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Rat-Squirrel Not Extinct After All (Scientists off 11 Million years)
The AP via Yahoo! News ^ | March 9, 2006 | Lauran Neergaard

Posted on 03/09/2006 2:46:21 PM PST by new yorker 77

It has the face of a rat and the tail of a skinny squirrel — and scientists say this creature discovered living in central Laos is pretty special: It's a species believed to have been extinct for 11 million years.

The long-whiskered rodent made international headlines last spring when biologists declared they'd discovered a brand new species, nicknamed the Laotian rock rat.

It turns out the little guy isn't new after all, but a rare kind of survivor: a member of a family until now known only from fossils.

Nor is it a rat. This species, called Diatomyidae, looks more like small squirrels or tree shrews, said paleontologist Mary Dawson of Pittsburgh's Carnegie Museum of Natural History.

Dawson, with colleagues in France and China, report the creature's new identity in Friday's edition of the journal Science.

The resemblance is "absolutely striking," Dawson said. As soon as her team spotted reports about the rodent's discovery, "we thought, 'My goodness, this is not a new family. We've known it from the fossil record.'"

They set out to prove that through meticulous comparisons between the bones of today's specimens and fossils found in China and elsewhere in Asia.

To reappear after 11 million years is more exciting than if the rodent really had been a new species, said George Schaller, a naturalist with the Wildlife Conservation Society, which unveiled the creature's existence last year. Indeed, such reappearances are so rare that paleontologists dub them "the Lazarus effect."

"It shows you it's well worth looking around in this world, still, to see what's out there," Schaller said.

The nocturnal rodent lives in Laotian forests largely unexplored by outsiders, because of the geographic remoteness and history of political turmoil.

Schaller calls the area "an absolute wonderland," because biologists who have ventured in have found unique animals, like a type of wild ox called the saola, barking deer, and never-before-seen bats. Dawson describes it as a prehistoric zoo, teeming with information about past and present biodiversity.

All the attention to the ancient rodent will be "wonderful for conservation," Schaller said. "This way, Laos will be proud of that region for all these new animals, which will help conservation in that some of the forests, I hope, will be preserved."

Locals call the rodent kha-nyou. Scientists haven't yet a bagged a breathing one, only the bodies of those recently caught by hunters or for sale at meat markets, where researchers with the New York-based conservation society first spotted the creature.

Now the challenge is to trap some live ones, and calculate how many still exist to tell whether the species is endangered, Dawson said.

Copyright © 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. The information contained in the AP News report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press.

Copyright © 2006 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: allsquirrelsarerats; bloodbath; squirrelarmy; squirrels
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To: Right Wing Professor
Oh no not defensive at all.
You evos are the ones who are ALWAYS having
to defend one thing after another.
and when you are defenseless you call names
Rather childish don't you think.
121 posted on 03/09/2006 9:26:17 PM PST by WKB
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To: new yorker 77
11 million years and its still a rat, didn't "evolve" into anything?

There goes Darwin's theory, right in the crapper.
122 posted on 03/09/2006 9:45:37 PM PST by Beagle8U (An "Earth First" kinda guy ( when we finish logging here, we'll start on the other planets.)
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To: WKB

Really now for a "so called" Right "Wing Nut" Professor
is that the best you can come up with?
Calling names and accusing me of being an acid head.
My My that's as weak as the ToE.<<

Be nice to the Perfessor, he thinks he has a rapier wit. That in itself explains a few other delusional areas.

DK


123 posted on 03/09/2006 9:47:11 PM PST by Dark Knight
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To: WKB

Darn, and I was hoping for another song. Purple Haze, maybe?


124 posted on 03/09/2006 9:58:44 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: spetznaz

cool cat...


125 posted on 03/09/2006 10:21:42 PM PST by Jonx6
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To: caffe
FYI, DId you know that when a fossil is found in a stratum to which it "theoretically" does not belong, evolutionists use several means of explaining this discrepancy. For example, if it is supposed to be older than the containing bed, it can be said to have been redeposited from an earlier eroded deposit or to indicate the survival of its particular species longer than had been previously believed.

If it is supposed to be younger than its stratum, it can be explained as due to the reworking and mixing of 2 originally distinct deposits or else as showing that the animal dates from earlier antiquity than previously thought. OFTEN, discovery of such an anomalous fossil has been deemed sufficient justification for redating the entire formation to conform to the SUPPOSED age of the particular fossil.

LOL! You point out that if a fossil is found in younger strata than it's ever been found before, then either the strata has been mis-dated or the fossil species has lived longer than previously thought. And if the fossil is found in older strata than it's ever been found in before, then either the strata has been mis-dated or the fossil species has existed since earlier times than had previously been thought.

And to you, this act of changing our understanding of what happened when new, surprising data comes to light - is a BAD thing.

Oooookaaaaaayyyyyy...

126 posted on 03/09/2006 10:44:38 PM PST by jennyp (WHAT I'M READING NOW: Life and Solitude in Easter Island by Verdugo-Binimelis)
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To: Right Wing Professor; WKB

"Darn, and I was hoping for another song. Purple Haze, maybe?"


It took you half an hour to come up with that?

Pitiful...


"You evos are the ones who are ALWAYS having
to defend one thing after another.
and when you are defenseless you call names
Rather childish don't you think."


Apparently, you are right, WKB.


127 posted on 03/09/2006 10:49:02 PM PST by dixiechick2000 (There ought to be one day-- just one-- when there is open season on senators. ~~ Will Rogers)
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To: dixiechick2000

It took you half an hour to come up with that?

Pitiful... <<

It's that rapier wit showing up, combined with delusions of adequacy. Once an unloved nerd, always an unloved and hostile nerd.

It's sad, and you are right, he is to pitied and not to be mocked.

