contending that programs must encourage risks "in order to stumble into breakthroughs."

Although tipping his hat to the technical competence of NASA chief, Mike Griffin, "I wouldn't have his job," Rutan added. The NASA task ahead is trying to fulfill the President Bush space exploration vision ... but given "only pennies to do it."

Safety and affordability are key

Rutan said if he was the NASA Administrator, he would call a major press conference about the agency plans to go back to the Moon.

"I'd go in front of the microphone," Rutan said, "and I'd scream at the top of my lungs, 'this is stupid,' then turn around and head back to the office and go back to work."

"If we copy what we had it won't be affordable enough or safe enough," Rutan said, to foster human space travel beyond low Earth orbit, to the Moon, and outward.

NASA's space shuttle is complex and generically dangerous, Rutan pointed out. Still, not flying the shuttle to the Hubble Space Telescope is symbolic of a larger issue.

"The budget forecast [for NASA] is to go out and spend hundreds of billions of dollar to go to Mars and yet you don't have the courage to go back to the Hubble ... it looks like you got the wrong guys doing it," Rutan concluded.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; News/Current Events; US: California
KEYWORDS: cev; faa; mars; moon; nasa; redtape; rutan; space
"They are forcing the program to be done with technology that we already know works. They are not creating an environment where it is possible to have a breakthrough," Rutan advised. "It doesn't make sense," he said, contending that programs must encourage risks "in order to stumble into breakthroughs."

Rutan said if he was the NASA Administrator, he would call a major press conference about the agency plans to go back to the Moon.

"I'd go in front of the microphone," Rutan said, "and I'd scream at the top of my lungs, 'this is stupid,' then turn around and head back to the office and go back to work."

"If we copy what we had it won't be affordable enough or safe enough," Rutan said, to foster human space travel beyond low Earth orbit, to the Moon, and outward.

"The budget forecast [for NASA] is to go out and spend hundreds of billions of dollar to go to Mars and yet you don't have the courage to go back to the Hubble ... it looks like you got the wrong guys doing it," Rutan concluded.

1 posted on 05/04/2006 6:24:11 PM PDT by anymouse
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: KevinDavis; Brett66; Shuttle Shucker

space ping.


2 posted on 05/04/2006 6:24:49 PM PDT by anymouse
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: anymouse

You call this archeology?

3 posted on 05/04/2006 6:26:06 PM PDT by JRios1968 (In memoriam...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: anymouse

I'm reading this old book "Colonies In Space" written in 76-77. He was talking about how the STS fleet would fly over 200 times a year and bring down costs to $167/lb. to LEO.
Later HLV variants would bring down the cost to $67/lb. to LEO.
Then they could commence the building of O'Neil space colonies with a large mining base on the moon to supply the raw materials. At this pont in the book, I don't know whether to laugh or cry.


4 posted on 05/04/2006 6:39:19 PM PDT by Brett66 (Where government advances – and it advances relentlessly – freedom is imperiled -Janice Rogers Brown)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: RightWhale; Brett66; xrp; gdc314; anymouse; NonZeroSum; jimkress; discostu; The_Victor; ...

5 posted on 05/04/2006 6:55:52 PM PDT by KevinDavis (http://www.cafepress.com/spacefuture)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Brett66
Was that T.A. Hepenheimer's book? That book hooked me on space development and introduced me to Dr. O'Neil's pioneering work. To my great loss I never met Dr. O'Neil before his untimely death. I did meet his wife and son a few years later at a SSI conference at Princeton.
6 posted on 05/04/2006 7:17:06 PM PDT by anymouse
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: Brett66
If you're interested in that book, you might be interested in the L5 Society. Back in those days there was an incredible amount of excitement and enthusiasm for building space colonies. You can even read back issues of L5 News, which was their newsletter. It has been over 30 years and we're really no closer to that dream now than we were then.
7 posted on 05/04/2006 7:30:52 PM PDT by Tarantulas ( Illegal immigration - the trojan horse that's treated like a sacred cow)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: anymouse

I have a great respect for Rutan. I really do. But the missions are different, his and NASA's.

He is working to develop a highly reusable commuter craft for sub/low orbit travel, and a lifting body for short duration flight and near-earth abort is smart. We he developing is exactly what is needed for space commercialization and adventure travel.

NASA is using a minimal mass approach to return us to the Moon with a large number of astronauts, with habitation/scientific outposts emplaced during that mission. The NASA mission is not a matter of outright innovation, but a need to use proven technology to achieve exploration.

It may stick in Rutan's craw that NASA is not going to hype lifting bodies, but your mission profile determines what you use to get there.


8 posted on 05/04/2006 7:31:41 PM PDT by Frank_Discussion (May the wings of Liberty never lose a feather!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Tarantulas

I was a member of the L-5 Society back in the early 80's and really believed I would see space colonies in my lifetime. The failure to develop a follow on to the shuttle and the space station boondoggle has curbed my enthusiasm.


