Posted on 04/08/2006 10:23:27 AM PDT by Travis McGee
"The True History of the Southwest, 101"
The amount of historical idiocy and fallacies surrounding the history of the Southwest is staggering, chief among them the "Aztlan" fairy tales. What's the truth? How did the Spanish Europeans conquer the Southwest? The "conquistadores" (that means "conquerors") did it with the lance, and the lash.
For example, in 1541 Coronado entered present-day New Mexico (which included present Arizona during the Spanish era) searching for the "lost cities of gold." One of his first actions upon meeting the natives was to burn 100s of them alive in their dwellings, for not handing over suspected horse thieves. That is how Spain conquered the natives of the present US Southwest--not with hugs and kisses! It was certainly no love-fest between long-lost brown-skinned soul- mates, as it is often portrayed today by the delusional Aztlaners today, who spin the "new bronze race of Mestizos" toro-mierda.
By 1821, Mexico City was strong enough to overthrow even more decrepit and ineffectual Spanish rule. However, the distant provinces of the current US Southwest were far beyond the reach of the authority of independent but strife- torn Mexico. These distant northern provinces received neither military protection nor needed levels of trade from the south. Under Spanish rule, trade with the USA was forbidden, but at least Spain provided trade and Army protection from hostile Indians. Under Mexican neglect, the Southwest received neither trade nor protection from Mexico City.
For example, Comanches and Apaches ran rampant in the 1830s in this new power vacuum created by Mexican neglect, burning scores of major ranches that had been around for hundreds of years and massacring their inhabitants. Mexico City could neither defend nor keep the allegiance of its nominal citizens in these regions. Nor did it provide needed levels of trade to sustain the prior Spanish-era standard of living. Mexican influence atrophied, withered and died at the same time that American pathfinders were opening up new routes into the region.
Increasingly, a growing America was making inroads into the Southwest, via ships into California, and via gigantic wagon trains of trade goods over the Santa Fe Trail from St. Louis. The standard of living of the SPANISH in these states subsequently increased enormously, which is why they did not support Mexico City in the 1846-48 war. In fact, the Spanish-speaking inhabitants of the Southwest NEVER considered themselves "Mexicans" at all, ever. They went, in their own eyes, from SPANISH directly to AMERICAN.
So how long did Mexico City have even nominal control over the Southwest? For only 25 years, during which they had no effective control, and the area slipped backwards until the arrival of the Americans. The SPANISH inhabitants of the Southwest NEVER transferred their loyalty to Mexico City, because all the received from the chaotic Mexican government was misrule, neglect, and unchecked Indian raids.
Since then, how long has the area been under firm American control? For 150 continuous years, during which time the former Spanish inhabitants of the region, now American citizens, have prospered beyond the wildest dreams of the Mexicans stuck in Mexico. To compare the infrastructure, roads, schools, hospitals etc of the two regions is to understand the truth. The Mexican government has been mired in graft, corruption, nepotism and chaos from the very start. The ordinary Mexican peons have been trampled and abused, while only the super-rich elites have thrived. This is why millions of Mexicans want to escape from Mexico today, to enjoy the benefits of living in America they can never obtain in Mexico.
And now, we are supposed to let any Mexican from Chiapas, Michoacan or Yucatan march into the American Southwest, and make some "historical claim" of a right to live there? From where does this absurd idea spring?
At what point in history did Indians and Mestizos from Zacatecas or Durango stake a claim on the American Southwest? Neither they nor their ancestors ever lived for one single day in the American Southwest. The Spanish living in the Southwest in 1846 stayed there, and became Americans by the treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo. There were no Spanish inhabitants of the Southwest who were marched to the border and driven into Mexico. It didn't happen. The SPANISH in the Southwest welcomed American citizenship, which brought stability, protection from Indian raids, and a vast increase in their standard of living with the increase in trade.
In sum, NO current inhabitants of Mexico have ANY claim on even one single inch of the Southwest!
NOT ONE citizen of Mexico is sneaking into the USA to reclaim property they were deprived of, NOT ONE.
They are criminal invaders and colonizers, pure and simple.
It's time Americans learned the true history, as a counter to the prevalent Aztlaner fairy tales.
I don't like that map. There's a small county out in West Texas that probably has a little higher percentage of "Latino" population thanks to my extended family, who are descended from ancestors who have been here in Texas since the mid-1700s and contributed young men to battle and war on behalf of Texas and the U.S. for generations since then. But we've never shirked our responsibility or disrespected the U.S. or Texas. I won't apologize for existing, and that map implies that I should.
here's whats going on here in Salt Lake.
Tommorrow, and Monday...
http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,635197113,00.html
grownups are WAY worried this is gonna get ugly here...
I didn't draw it or make the map. Further, I don't know how old or updated it is. It appears, that parft of the info was furnished by the U.S. Census Bureau. Aztlan have their own web site and intentions. However, like it or not, the demographic truth is the truth. If you have an argument, I suggest you take it up with the U.S. Government Census Bureau, and the supporters of Aztlan.
Yes, but linking to that map infers agreement with the idea that hispanic=aztlan and aztlan=hispanic. That simply isn't true.
Now, that's funny right there, I don't care what anybody thinks. ;^)
Maidservant: "Sire, the people illegals are revolting!"
Lois XIV: "I know."
Seriously, let them continue believing in non-historical fantasy lands and that we're all too soft and complacent to defend our sovereignty.
I couldn't devise and implement better PsyOps than they're doing to themselves.
