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PM canes 'rubbish' postmodern teaching
The Australian ^ | 21st April 2006 | Steve Lewis and Imre Salusinszky

Posted on 04/20/2006 2:21:49 PM PDT by naturalman1975

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1 posted on 04/20/2006 2:21:50 PM PDT by naturalman1975
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To: naturalman1975

Howard rocks!

2 posted on 04/20/2006 2:23:04 PM PDT by Southack (Media Bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: naturalman1975
They feel the subject has been hijacked by those who want to teach about race, gender and Marxism, rather than about literature.

All of which is unrelated to Post modernism. Most Marxists and Feminist ideologues hate PoMo.
3 posted on 04/20/2006 2:27:38 PM PDT by Borges
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To: Borges
All of which is unrelated to Post modernism. Most Marxists and Feminist ideologues hate PoMo.

Most yes, but not all - and the idealogues who've basically been most responsible for our English courses in Australia over the last few years (like Alan Luke for example) are both post-modernists and Marxists. I can't say for certain if he's a feminist.

4 posted on 04/20/2006 2:33:23 PM PDT by naturalman1975 ("America was under attack. Australia was immediately there to help." - John Winston Howard)
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To: naturalman1975

Well you can be a Marxist and a Structuralist as well that doesn't imply causation. Postmodernism is a cultural logic and is apolitical.


5 posted on 04/20/2006 2:35:32 PM PDT by Borges
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To: naturalman1975

Postermodernism is unlearning. To the extent that it is learning at all, it is learned confusion and insanity.


6 posted on 04/20/2006 3:02:53 PM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light..... Isaiah 5:20)
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To: Borges

I wouldn't say postmodernism is apoltical exactly. It can infect the thinking of all ideologies to a point; but for the most part, a consistent conservative can't really be a postmodernist. The theories of conservatism are too based on absolute truth. Conservatives are by nature traditionalists. Liberals can be modernists or post-modernists. You might find someone who calls himself a conservative and a postmodernist, but the rest of us would call him a RINO or a CINO.


7 posted on 04/20/2006 3:17:26 PM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light..... Isaiah 5:20)
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To: naturalman1975
"Literary theory covers a broad range of cultural and social theory from Marxism to post-structuralism, feminism and queer theory," he said.

That isn't exactly the broadest spectrum - it's sort of lumped up over there on the left. Post-structuralists and post-modernists aren't the same breed of cat these days but the amount of intellectual sludge you have to wade through to recognize that there is a significant difference is astonishing (and sort of futile since to both schools "significance" is a heavily negotiable term).

The real problem with this sort of thing with respect to Shakespeare is that the latter's universalist treatment of human emotions is antithetical to the idea that they must be interpreted through the filters of queer or feminist theory in order to extract the proper subtextual meaning. ("Proper" turns out to be negotiable too.) The result is a terrible hash and it's no wonder the kiddies are confused by it.

8 posted on 04/20/2006 3:20:01 PM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: The Ghost of FReepers Past

PoMo taken consistently is anarchy. It's a set of glasses through which to see the world in novel ways. But at some point you have to take the glasses off or replace them with another pair.


9 posted on 04/20/2006 3:31:18 PM PDT by Borges
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To: naturalman1975

bump for publicity


10 posted on 04/20/2006 3:39:08 PM PDT by VOA
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To: Borges
It's a set of glasses through which to see the world in novel ways.

And the goal is not to really see anything in any rational sense, but only to find confusion where none really exists. It's an activity of imagination. That's what I meant by learned confusion and insanity. People who dwell in that mental realm larely lose touch with reality.

11 posted on 04/20/2006 3:44:44 PM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light..... Isaiah 5:20)
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To: naturalman1975

Most of the PoMos I have encountered used to be dogmatic Marxists until the Soviet Union collapsed, and rather than confess that capitalism won they found refuge in PoMo.


