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1 posted on 12/21/2005 12:09:45 AM PST by nickcarraway
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To: nickcarraway

what a convoluted series of events. most interesting was the part of the article that states the guy who commanded the murder of the israelis was named afif. his mother is jewish and his father christian, which makes him jewish. good job for golda in surmising the situation correctly, kill all those who kill us and nevermind everything else. does golda have any children, id vote for them to be president of the usa with that attitude.


2 posted on 12/21/2005 12:29:42 AM PST by son of caesar (son of caesar)
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To: nickcarraway
Spielberg is the wrong person to make this movie. His "making them all human" sentiment is telling. No, it's not constructive to make the murderers and terrorists Darth Vaders, but it's amoral to make them people just doing a job.

The amorality of moral equivalence will be our undoing. Spielberg simply isn't equipped to handle this kind of material. I know many here will disagree, but Schindler's List and Saving Private Ryan (and Amistad) are embarassingly cartoony, for all their amazingly good filmmaking.

6 posted on 12/21/2005 12:52:17 AM PST by Darkwolf377 (Warning: Adult language, but great Christmas message: http://foamy.libertech.net/noxmas.swf)
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To: nickcarraway
I can't stomach the whole review. . . however "focusing on revenge" isn't new and innovative. In the. . . I think late 80's maybe early 90's there was a movie (maybe one of those few, at the time, made for HBO movies) called "sword of Gideon" A POWERFUL movie. It showed the collateral damage, it showed the indifference of those hungry for revenge, and it reduced the effort for vengeance into an irrational act, which I think is true. However, it also shows that you aren't exactly wrong. There is, and was, in "the sword of Gideon" a very anti-israeli death squad overtone, and that is EXACTLY how it was depicted, but I did not leave that stand up to take a leak from that movie going "F!'n Israel HOW DARE THEY!" In fact, "The Sword of Gideon" did a very good job of depicting the horrible acts of each scumbag that was being assassinated as he was targeted.

The point I took from "The Sword of Gideon" was relatively honest. The overtones were sympathetic to collateral damage, but not to the specific targets. The terrorists were terrorists, and the zealous hit squad was a zealous hit squad, the only thing in the movie that might be "sympathetic" was the death of the innocents. The movie did a very good job of that. . .the only disappointment, in terms of politics at that time, was the last significant statement by the protagonist "If we keep taking an eye for an eye, soon the whole world will be blind!" and then I think it ends with the protagonist killing another badguy openly, and then being slaughtered himself.

It's been some time, but if you wanna talk about plot complexity, rather than thematic complexity, then I think I would and will remember "The Sword of Gideon" as a better polemic, than Munich.
7 posted on 12/21/2005 12:52:27 AM PST by wickedpinto (The road map to peace is a straight line down an Israeli rifle.)
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To: nickcarraway

"The only thing that's going to solve this is rational minds, a lot of sitting down and talking until you're blue in the gills," says Spielberg."

Wrong, Steve. War would solve it.

A war unfought does not go away. It festers and bubbles until it has it's day.


13 posted on 12/21/2005 2:43:29 AM PST by TalBlack
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To: nickcarraway
Munich might have been a "Secret Masterpiece" if he had allowed himself to tell the complex truth about the Jews and the Palestinians. Instead he turned it into another Indiana Jones.

Thanks for the review. I won't be seeing it.

16 posted on 12/21/2005 4:03:28 AM PST by Dr. Scarpetta
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To: dennisw; Cachelot; Nix 2; veronica; Catspaw; knighthawk; Alouette; Optimist; weikel; Lent; GregB; ..
If you'd like to be on or off this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.
Articles on Israel can also be found by clicking the keyword Israel.

---------------------------

17 posted on 12/21/2005 4:50:25 AM PST by SJackson (There's no such thing as too late, that's why they invented death. Walter Matthau)
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To: nickcarraway

GREAT article. I feel more educated now that I read it and I won't bother with Spielberg movies any longer now that success has gone to his head and the Lollywood or Hellywood Liberal magnet has sucked him into its realm.


19 posted on 12/21/2005 5:40:54 AM PST by RoadTest (Religion never saved a soul - that's Jesus' job.)
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To: nickcarraway

The title chosen for this article was a bit misleading. I thought maybe Spielberg was taking flak from Jews for making this dumb movie. If he is there is no mention of it here.


20 posted on 12/21/2005 5:52:29 AM PST by SBprone
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To: nickcarraway; dennisw; SJackson
What a depressing article. Yet important to read. I have long had a debate going with my brother, who thinks Spielberg is a crappy director, who makes mushy, unimportant films. I have to concede now that he was right all along. But from the sounds of it, this is a film only a Jew-hater could make, which goes beyond mush.

The notion of the strong Jew fighting back terrifies some Jews, for reasons I will never understand. In their world Jews must always be conciliatory, acquiescent, and wracked with guilt. But that mindset was never part of my Jewish education.

Kushner is clearly the force behind this farce, but Spielberg hired him. Any goodwill Spielberg garnered after Schindler's List he has now forfeited. I'll say it again, a few Jews being saved by a Gentile apparently get Spielberg's empathy, but a nation of Jews refusing to be the victims of the new Nazis appalls him, as he sits in his vast estate in Pacific Palisades, or wherever he's hunkered down in his fantasy world these days.