But then again, putting a kick me sign on the perfessor is too much fun, talk me out of it...dixiechick2000

By the way, this will keep him awake for hours. He is that pompous.

Eh Perfessor?

DK


128 posted on 03/09/2006 10:56:42 PM PST by Dark Knight
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To: Ichneumon
At some point, you have to admit the existence of an intelligence which was *not* originated by the crafting of some prior intelligence.

Every single theory of ???genesis must ultimately say... "it is what it is" ... This is not a concept exclusive to ID...

Even evolutionists at some point must shrug their shoulders..
129 posted on 03/09/2006 11:05:25 PM PST by darbymcgill (FRevolution: The science of mutating concepts and definitions while tap dancing)
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To: Dark Knight; Right Wing Professor; WKB

Thank you, DK.
But, you need to abide by the rules of the forum.
You should ping those whom you are addressing.
You've been here longer than I have.
You should know that.

That's the Deep South in me coming out.
We are ALL about manners. ;o)

That being said, I see you are living in the NW.
So am I.
Is it snowing in your neck of the woods?

Now...I'm off for the night.

It has been very nice meeting you. ;o)


130 posted on 03/09/2006 11:09:11 PM PST by dixiechick2000 (There ought to be one day-- just one-- when there is open season on senators. ~~ Will Rogers)
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To: dixiechick2000

Never learned the multiple ping thing, please enlighten me or show me the direction. I like learning things that are useful, and I am sure the Perfessor knows I would be happy to say any of the things I related to you, directly to him. I have.

I was driving earlier and it was snowing enough to slow traffic because of the visibility. It was beautiful. We will have a world of white cold wet stuff tomorrow, and I look forward to the pictures I may have the opportunity to take.

Night.

DK


131 posted on 03/09/2006 11:20:18 PM PST by Dark Knight
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To: WKB; Right Wing Professor; Dark Knight
The Prof might not accept us..,

but HE will accept him

and that gives WOLF hope

Salute

Wolf
132 posted on 03/09/2006 11:38:12 PM PST by RunningWolf (Vet US Army Air Cav 1975)
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To: Dark Knight
Never learned the multiple ping thing,

There is a TO: field, right above where you type in your pearls of wisdom...

Just put a semi-colon ";" between each of the freepers nicks you want to send the message to...
133 posted on 03/09/2006 11:45:41 PM PST by darbymcgill (FRevolution: The science of mutating concepts and definitions while tap dancing)
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To: darbymcgill

I just looked at it and it is really easy. Sorry.

How embarassing.

DK


134 posted on 03/09/2006 11:49:29 PM PST by Dark Knight
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To: WKB; Right Wing Professor
There was a time when several academics (some atheist some Harvard) were acknowledged 'acid heads'

The Prof is Harvard, apparently is an atheist.., hmmm, hmmmmm.

Wolf
135 posted on 03/09/2006 11:55:24 PM PST by RunningWolf (Vet US Army Air Cav 1975)
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To: Dark Knight
Don't be sorry or embarrassed, I had to learn from someone myself...

now more freepers can have access to The Dark Knight.
136 posted on 03/10/2006 12:02:32 AM PST by darbymcgill (FRevolution: The science of mutating concepts and definitions while tap dancing)
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To: darbymcgill

Hey, I'm the guy people throw their digital watches at in a time change.

I have to have those feelings. Deserved or not.

But I hope to continue to grow. Even though pain may accompany growth.

Embarassment is just a part of that pain.

Thanks for the help.

DK


137 posted on 03/10/2006 12:12:21 AM PST by Dark Knight
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To: Elpasser
For those of us who subscribe to a "young Earth," creationist view, this comes as no surprise. These fossils, like virtually all others, were "dated" in accordance with their presumed place on the evolutionary tree. (Check out the criticisms of circular fossil dating even among mainstream biologists). If you removed evolutionary theory bias from the dating equation, there would have been no basis for the 11 million year age of the fossils in the first place. I'm only surprised that biologists didn't choose to disbelieve their "lying eyes" in favor of evolutionary dogma!

The only doubt biologists have about the fossil record is that it may be far older then we believe. Creationists tend to claim that carbondating often gives wrong estimates. That is true, however when a wrong date is given it almost always turns out to be far older than the carbon dating suggested, so i suggest creationists should stop using the carbon dating insecurity as 'evidence'?
138 posted on 03/10/2006 1:54:00 AM PST by S0122017 (Coincidence is the fool's blindfold)
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To: bvw
I remember seeing a study about squirrels and their habit of burying nuts and acorns. Was folk widsom that the squirrels did so to store the nuts -- the study showed squirels had no memory of where they hid each nut. So why do they do it? To plant trees. Good design that.

No memory? I think you should read better science, or perhaps read the articles twice. Squirrels really do have a good memory, they don't remember EVERY nut, considering they bury freaking hundreds to survive the wintertime it is not a surprise. Besides if a squirrels forgets a few nuts, then the trees that grow out of it will one day feed it's offspring.
Even more so, there was a type of crow found living on some island that may have some of the best memory ever described. They can bury thousands of food items, and find them again months later. Every single one,..that's better then my windows computer. It seems to lose data a lot.
139 posted on 03/10/2006 2:08:09 AM PST by S0122017 (Coincidence is the fool's blindfold)
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To: caffe
The evolutionists have no concept of time. They simply lengthen it more and more in hopes of accomodating the science that speculates how long it would take for a fin to turn into a leg or jell-o into a brain. Shadows and illusions

lol
Yes or how long it takes for a night to turn into a day or a nut to turn into a tree. O wait those things do happen. Oops. Maybe there is something to evolution then huh.
140 posted on 03/10/2006 2:12:18 AM PST by S0122017 (Coincidence is the fool's blindfold)
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