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To: Coyoteman
Decay dating is a flawed system. First it is assumed that as the magma is mixed in the chamber before it is erupted out it is an equal mix all the materials are equal within the batch, every time it erupts. Second there is not one that can prove that the dying magnetic field has an effect upon the decay rates of these radioactive elements.

It has been said that the magnetic field fluctuates and is not dying, well if there is a mysterious energy source recharging the magnetic field then it must also recharge or slow the process or even speed the process. Not enough data to assume the age of the earth at billions of years when there is data the suggests a young universe. Saturn's rings are still unstable after billions of years. Saturn and Jupiter still have enough heat left to measure that they lose heat faster than they gain it from the sun. The sun is shrinking at a measurable rate.

The Shara grows at a measurable rate that suggests an age of approximately 4000 years.

They studied the great coral reef after major destruction during WWII and learned it grew at a measurable rate that put it's age about 4000 years old.

The oldest living tree is about 4000 years old.

The Niagara could only be approx 10000 years, less when you factor in the water receding from the Great Flood of Noah's day. ECT.

I can not answer for the one's who claim to believe in Jesus yet do not believe his word to be 100% true, we will all have to answer to God in the end.
53 posted on 04/16/2006 8:53:39 PM PDT by Creationist (If the earth is old show me your proof. Salvation from the judgment of your sins is free.)
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To: Creationist
Decay dating is a flawed system.

Just to take the simplest, radiocarbon dating, is enough to show that you are incorrect.

I don't have the time tonight to explain this in my own words, so must resort to links (which I prefer not to do in this field, as I know it fairly well).

So, if you are interested take a look at some of the links and I will try to do more if you want tomorrow night. Let me know.

Night all!

ReligiousTolerance.org Carbon-14 Dating (C-14): Beliefs of New-Earth Creationists

The American Scientific Affiliation: Science in Christian Perspective Radiometric Dating: A Christian Perspective by Dr. Roger C. Wiens.

This site, BiblicalChronologist.org has a series of good articles on radiocarbon dating.

Tree Ring and C14 Dating

Radiocarbon WEB-info Radiocarbon Laboratory, University of Waikato, New Zealand.


58 posted on 04/16/2006 9:09:02 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Interim tagline: The UN 1967 Outer Space Treaty is bad for America and bad for humanity - DUMP IT!)
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To: Creationist
I can not answer for the one's who claim to believe in Jesus yet do not believe his word to be 100% true, we will all have to answer to God in the end.

What did Jesus have to say about the age of the earth?

76 posted on 04/17/2006 10:05:41 AM PDT by atlaw
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To: Creationist
Decay dating is a flawed system. First it is assumed that as the magma is mixed in the chamber before it is erupted out it is an equal mix all the materials are equal within the batch, every time it erupts. Second there is not one that can prove that the dying magnetic field has an effect upon the decay rates of these radioactive elements.

Welcome to the Creationist school of physics, where no fantasy is too wild if it allows him to pretend that the bible is a science book.
You and Fester should hook up. You'd make quite a pair!

80 posted on 04/17/2006 10:37:00 AM PDT by blowfish
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To: Creationist
Decay dating is a flawed system.

Not nearly as flawed as the idiotic anti-evolution arguments which are made against it... Such as:

First it is assumed that as the magma is mixed in the chamber before it is erupted out it is an equal mix all the materials are equal within the batch, every time it erupts.

No it isn't. Where did you "learn" this bit of stupidity?

Second there is not one that can prove that the dying magnetic field has an effect upon the decay rates of these radioactive elements.

ROFL! No one said that it does. Just how confused are you?

It has been said that the magnetic field fluctuates and is not dying,

...because there is massive and overwhelming evidence of that, plus it occurs according to the laws of physics, unlike the bizarre anti-evolution handwaving which tries to dream up fantasies to the contrary.

well if there is a mysterious energy source recharging the magnetic field

It doesn't take any "mysterious energy source", nor does the Earth's magnetic field fluctuate due to any kind of "recharging". We'll add basic physics and electromagnetism to the subjects which anti-evolutionists are entirely ignorant about.

then it must also recharge or slow the process or even speed the process.

Try again. No "recharging" is involved.

Not enough data to assume the age of the earth at billions of years

Uh huh. Sure. Keep believing that falsehood if it helps you cling to your cherished false beliefs about the age of the Earth. Meanwhile:


The Age of the Earth
The Earth is accepted by scientists to be around 4.5 billion years old. But how do they know the Earth is this old? Some of the lines of evidence for an ancient Earth are presented.

The Geological Time Scale
Few discussions in geology or evolution can occur without reference to geologic time. In this article, the standard time scale used by geologists is depicted and described. See also Niel Brandt's Evolutionary and Geological Timelines.

Radiometric Dating and the Geological Time Scale
Radiometric dating and stratigraphic principles are combined to establish the conventional geological time scale. Scientists apply these principles to date rocks, which can then be used to assign ages to fossils.

Changing Views of the History of the Earth
How did we go from thinking Earth was a young planet to the realization that it is ancient, with a four and a half billion year history?

Isochron Dating Methods
The isochron radiometric dating technique (and related ones) is widely used in isotope geology, and does not fall prey to many common creationist criticisms of radiometric dating. This essay introduces the technique and shows why it is so reliable.
Radiometric Dating: A Christian Perspective
Radiometeric Dating Does Work!

Are Radioactive Dating Methods Consistent With Each Other?

