Posted on 01/29/2006 11:14:04 AM PST by John Jorsett
After two decades of use, the U.S. Department of Defense is getting rid of its Beretta M9 9mm pistol, and going back to the 11.4mm (.45 caliber) weapon. There have been constant complaints about the lesser (compared to the .45) hitting power of the 9mm. And in the last few years, SOCOM (Special Operations Command) and the marines have officially adopted .45 caliber pistols as “official alternatives” to the M9 Beretta. But now SOCOM has been given the task of finding a design that will be suitable as the JCP (Joint Combat Pistol). Various designs are being evaluated, but all must be .45 caliber and have a eight round magazine (at least), and high capacity mags holding up to 15. The new .45 will also have a rail up top for attachments, and be able to take a silencer. Length must be no more than 9.65 inches, and width no more than 1.53 inches.
The M1911 .45 caliber pistol that the 9mm Beretta replaced in 1985, was, as its nomenclature implied, an old design. There are several modern designs out there for .45 caliber pistols that are lighter, carry more ammo and are easier to maintain than the pre-World War I M1911 (which is actually about a century old, as a design). The Department of Defense plans to buy 645,000 JCPs.
SOCOM will, with input from other branches, handle the evaluation and final selection. This will take place this year, and if the military moves with unaccustomed alacrity, troops could start getting their JCPs next year. But don’t hold your breath.
The problem isn't the pistol...it's the ammunition used.
ABSOLUTELY....if Pope John PaulII were still alive you could ask him what a 9mm does....
He got hit with multiple rounds that stopped short of his vitals...
Similarly the move to convert the nuclear boomers to carry US Seals to "Combat Terrorism" is the biggest P.O.S. in recent military history.
which pistol which ammo I posted a bunch of times...what do you mean.
In use the 9mm has beyond a shadow of a doubt proven that it is ineffective of stopping the enemy. The .45 has proven that it is effective.
The 9mm is a favorite of gangstas and punks because it is available in smaller framed models and more concealable. There is a reason that the FBI and front line troops have gone back to the .45. It works. The 9 doesnt.
My EDC is an STI Trojan with modifications. My throw away is a Llama that I bought off the street for $85. Either one of these will put 20 in the black at 20 yards in 15 seconds. When there is a standard on the street, it doesnt make sense to attempt to lower it.
Good to hear.
Is that your CCW?
A sidearm in the military is not meant for accuracy (although the .45 has been demonstrated to be one of the most accurate pistol cartridges ever) but is meant to be used for point defense and close-quarters combat.
The 9mm has been a failure due to its inability to stop crazed, junked-up Muslims and the poor quality/reliability of the Beretta M9. Funny, it was crazed, junked-up Filipinos that made the Army adopt the .45 nearly 100 years ago!
Are you in law enforcement?
Last time I fired an M1911 .45 I couldn't have killed myself with a shot to the temple it was so inaccurate.
I hope you are not getting this information from "The Gun Zone" I have heard of kb's on 1911s, HK, Sig, they all do it, I've never seen a final report as to why it did it, always armchair QBs reading some first claim with no evidence to support it then running off at the mouth to everyone that will listen that this particular gun is worse than the rest. Portland's PD issue with Glock .45s as one example, I have never read a follow up that stated the actual findings of what happened, yet I go to local gun shops and hear salespeople claim Glocks are bad because of that one incident of which they know no more than the weapon failed.
So is my Springfield Armory .45.
"As I understand it, the Geneva Convention prohibits the use of hollow points."
Non-state terrorist enemies of the US are not parties to the Geneva Conventions...so screw it.. (wink)
"3.7.6. Weapon Shot Counter. The JCP should have a weapon shot counter to record shots fired (O). The shot counter, if provided, shall have a data collection device that connects the shot counter to a computer. The shot counter, if provided, shall have a Microsoft compatible software program that works in conjunction with the shot counter and the data collection device to allow the weapon data to be downloaded and stored on a computer. The shot counter, if provided, shall not interfere with any operations of the JCP."
Going back to .45 is a great idea, but why the hell would they need this?
Oh, really? Can I practice on your car? Is it a Batmobile?
Jess, the problem is not the pistol or the ammo it is the shooter who only takes it out and shoots it once a year to prove that the pistol isnt proficient.
I'm just picturing a 105 lb woman firing six shots at a target 10 yards away.
Illegal.
One word: Kimber
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