If not on Mecha, and Aztlan web pages, show me where to find the truth that Hispanics are not directly tied to those organizations that want to overthrow the Southwest back to Mexico. Do we have to assume that those web pages, and the Hispanics that write on those sites and their intent don't exist? Are they all liars, and are we to assume those pages to be bogus or fictitious?
LOL, I believe I got that map in an email from Happy2BMe, but he would love that you posted it here!
Well, which is it. Are we anti-war types, or are we just itching to start a war?
I can just envision a bunch of guys, with their camouflage and eye paint at the ready, chomping at the bit to play militia.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1611565/posts?page=99#99
Frankly, that post is probably the most inaccurate statement I've ever seen a member of Free Republic make. Some folks might take up arms, but I have yet to see one FReeper who didn't believe that that is an absolute last resort, and only when all else has failed.
Why don't you just get on the ball and tell your representatives in no uncertain terms that they will not get your vote if they do not enforce the laws already in place regarding illegal immigrants?
Or do you believe that a society with more social benefits then we should have already can withstand the strain of all those who are much less fortunate then us in this world?
Hint. That includes pretty much the rest of the world populace.
I'm sure some or all of the writers of those pages are hispanic; but you are failing to see the fallacy of the logic that the map you presented depicts something about Aztlan. It would be as illogical as presenting a map depicting "the rise of neo-nazis in the U.S." and doing so merely by presenting Anglo population statistics.
NOT EVERY HISPANIC THAT MAKES A COUNTY RED OR PINK IS A BELIEVER IN AZTLAN. In fact, I'm convinced that very few are.
However, I can see where those who like things in a simple, straightforward, black & white manner would like to believe it's so in order to not have to think too hard about all of it.
One person didn't appreciate it. They don't believe that Hispanics and that map should be tied to one another. Oh well, I'm sure if they go and spend a week reading Aztlan's web page, they'd change their mind, like fast. Sometimes the truth hurts.Shining Light On The Truth!
That's an understatement in search of a world title. If events hold to their present trend, it will be a blood-bath.
And it will not be confined to merely parts of Texas and California, plus Arizona and New Mexico. Aztlan is not going to be content with that small a territory. They will want all of California and all of the west coast to Vancouver (how far inland I'm not sure). They will demand all of Nevada and at least part of Utah (besides Arizona and New Mexico). Aztlan will want Colorado at least south of Denver; all of Texas; all of Oklahoma; and Kansas, at least to El Dorado, maybe Abilene.
Running east from Texas, Aztlan will demand all of Louisiana (there goes the mouth of the Mississippi, putting all of the upper Midwest at the mercy of Aztlan), and a strip running east through the panhandles of Mississippi and Alabama on into the panhandle of Florida (or maybe all of Florida - what the Hell; might as well while we're at it). At one time, all of the above territory was claimed by Spain, much of it by Mexico, and much of it actually held with varying degrees of firmness at some time or another by one or the other of them, or both. If you believe it is a fantasy to think Aztlan will want 'it all back' then you need to go to DC and consort with the other morons.
I appreciate your words and rhetoric, but you still haven't shown me anything or place, to debunk your point[s] that, that the demographics of that map are not true, or that Aztlan doesn't have the intent to overthrow the Southwest back to Mexico. Again, your argument is with the U.S. Census Bureau and Aztlan! End of argument!
SNIP...
For example, Comanches and Apaches ran rampant in the 1830s in this new power vacuum created by Mexican neglect, burning scores of major ranches that had been around for hundreds of years and massacring their inhabitants.
I don't necessarily agree with this sentence Travis. My family is Comanche on my fathers side and Apache and Comanche on my mother's side.
Mexican Federales murdered members of my family for just being "Indios"...so did Los Pinches Rinches (Texas Rangers).
There are still songs being sung about these times in the Southwest. Someone should really write them all down.
The Mexicans were basically European land owners that stole the land that was inhabited by my ancestors for generations.
I don't care what history you read or what accounts you read I will never believe that my ancestor's killed innocents. It is not what is taught or indwelled in the culture. Killing is for defense and for food. There was a saying that my grandfather once told me that his grandfather told him..."white people are like children." In context what he meant was that White people (Mexican Europeans included) could not be trusted...they kill for sport...and they kill to take things away from you. He was saying that they are undisciplined and selfish.
Now I know this isn't true today...but that was the reality of those times. The land was inhabited and the Mexican land owners with their 400,000 acres tracts of land wanted it all. That is why Indians congregated around the Roman Catholic Missions and took "Christian names." They wanted protection. They eventually assimilated into Mexican-Spanish culture and two hundred years later were Americanized like 13sisters76 wrote.
LOL, I should have known Happy had something to do with that map. Next time you hear from him, tell him it got posted, and if need be, will be posted again.
I have no doubt he lurks here but doesn't mean he will see what we are talking about.
The map is what it is, and you don't have to apologize for anything. If I read your 'tone' right and your intention is to vote to stay Texan and USA, then you will be in the same arena and catching the same flak right along with the rest of us who mean to stay red, white & blue.
Welcome to the club. It could get a little nasty.
Thanks for posting this Travis. It too bad when one side has to make up fairy tales to justify it's assault on our liberties.
Even during the Gold Rush Mexico esported it's criminals a la Joaquin Murrietta.
There are descendants of the holders of the original Spanish grants that would have a precedent over the descendents of the Mayan, Aztec, Toltecs etc that were never here during any recorded history. I believe there are Verdugos still alive and I know of at least one Berryessa.
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