Consistent Radiometric dates

Breakthrough Made in Dating of the Geological Record

Formation of the Hawaiian Islands

How Old is the Earth: A Response to “Scientific” Creationism

when there is data the suggests a young universe.

No, there isn't, but there are a lot of creationist fallacies and misrepresentations along that line, such as some of the nonsense you try to pull here:

Saturn's rings are still unstable after billions of years.

Nope, sorry: Creationist Claim CE240: Saturn's Rings

Saturn and Jupiter still have enough heat left to measure that they lose heat faster than they gain it from the sun.

Yawn: Young-earth "proof" #10: Jupiter and Saturn are cooling off rather rapidly.

The sun is shrinking at a measurable rate.

So is the average IQ of young-Earthers: Young-earth "proof" #1: The sun is shrinking

The Shara grows at a measurable rate that suggests an age of approximately 4000 years.

Yeah, so? What does that prove about the age of the Earth itself? Oh, right, nothing -- there's a young desert on the old Earth. Young-earth "proof" #23: The Sahara desert is expanding

They studied the great coral reef after major destruction during WWII and learned it grew at a measurable rate that put it's age about 4000 years old.

Yeah, so? First, even a creationist should be able to see the fallacy of trying to use a growth rate which was measured "after major destruction" (i.e., at a time when the reef was repairing itself) in an attempt to guess what rate it might or might not grow at during times of equilibrium.

Second, the Earth is coming out of an ice age, obviously tropical creatures like corals are going to be springing up in areas that a few thousand years ago were too cold for them to have thrived in.

Finally, the same question applies here as to the Sahara item: Okay, so you've got a relatively young coral reef, what does this prove about the age of the Earth itself? Oh, right, nothing. So you've got a "young" coral on an old Earth. So? Big woop-de-doo. Corals don't live forever. Of COURSE they're going to be younger than the Earth they live on. Duh.

Say, just how simple-minded does someone have to be to be a young-Earther, and swallow these goofy "arguments"?

The oldest living tree is about 4000 years old.

See above. I can't believe how dumb these things are, and why you can't see their flaws yourself.

Hey, Einstein, the oldest living cat is about 20 years old -- does that mean the Earth can't be older than 20 years old?

The Niagara could only be approx 10000 years,

Yet again, you're trying, in an idiotic and obviously flawed manner, to figure the total age of the Earth by looking at ephemeral features on it which come and go, as the Earth and the things on it change due to erosion, climate change, limited lifespans, etc. Nice try. Hey, I have a gully in my back yard that's only about 2 years old -- quick, how old does that make the Earth?

less when you factor in the water receding from the Great Flood of Noah's day.

What flood would that be?

Problems with a Global Flood

"Polystrate" Fossils

Review of John Woodmorappe's "Noah's Ark: A Feasibility Study"

Dinosaur Prints in Coal

The Geologic Column and its Implications for the Flood

Is the Devonian Chattanooga Shale Really a Volcanic Ash-Fall Deposit?

Geology in Error?: The Lewis Thrust

Thrust Faults and the Lewis Overthrust

What Would We Expect to Find if the World had Flooded?

Problems with Walter Brown's Hydroplate Theory

Burrows in the Orkney Islands contradict the Global Flood

Why The Flood Can't Be Global

The Fish is Served With a Delicate Creamy Mercury Sauce

The Letter The Creation Research Society Quarterly Didn't Want You to See

Microfossil Stratigraphy Presents Problems for the Flood

Why Would the Flood Sort Animals by Cell Type?

Fleeing from the Flood

Isotopic Sorting and the Noah's Flood Model

Evidence from the Orkney Islands Against a Global Flood

While the Flood Rages, Termites Dig, Dinosaurs Dance and Cicadas Sing

More Nonsense on "TRUE.ORIGINS": Jonathan Sarfati's Support Of Flood Geology

Why Geology Shows Sedimentation to Be too Slow for a Global Flood

Creationist "Flood Geology" Versus Common Sense -- Or Reasons why "Flood Geology" was abandoned in the mid-1800s by Christian men of science

You'd really benefit from reading these, too, and actually learning something for a change:
Young Earth Index

Young Earth Book Reviews

How Good Are Those Young-Earth Arguments?

The Age of the Earth FAQs

Young Earth Creationism

Problems of Young-Earth Creationism (by a creationist!)

Supernovae, Supernova Remnants and Young Earth Creationism FAQ

Young Earth Creationism Links

http://www.freeinquiry.com/skeptic/badgeology/youngearth/

Young-Earth Creationism and the Geology of the Grand Canyon

Anti-Creationism FAQ: Age of the Earth

Fallacies in Young Earth Creationistm

I can not answer for the one's who claim to believe in Jesus yet do not believe his word to be 100% true, we will all have to answer to God in the end.

And I can not answer for people who are under the bizarre notion that Jesus stated what the age of the Earth was.

82 posted on 04/17/2006 11:13:14 AM PDT by Ichneumon (Ignorance is curable, but the afflicted has to want to be cured.)
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To: Creationist
Ow, my head.

I suggest you pick up a copy of Ancient Earth, Ancient Skies: the Age of Earth and Its Cosmic Surroundings by G. Brent Dalrymple. It goes through the history of the first attempts to date the earth and summarizes a variety of modern methods. It's intended more for the layman so it's not terribly difficult to read.

92 posted on 04/17/2006 5:59:55 PM PDT by ahayes
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