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You only get that because their cost of living is lower. They aren't that much better than local talent and that's my experience. They may be good; but, they aren't that good. I'd even argue that they aren't any better because they aren't. The only thing that makes them of value to anyone is they're comparable and cheaper. Use tariffs to balance the field as they are meant to and it's amazing how dumb and how big a waste of time it suddenly is to hire Chinese coders. It's so blatent that nobody did it before recent times because it really wasn't cost effective. Cost effective = money is the primary concern. Amazing how most of you can talk in terms of money; but narry a one of you has any notion of propriety and what's good for your coutry and fellow countrymen. And, no, I'm not the equivelant of an IT bolt tightener. Nor are coders. Coding takes substantial thought to do properly else you get the shlock that Microsoft puts out and thinks the best since peanut butter. The reality is that Wordperfect did it better; but, MS did it cheaper and now everyone is stuck suffering with the result of doing it cheaper and the better no longer exists. Over what? Money. If the better value for the money is getting it done right without hassle and extra expense, Wordperfect was the right solution. MS was cheaper till Wordperfect disappeared, now it costs about the same and arrives with hassle and expense. But it, at least, was local competition. And there was a difference in coding - MS did it halfway and now we're paying the price for it in spades. Same thing happens in china.. they produce the goods for a fraction of the price in labor and send us a product that is fractionally as good. So rather than buying once and keeping it for ten years, we buy at a fraction of the price and have to buy one a year just to have something fuctional because it breaks... That's the common story. The worst case is obviously, well, worse. rofl

Personally, you may be in high demand. That doesn't protect your position. The moment someone in China comes available, you will be expendable no matter how valuable you think your position is. It means nothing. You have no future and no right to your job, no expectation toward security - isn't that the treason lobby mantra... Who do you think you're kidding! That isn't a question. I watched irreplaceable people get replaced in droves. You are nothing special and are deluding yourself no matter what your area of expertise. The only people that aren't expendable are the ones at the head of the organization. And that won't last long if the chinese realize that the executives are costing the state too much.. If you think little guys are bolt turners and you aren't, you've got some learning to do. My job required problem solving skills and technical knowledge that not everyone has. I've talked to college grads who don't understand how windows really works but have it degrees. Theory and practical experience are a world apart. But so are American and Chinese workers, and that doesn't stop anyone from replacing you with a Chinese worker who knows the theory at .37 an hour. Wake up. You are a throwaway in denial in the face of your own arguments. If you're gonna parade the beast around as harmless, you best kiss it, cause it's got you too.

The only thing that makes them of value to anyone is they're comparable and cheaper.

We have a word here: C A P I T A L I S M.

Use tariffs to balance the field as they are meant to and it's amazing how dumb and how big a waste of time it suddenly is to hire Chinese coders.

Translation: You can't make yourself a worthwhile value proposition.

And, no, I'm not the equivelant of an IT bolt tightener. Nor are coders. Coding takes substantial thought to do properly else you get the shlock that Microsoft puts out and thinks the best since peanut butter.

I have been coding for over 30 years. It is bolt-tightening. I enjoy it and still do it when I get a chance, but it is far and away the easiest thing in the world.

...Over what? Money. ...

Oh noo!!!! They want to make money!! Those scoundrels! Don't they know that the point is to keep people employed?? Havoc decides what is "best" NOT the marketpkace! What a bunch of schloes!

Personally, you may be in high demand. That doesn't protect your position. The moment someone in China comes available, you will be expendable no matter how valuable you think your position is.

How many people in China have 30 years in development, mainframes, Operating Systems Installation and Management, Computer Operations and Computer Operations Management, Database Administration, Large Project management, Network Administration, detailed knowledge of Financials, Human Resources, Payroll, CRM, can run a large project and can speak perfect English? How many people in the USA?

If for some reason they don't want me to be Manager, I just fall back to being an Oracle DBA or DB2 DBA (or Manager thereof). Or Ops Management. Or Network Administration.

If you think little guys are bolt turners and you aren't, you've got some learning to do. My job required problem solving skills and technical knowledge that not everyone has. I've talked to college grads who don't understand how windows really works but have it degrees.

Buahahahahaa!! Windows Support? You do Windows Support? No wonder you are so bitter. How in the world is Windows support and integral part of an entire strategic or tactical. Almost everyone outsources that anyway (not always offshore -- my company outsources to a USA company that puts people in our offices). I don't know of anyone that is calling for Windows people in a vacuum. Now if you knew applications such as SCM or ERP or Windows as part of an OS theory knowledge base, that might be saleable. But if you posess fewer than 5 technical skills than that is your problem.

You decide you want to be an auto mechanic, don't be upset when they stop using carbeurators.