12 posted on 04/20/2006 3:51:08 PM PDT by flying Elvis
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To: flying Elvis
Pomo and Marxism have nothing to do with each other. They are contradictory in many regards. Marxism is a dogmatic view of the world...something Pomo abhors
13 posted on 04/20/2006 4:05:26 PM PDT by Borges
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To: Borges

That's my point. Many of the PoMos I have studied were former Marxists who gave up on a dogmatic view of the world after the USSR fell. This is particularly true of the French PoMos.


14 posted on 04/20/2006 4:09:26 PM PDT by flying Elvis
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To: Borges; naturalman1975

Most who consider themselves postmodernists are inconsistent or partial postmodernists using the strict definition of postmodernism. A consistent PoMo will say there is no cultural basis to be judged, which means Nazism, Kipling/Joseph Chamberlain-kind "civilizational mission" imperialism, Leopold II type exploitative imperialism, American muscular patriotism, French-Euro Gallic nationalism, communism, free market libertarianism, Euro social market democracy, "Third Way-ism", classical Metternich Ancien regime authoritarism, Third World Marxo-nationalism, Mussolini Fascism, you-name-it-ism are all equally valid. "Who are we to judge?", in other words, is the motto.

But evidences from our self-avowed postmodernists suggest they don't believe in this way. Most are quite classical absolutist in stance when it comes to judging American patriotism or classical European absolute monarchy (not saying that they are equivalent, but most typical Western academics treat these two with equal contempt). And they are the first to denounce Western patriotism, but tolerate to a great length Third World nationalism.


15 posted on 04/20/2006 4:58:57 PM PDT by NZerFromHK (Leftism is like honey mixed with arsenic: initially it tastes good, but that will end up killing you)
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To: Borges
"Most Marxists and Feminist ideologues hate PoMo."

What a bit of comedy that is. Anyone who is aware of the intellectual scene is aware of what has happened. Vulgar Marxism is out. Deconstructing Nietzsche and Heidegger and enlisting them in the cause of egalitarian socialism is in.

Now instead of individual consciousness being necessarily conditioned by the economic realities of vulgar Marxism, they are conditioned by the cultural realities of gender and race.

That is the reality. To say that feminists and Marxists hate postmodernism is simply goofy.

16 posted on 04/20/2006 6:02:31 PM PDT by Reactionary (The Barking of the Native Moonbat is the Sound of Moral Nitwittery)
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To: naturalman1975

Good job, PM Howard


17 posted on 04/20/2006 6:14:20 PM PDT by newzjunkey (Don't use illegals: HIREPATRIOTS.COM)
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To: Reactionary
Deconstruction is a rhetorical tool that can be used against Marx as well as anyone else. Ideologues of any sort dislike Post modernism and deconstruction (which is quite old actually...Classical really) because it undermines any set epistemology.
18 posted on 04/20/2006 6:58:36 PM PDT by Borges
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To: Borges
"Deconstruction is a rhetorical tool that can be used against Marx as well as anyone else."

Allan Bloom once wrote that deconstruction does for literary criticism what Huey Long did for politics: Every man a critic.

He was right. Deconstruction is a "tool," all right. It's a tool for self-satisfied nihilists who inhabit our universities. It makes the study of literature an impossibility.

Which, come to think of it, may be the point.

19 posted on 04/20/2006 8:59:45 PM PDT by Reactionary (The Barking of the Native Moonbat is the Sound of Moral Nitwittery)
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To: Reactionary
I agree and it seems like you are pulling out stuff from Bloom's "Closing of...", especially from the middle section. I think Bloom was spot on in his observations. The standard POMO household names (Derrida, Loyatard, Foucault, Baudrillard, Jameson, Lacan, etc.) have all studied with or have been people of the Left. It all comes down to class conflict and destroying Capitalist hegemony. Roger Kimball's "Tenured Radicals" is also a good read on this subject.
20 posted on 04/20/2006 10:33:55 PM PDT by Blind Eye Jones
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