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God by the Numbers: Coincidence, random mutation not most likely explanations for some things
Christianity Today ^ | 03/10/2006 | Charles Edward White

Posted on 03/11/2006 5:46:39 PM PST by Zender500

Math and theology have had a long and checkered relationship. The Babylonians and Mayans both associated numbers with God. In fact, both societies named their gods with numbers. The Mayans used 13 and the Babylonians used 60. In the Greek world, followers of Pythagoras prayed to the first 4 numbers and thought they were the creator. On the other hand, in the 18th century, the French mathematician Laplace told Napoleon he had no need of God even as a hypothesis, and in 1744, John Wesley confessed: "I am convinced, from many experiments, I could not study either mathematics, arithmetic, or algebra … without being a deist, if not an atheist."

No one knows what Wesley saw in 18th-century mathematics that he feared would lead him away from the God of the Bible, but today, many Christian mathematicians think that numbers point to God. Three numbers in particular suggest evidence for God's existence. They are 1/1010123, 10162, and eði.

Fine-tuning the universe The first recent number that points to God is 1 in 10 to the 10 to the 123. This number comes from astronomy. Oxford professor Roger Penrose discusses it in his book The Large, the Small, and the Human Mind. It derives from a formula by Jacob Beckenstein and Stephen Hawking and describes the chances of our universe being created at random. Penrose spoofs this view by picturing God throwing a dart at all the possible space-time continua and hitting the universe we inhabit. The Beckenstein-Hawking formula is too complicated to discuss here, but another approach to the same problem involves the fine-tuning of the universe and the existence of habitable planets.

The fine-tuning of the universe is shown in the precise strengths of four basic forces. Gravity is the best known of these forces and is the weakest,

(Excerpt) Read more at christianitytoday.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial
KEYWORDS: crevolist; id; privilegedplanet
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1 posted on 03/11/2006 5:46:43 PM PST by Zender500
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Comment #2 Removed by Moderator

To: Zender500

3 posted on 03/11/2006 5:51:36 PM PST by Huck (space for rent)
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To: Red Nucleus

And thanks for all the fish!


4 posted on 03/11/2006 5:52:14 PM PST by Huck (space for rent)
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To: Red Nucleus

Yes, thank you.
42.
Twice 21.
or (7 x 3)2.


5 posted on 03/11/2006 5:56:22 PM PST by billorites (freepo ergo sum)
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To: Zender500

Gotta love these threads, most of whose replies are ad hominems or Casey Stengelese non sequiturs.


6 posted on 03/11/2006 5:58:08 PM PST by rhema ("Break the conventions, keep the commandments." -- G. K. Chesterton)
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To: Zender500; All

.

Praise GOD that...

GOD is the Only reality and that...

GOD is LOVE:



MEL's -PASSION- was sparked by -WE WERE SOLDIERS-

http://www.Freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1085111/posts

.


7 posted on 03/11/2006 6:01:07 PM PST by ALOHA RONNIE ("ALOHA RONNIE" Guyer/Veteran-"WE WERE SOLDIERS" Battle of IA DRANG-1965 http://www.lzxray.com)
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To: rhema
Gotta love these threads, most of whose replies are ad hominems or Casey Stengelese non sequiturs.

A dearth of series replies, to be sure.

And let's give it up for Casey Stengel, Patron Saint of evolution threads:


8 posted on 03/11/2006 6:10:59 PM PST by Zender500
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To: Zender500

Eminently reasonable. People just know, intrinsically, that we are not here by accident. Evolutionists' claims that evolution is more than "chance" or "accident" ring hollow. What they believe is that it IS just by chance. They say all there is are the molecules, and we know it's not true. Even with all the best selling books saying that believers in God are nutcases, we'd be crazy to give up our faith just to please them. Hey, here's a good quote from American Spectator a few months back:

Among certain sectors of the media, for example, it is an article of faith that those who believe in God, or advocate principles supporting that belief, are just a mob of Bible-thumping, knuckle-dragging, Scripture-spouting, hellfire and brimstone-preaching, rightwing, gun-toting, bigoted, homophobic, moralistic, paternalistic, polyester-wearing, mascara-smeared, false-eyelashed, SUV-driving, Wal-Mart shopping, big hair, big gut, fat butt, holy-rolling, snake-handling, Limbaugh-listening, Bambi-shooting, trailer-park-dwelling, uneducated, ignorant, backwater, hayseed, hick, inbred, pinhead rubes, mostly from the South, or places no better than the South, who voted for Bush.


9 posted on 03/11/2006 6:12:52 PM PST by guitarist
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To: guitarist
So, try this one ~ life is exceedingly complex. It is also exceedingly ancient. In fact, it is so complex and so ancient that it has developed or had developed for it variations that allow life to undertake to exist, even thrive, in every environment possible.

