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To: A. Pole
You got it wrong. The extreme stratification of wealth HELPS socialism to win. Wide distribution of wealth PREVENTS victory of socialism.

What you're pointing out here is what the likes of the Cato Institute never seem to understand: that economics is not simply a numbers game based on reason alone.

There are people involved, making decisions that are almost never entirely rational; and quite often making their decisions based on fundamentally irrational impulses.

In terms of stratifiction helping socialism to win, you're absolutely correct. Whether it's right or wrong, it's just human nature to think ill thoughts about why that small group is extremely rich, and most everybody else is barely scraping by. A stout defense of the status quo by the very rich, simply aggravates the issue. Cato can come up with all sorts of analysis to show why that's just hunky dory, and the best possible thing. Commies, however, are tapped into that human tendency to resent those whose lives appear to be built on their labor.

What's particularly interesting here is that the idea of strict "I got mine" capitalism tends to produce and defend the stratification of wealth; whereas a paying more than is strictly necessary -- to take care of those less fortunate, I suppose -- both spreads the wealth and diffuses the dissent noted above.

24 posted on 02/24/2006 7:09:39 AM PST by r9etb
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To: r9etb
There are people involved, making decisions that are almost never entirely rational; and quite often making their decisions based on fundamentally irrational impulses.

Yes, but it is freemarketeers who are irrational. If you have choice between having modest food on the table, modest roof over your head, very basic medical care and education for your children or having only "free" market system with "free" press you will chose the first.

Socialism with human face is better than capitalism without human face.

25 posted on 02/24/2006 7:25:42 AM PST by A. Pole (In 2001 top 5% owned 60% of national wealth, while bottom 60% owned 4%)
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To: r9etb
Problem is the assumptions here are all wrong. When someone on the end of the food chain gets a big jump, he does NOT get it by taking away from those at the other end. This is what is known as the Zero Sum Fallacy. The assumption that the economic pie is finite and thus gains can only be made if other lose. That is rabidly ignorant. The pie continually changes size, it is NOT a fixed amount.
30 posted on 02/24/2006 7:44:54 AM PST by MNJohnnie ("Good men don't wait for the polls. They stand on principle and fight."-Soul Seeker)
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To: r9etb
Observation: human beings are emotional beings. Emotional reactions operate in an instant without effort and reason takes time and effort. What you end up saying is that socialism can help but win out in the end.

71 posted on 02/24/2006 11:35:47 AM PST by William Terrell (Individuals can exist without government but government can't exist without individuals.)
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To: r9etb; All
This has been one of the finest (and informative) threads on this matter I've read. This is due in large part to, IMO, the tenor and tone of your posts -- as well as a few others.

The usual screams of "Socialist!" and snotty questions like, "So you want government to take care of you?" are mostly missing.

Thanks, all.

(Oh, and no one has posted personal attacks on Mr. Green, so far.)

80 posted on 02/24/2006 2:58:50 PM PST by WilliamofCarmichael (Hillary is the she in shenanigans.)
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