9 posted on 05/04/2006 7:41:19 PM PDT by operation clinton cleanup
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Frank_Discussion
Rutan is not so much commenting on NASA's choice of vehicle shape (Rutan is the master of letting the mission determine the vehicle configuration), rather he is commenting on NASA's risk adverse philosophical approach to mission design.

By recycling Apollo and Shuttle hardware in a kludge of a mission, and not looking towards long-term logistical affordability, NASA is doing another flags and footprints job with no ability to grow into a sustainable permanent settlement.

Basically NASA's approach is a cynical admission that they can't do any better than what was already done 37 years ago.

BTW, just because Rutan's current focus is the sub-orbital market right now, don't be surprised if he isn't involved in the orbital market in a couple of years.
10 posted on 05/04/2006 7:49:28 PM PDT by anymouse
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: anymouse

Yes, T.A. Hepenheimer was the author, enjoyable read. Found it at a used book store close to where I live.


11 posted on 05/04/2006 8:22:43 PM PDT by Brett66 (Where government advances – and it advances relentlessly – freedom is imperiled -Janice Rogers Brown)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: anymouse
"Rutan is not so much commenting on NASA's choice of vehicle shape (Rutan is the master of letting the mission determine the vehicle configuration), rather he is commenting on NASA's risk adverse philosophical approach to mission design."

He perceives the choices as risk adverse ONLY, which is not at all true. The taxpayers don't like to see exploding manned spacecraft, so yes, getting away from complicated lifting bodies does play into it. However, the major technical reason for not going with a lifting body is that emplacing habs on the lunar surface or eventually Mars does not require it. This is a simpler system that is flat more reliable.

"By recycling Apollo..."

Just because it's a gumdrop shape doesn't mean it is Apollo recycled. The systems are all new, it's larger, and it is reusable. It is also on a track to be expanded into a long haul system, not just a short-sprint people mover. I understand your leery eye here, NASA has disappointed us in the past.

"...and Shuttle hardware in a kludge of a mission, and not looking towards long-term logistical affordability..."

No, the logistics chain is coming early on, having learned from ISS. Logistics has been a learning curve bar none, and the tools for ISS are being sharpened for the present work. In turn, the lessons are being incorporated into CEV/Constellation.

"Basically NASA's approach is a cynical admission that they can't do any better than what was already done 37 years ago."

That is your interpretation. The reality is that NASA is admitting that Shuttle was over complex, and certainly more complex as a single vehicle for what the future requires. A space plane with wings, tail, and a massive cargo volume is not required to take one week manned round-trips or dropping habs and logistical items one-way to the Moon or Mars.

"BTW, just because Rutan's current focus is the sub-orbital market right now, don't be surprised if he isn't involved in the orbital market in a couple of years."

BTW, re-read my first post. I said "sub/low orbital" I believe, with the intention of highlighting that Rutan has not mentioned Trans-Lunar Injection flights. He has a niche market that I hope he exploits to the hilt and farther.
12 posted on 05/04/2006 8:40:57 PM PDT by Frank_Discussion (May the wings of Liberty never lose a feather!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

Rutan said if he was the NASA Administrator, he would call a major press conference about the agency plans to go back to the Moon. "I'd go in front of the microphone," Rutan said, "and I'd scream at the top of my lungs, 'this is stupid,' then turn around and head back to the office and go back to work."
I happen to be a huge fan of Rutan, but he doesn't know what he's talking about here. Going to Mars isn't going to be easy, and the main need is training. No one flying has ever been to the Moon, and no one who has been there is going back. Going to the Moon on a routine basis will produce a large body of personnel who can travel to, land on, and take off from an alien body. Getting to the Moon takes two or three days, and a Martian round trip will take two years. Endurance records in microgravity in orbit has been worthwhile for data gathering vis a vis human survival on the Mars trip, and is one of the big reasons it was done in the first place. We just never went.
13 posted on 05/04/2006 8:47:53 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: anymouse
A vibrant suborbital space travel industry, including space hotels

I'm pretty sure I would never want to check into a suborbital hotel, unless that means it is on the ground.

14 posted on 05/04/2006 11:17:01 PM PDT by Vince Ferrer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Vince Ferrer

Well for certain activies such a short stay hotel may just be enough. ;)

Technically Branson's Virgin Airlines sleeper cabin red-eye flights across the Atlantic are suborbital hotels.


15 posted on 05/04/2006 11:48:18 PM PDT by anymouse
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Brett66

Funny how reality once we get there doesn't always resemble our vivid imaginings.


16 posted on 05/05/2006 8:32:42 AM PDT by RightWhale (Off touch and out of base)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson