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To: Dog Gone; Ancesthntr; archy; Badray; B4Ranch; Blood of Tyrants; CodeToad; coloradan; ...
At best, it will temporarily slow it down.

What a steaming load of bullcrap.

Here is what most of our southern border looks like: there is no fence at all, just whatever is left over from some forgotten cattle fence, built privately to keep U.S. cattle from wandering freely into Mexico. For comparison, below it is a sample of an inexpensive but highly effective double border fence system, with a plowed strip to reveal footprints.

Here is what some of San Diego County has, a wall made of rusty VN era runway mats. The corrugations are parallel, to make climbing easier. These illegals were spotted by unexpected civilian volunteers, and jumped back over the border.

Here is what the border looks like where the runway mat wall exists. Mexico begins on the other side of the ineffective rusty wall, which actually helps the smugglers, by hiding their movements until the BP has driven out of sight.

This is how "the game" is played. Smugglers hide on the other side of the wall with their dope and/or their illegals, out of sight of the USBP. They wait for the highly visible white BP vehicle to drive over the distant hills. Lookouts with cell phones and walkie talkies report on the location of the BP units. They know with certainty that "the coast is clear" for an hour or two, and the smugglers and illegals hop the fence and run into the scrub only 50 yards away. From there, they are out of sight, and they walk 1-2 miles to holding houses. Then they wait for nightfall, and are picked up and driven in vans to LA or San Diego.

Lastly, below is the Duncan Hunter 15' fence, which is already being built along a few "showplace" miles of San Diego, mainly near the ports of entry. The House has approved building 700 miles of it, which would be a great start. As you can see, the rusty runway wall is seen at left. In areas with the 15 foot fence, dope smugglers and illegals will have to cross 50-100 yards of open sand road ("the government road" as it is called) before starting to try to get over the 15 foot fence. It's extremely tough, and resists cutting. Attacking the fence would have to be done in the open, right on the open sand, in full view of cameras. This type of fence, on the U.S. side of the government road, will give the USBP a barrier to patrol, instead of forcing them to chase illegals around 100,000 square miles of wide open frontier land, which is a fool's errand.

So don't tell us modern fence systems won't work, we're not all as stupid as six year old children.

Be honest for once, and admit your true agenda: open borders, and an end to American sovereignty.

132 posted on 12/28/2005 8:12:06 AM PST by Travis McGee (--- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com ---)
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To: Travis McGee

Let me restate this one more time because you couldn't grasp it the first time.

Even an effective fence will divert the illegal immigration to other areas of entry.

At best, you will inconvenience them.



140 posted on 12/28/2005 8:41:13 AM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Travis McGee
Cornyn Speaks on Immigration (opposes a fence).

AND approves of a guest worker program. Guess who won't be getting my vote when he comes up for re-election?

144 posted on 12/28/2005 8:59:58 AM PST by planekT (<- http://www.wadejacoby.com/pedro/ ->)
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To: Travis McGee

Agree a proper fence is a must, those who say it won't work just don't understand the layered defense in depth that such a device will offer in the "populated regions" such as your AO. Folks don't seem to understand that this problem is solved "only" with a combination of physical, environmental, electronic and human deterrents with added political pressure on bordering countries (cut all aid to canookistan and mexico if they can't secure their side) and a legal force of arrest for those that employ or harbor such criminals & deportation of those found .

Cornyn is a panderer....I have met him and spoke with him during visits to my arena. He's a typical polidiot whos all yes, yes , yes, I agree to the person in front of him.

Just my opinions of course.....Neighborhood watch programs expanded to the borders such as we see with the minutemen is key for areas where such crossings are popular for the criminals entering the CONUS illegally.

Stay safe !!


147 posted on 12/28/2005 9:06:57 AM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. ©)
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To: Travis McGee

Well, since he is a Republican, I'm just gonna trust him.

/Gagging sarcasm.

If he removes all doors and locks from his house; if he doesn't call 911 or try to eject any uninvited people that have entered his home, I might be more inclined to believe him to be sincere. Extremely stupid and naive, but sincere.


161 posted on 12/28/2005 10:09:51 AM PST by Badray (In the hands of bureaucrat, a clip board can be as dangerous to liberty as a gun.)
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To: Travis McGee

Another one of the "won't work - can't be done - costs too much" defeatists who continue to show up on our immigration threads. Scratch 'em deep enough, and we too often find a pro-illegal alien enabler, apologist or supporter. No proposed fix is good enough and all are doomed to failure. There isn't a loyal American conservative in the group. Their slogan is "Lets do nothing some more".


169 posted on 12/28/2005 10:51:36 AM PST by Czar (StillFedUptotheTeeth@Washington)
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To: Travis McGee
Having just returned from a trip to TX, We don't need a fence we need Force Recon/ SEAL Team Wartime ROE on the border + fence, just snatch and throw on helo and return immediately, those that resist well you know what Marines and SEALS do WIN AT ANY COST
260 posted on 12/28/2005 11:11:52 PM PST by vrwc0915
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