I guess I need to see this film, to talk about it in a more informed manner, but I don't relish it. I doubt I'll be able to sit through it, if Spielberg's comments in Time are a true indication of what animated him in the making of the film.

21 posted on 12/21/2005 7:10:25 AM PST by veronica (....."send Congressman Murtha a message: that cowards cut and run, Marines never do.")
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To: nickcarraway

I think the best response to Spielberg's tunnelvision is for people to take the money they might spend on a ticket to "Munich" and instead buy the DVD of "One Day in September" and/or "21 Hours at Munich," both of which came out this week.


22 posted on 12/21/2005 7:31:01 AM PST by william clark
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To: nickcarraway
Time magazine suggests, "Everyone in the movie is human, you feel for them all."

Thank you Steven for making people more sympathetic to vicious terrorists who rip families apart.

Spielberg is a piece of shit.

23 posted on 12/21/2005 7:45:43 AM PST by montag813
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To: nickcarraway
The biggest enemy in the region is intransigence

OH PUH-LEEEEZZZZ! Open your eyes Spielberg!

The Palestinians, particularly Arafat, repeatedly offered concessions in public yet repeatedly called for Israel’s' destruction in the Arab world. This is the same Arab world that offered Palestine NOTHING but support for terror against Israel and any of Israel’s allies. At the same time the two greatest contributors of funds for the building of Palestinian infrastructure and for relief were the US and Israel. These funds were diverted to keep Arafat and others rich and comfy and the Palestinian people destitute and angry at Israel. Now Israel has given more land while Iran again calls for their destruction. And we are to pay money to Spielberg and hollyweird to be lied to? Any Palestinian grieving that resulted from the murders in Munich was brought about by Palestinians. Sell your scheiße elsewhere Spielberg.

24 posted on 12/21/2005 8:01:17 AM PST by 70times7 (An open mind is a cesspool of thought)
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To: nickcarraway

You know what other piece of history you will never see --

"Abu Mazen [otherwise known as Mahmoud Abbas, current PM of Palestinians] headed some of the organization's most sensitive departments in the 1960s and '70s; it would have been remarkable if he was not involved in violence. Indeed, if we are to believe the autobiography of former PLO official Muhammad Daoud Oddeh published in France in 1999, Abu Mazen was involved in the hostage takeover at the 1972 Munich Olympic Games, which led to the death of 11 Israeli athletes.

Oddeh, known as Abu Daoud, wrote that he was the mastermind of Munich, which was carried out by the so-called Black September organization. He recalled that the plan was concocted in Rome at a meeting he held with senior PLO official Salah Khalaf, better known as Abu Iyad, and another colleague. Soon after, Abu Daoud began planning the operation. The only people he dealt with on the matter were Abu Iyad and Abu Mazen, who, Abu Iyad said, was to secure the funding."

http://www.slate.com/id/2085993/


27 posted on 12/21/2005 9:48:46 AM PST by dervish (no excuses)
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To: nickcarraway

Three comments.

1. This is an absolutely fantastic article. This guy totally "gets it" and every word of it rings true.

2. I never liked Speilberg when it seems like the rest of the world couldn't get enough of him. Many of his films I never saw (for example never saw Indiana Jones in it's entirety, ditto for ET) and those of his films I did see I didn't like very much. The article's explanation of Spielberg's "inner Peter Pan" or "Hardy Boys" view of the world resonates with me as probably one reason I never cared for his films (except maybe Private Ryan).

3. What he says about Speilberg in particuar, could just as easily be said about liberals and liberalism in general. They are all in touch with their inner Peter Pan and have a childlike view of the world in which everyone can be just made to "get along" if they could only receive the wisdom that liberals seem to have a monopoly on receiving and dispensing. Liberalism is truly a mental disorder and this article would indicate that Spielberg has a particularly virulent and contagious form of it!

Great article thanks for posting it!


30 posted on 12/21/2005 11:20:37 AM PST by 2 Kool 2 Be 4-Gotten (Is your problem ignorance or apathy? I don't know and I don't care.)
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To: nickcarraway

bump


31 posted on 12/21/2005 12:14:47 PM PST by lowbridge (All that is needed for evil to triumph is for "RINOS" to do something)
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To: nickcarraway

Some things never change. The Germans are still negotiating with terrorists. In exchange of one German civilian being released they released one terrorist. The cravenness is incredible.


34 posted on 12/21/2005 4:49:01 PM PST by winner3000
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To: nickcarraway

I have to give Spielberg credit for his love of the Jewish people - for example, when he visited Cuba and Castro he also made a visit to Jewish Cubans and the local Holocaust Museum:

Per the UPI:

"Spielberg spent four days in Cuba, launching a showcase of eight of his movies, meeting with Cuban filmmakers and paying visits to Havana's largest synagogue and a memorial to Holocaust victims at the city's Jewish cemetery. The Oscar-winning director of "Saving Private Ryan" and "Schindler's List" also dined with Fidel Castro, spending about eight hours with the Cuban leader discussing art, politics and history. During his trip, Spielberg made headlines by calling for an end to the 40-year-old U.S. trade embargo against Cuba, saying it was time to bury old grudges from the Cold War and expand interactions between Americans and Cubans."


35 posted on 12/21/2005 4:54:56 PM PST by rcocean (Copyright is theft and loved by Hollywood socialists)
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