That is to say, life is hardly the delicate flower early Evolutionists imagined it to be.

Of all the possible Universes, there are none where life cannot manage to find sustenance ~ and it's just a matter of time where even the worst of all possible states of existence will see life move in and do its thing.

I think you get down to the question of which came first ~ God or life.

10 posted on 03/11/2006 6:26:21 PM PST by muawiyah (-)
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To: guitarist
Among certain sectors of the media, for example, it is an article of faith that those who believe in God, or advocate principles supporting that belief, are just a mob of Bible-thumping, knuckle-dragging, Scripture-spouting, hellfire and brimstone-preaching, rightwing, gun-toting, bigoted, homophobic, moralistic, paternalistic, polyester-wearing, mascara-smeared, false-eyelashed, SUV-driving, Wal-Mart shopping, big hair, big gut, fat butt, holy-rolling, snake-handling, Limbaugh-listening, Bambi-shooting, trailer-park-dwelling, uneducated, ignorant, backwater, hayseed, hick, inbred, pinhead rubes, mostly from the South, or places no better than the South, who voted for Bush.

I love it -- the best and longest string of adjectives, hypenated or otherwise, I've seen in one sentence.

11 posted on 03/11/2006 6:26:35 PM PST by rhema ("Break the conventions, keep the commandments." -- G. K. Chesterton)
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To: guitarist
And you typed/spelled all the adjectives correctly, too, unlike this poster: hypenated = hyphenated.
12 posted on 03/11/2006 6:30:05 PM PST by rhema ("Break the conventions, keep the commandments." -- G. K. Chesterton)
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To: rhema

And you typed/spelled all the adjectives correctly, too, unlike this poster: hypenated = hyphenated.<<

I like hypenated, it is descriptive and funny at the same time. You should copyright it.

LOL

DK


13 posted on 03/11/2006 6:36:26 PM PST by Dark Knight
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To: guitarist
Among certain sectors of the media, for example, it is an article of faith that those who believe in God, or advocate principles supporting that belief, are just a mob of Bible-thumping, knuckle-dragging, Scripture-spouting, hellfire and brimstone-preaching, rightwing, gun-toting, bigoted, homophobic, moralistic, paternalistic, polyester-wearing, mascara-smeared, false-eyelashed, SUV-driving, Wal-Mart shopping, big hair, big gut, fat butt, holy-rolling, snake-handling, Limbaugh-listening, Bambi-shooting, trailer-park-dwelling, uneducated, ignorant, backwater, hayseed, hick, inbred, pinhead rubes, mostly from the South, or places no better than the South, who voted for Bush.

LOL!!

But in all seriousness..most of us Conservatives have a bit more class than to shop at Wal-Mart :)

14 posted on 03/11/2006 6:39:01 PM PST by Windsong (Jesus Saves, but Buddha makes incremental backups)
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To: Windsong
most of us Conservatives have a bit more class than to shop at Wal-Mart

That may be true (never been inside one), but it's also true, let's admit it, that we like to shoot Bambi!

15 posted on 03/11/2006 6:44:09 PM PST by Revolting cat! ("In the end, nothing explains anything.")
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To: Revolting cat!
Just visting half a dozen Wal-Marts in Southern Indiana (to see what all the fuss was about) we found 5 different fake deer for use in stake-outs.

Bambi doesn't have a chance.

16 posted on 03/11/2006 6:50:20 PM PST by muawiyah (-)
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To: Zender500

hmmm... some interesting stuff. FYI, you might find this interesting:

http://www.neoperspectives.com/theoryofgod.htm


17 posted on 03/11/2006 6:51:57 PM PST by traviskicks (http://www.neoperspectives.com/israel_palestine_conflict.htm)
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To: Zender500

Just a reminder, 04/01/06 is "National Athiest Day"

Psalm 53:1


18 posted on 03/11/2006 7:15:33 PM PST by uptoolate
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To: Zender500

How many liberals can whine on the head of a pin?


19 posted on 03/11/2006 7:16:58 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (Is tractus pro pensio.)
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To: guitarist
"Evolutionists' claims that evolution is more than "chance" or "accident" ring hollow. What they believe is that it IS just by chance."

Stochastic does not mean random.

"They say all there is are the molecules, and we know it's not true."

Sure; we know that there are ions as well. I think you mean that scientists deal only with natural phenomena. That is true, as any other kind is beyond scientific inquiry.

"Even with all the best selling books saying that believers in God are nutcases..."

Citations please.

"Among certain sectors of the media, for example, it is an article of faith that those who believe in God..."

As most people in the USA who accept evolution are also Christian, what is your point?
20 posted on 03/11/2006 7:19:40 PM PST by CarolinaGuitarman ("There is grandeur in this view of life...")
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