Posted on 04/17/2006 10:50:55 AM PDT by george wythe
It's a topic often lost in the heated battle over whether to add more border patrol agents, build a bigger fence, or deploy the US military along the border with Mexico. But in the end, most analysts agree, the United States can't stem the flow of illegal immigrants until it resolves to do one thing: punish employers who hire them.
[snip]
One local businessman, who wishes to remain anonymous, knows firsthand the weaknesses in the enforcement regime. He owned a large landscape business for more than two decades in which he employed up to 300 people at a time, most of whom were Latino immigrants.
His human resource department checked the documents of prospective employees and filled out the IRCA-required I-9 forms. "The quality of the documents varied quite a bit from being very, very good in terms of forgeries to the point of some pretty strange looking things, like misspelled names on social security cards," says the businessman. "The problem is where do you draw the line? And to what extent do we [employers] need to become experts in counterfeiting?"
He says the then Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS) audited his business three times during the 1990s. Each time, he lost more than half his workforce, but never received a fine because "we did a good job of filling out all the paperwork."
"It became almost humorous that every time they came in, we knew we'd lose a bunch of people, but gradually we'd hire other ones, and that was just the way of doing business," he says.
(Excerpt) Read more at csmonitor.com ...
HR 4437 turns the Social Security card into a picture ID similar to a modern driver's license.
This FReeper opposes a National ID card.
SS cards were never meant to be used as identification. Mine says "not to be used for identification purposes".
this FReeper is against National ID cards, as well.
Those of us trapped in 56K dialup HELL really appreciate it!
The problem I see with a national ID card is this:
Once the card becomes required, it's only a short step to a "carriage" requirement - if every citizen is issued a card, why not make them carry it while out in public? And if people must carry the card while out in public, why not make it okay for law enforcement to check on this? It is a quick trip from "national ID" to "Stop! Where are your papers, prole?"
And that does worry me.
ping
We don't need national ID cards. This is just another ploy to rob us of freedoms. What we need is a digital ID card for immigrants, legals that is, that can be checked out in a hurry and be hard to forge. When an immigrant applies for a job simply ask for HIS national immigrant ID card and if he/she/it doesn't have one then call in La Migra. If the employer fails to do so and is caught hiring ILLEGALS then said employer should do jail time. It isn't that hard to straighten this mess out, we just need politicians with the balls to do their jobs for a change.
Great article at NRO about removing tax deducttions for wages if a company can't prove an employee is alegal resident. Brilliant idea. Removes a big plus for companies that hire illegals.
http://frum.nationalreview.com/archives/04162006.asp
I think the most recent ones don't carry that disclaimer.
What's wrong with an electronic, pictured SS card? Your SS number will be linked to a national database that will include your immigration status, tax filing records, credit history, medical files, court records, etc.
Illegal aliens would be easily identified as not eligible to work.
I believe it's a good idea to be able to verify folks are in teh country legally. My concern is what *else* will such a card be used for? I just fear there will be a creep of what an "employment verification card" ends up being required for...
I oppose a National ID card also, but I wonder how to enforce the laws against hiring them without something?? I agree the way to slow illegal entries is to enforce laws against hiring, yet I don't think we can put the burden on employers to determine whether documents are good or not.
Anyone have any ideas how to enforce laws against hiring without a National ID required by everyone?
We already have that. It's called the 'green card.'
that can be checked out in a hurry and be hard to forge.
Verifying the authenticity with a database online is already available, but only to a limited number of employers.
As far as hard to forge, after the advent of the computer age, nothing is hard to forge.
Furthermore, once the database can be accessed online, hackers will have a field day adding thousands of new US citizens everyday.
this FReeper is against National ID cards, as well.
I love it - the government's response to a problem is to avoid dealing with the offenders, and further burden citizens with laws and regulations..
I can sympathize somewhat with Mexicans who come up here for a better life (realistically, if you're poor in Mexico, the chances of getting here legally are probably close to zero). But the employers who benefit from undocumented persons who will accept below minimum wage and will not complain about overtime or unsafe conditions somehow keep getting away with it!
The article contains examples of how easily it is to prove that an employee is a legal resident. . . with fake papers.
Thats another crime, and making it that much more difficult will catch many if not all. All we need is the will to actually try and enforce the rules.
Here's the thread using your article:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1616391/posts
I agree with that, but it doesn't solve the problem of the guy who shows up with false papers that show he is a citizen and he isn't. Of course a National ID card in reality wouldn't do that either- they would just get fake ID cards.
I actually thought the system Social Security was setting up for employers to verify SSNs was a good idea- but the ACLU is fighting that big time, so not sure it will get done.
The big issues are false documents and identity theft, not sure how to solve either one in a way that allows those who are not illegal to not be hassled.
The article clearly states that businesses were audited but not fined, because it was unfair to ask small business owners to become forgery experts.
Even the ICE and CBP have trouble identifying the computerized forgeries, how can an average American know which papers are fake?
Your 'solution' is hogwash.
The employer would simply run the magnetic strip through and viola! if the person is truely legal they will be in the data base, if not, they would not be in the base. There would probably be rare cases where some inside worker forged IDs for people but they would be caught eventually, the same way DMV people who produce drivers licenses for ILLEGALS get caught today.
Having legal residents(as opposed to citizens) carry a National Immigrant ID would only affect them and not citizens of this country. If a person shows up carrying a birth certificate that says they are citizens this can also, and certainly should be, checked out for authenticity.
However, no national IDs of any kind are necessary if we simply keep a good data base of the legal immigrants and check all immigrants when they are hired through the data base. It is possible now and employers who say they can't do it are lying and making excuses. Fine the employers, send them to jail, they will soon stop hiring ILLEGALS or any immigrants who don't have impeccable documents and the ILLEGALs will deport themselves. Problem solved, but our pols are too gutless to do it.
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