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Dover Intelligent Design Decision Criticized as a Futile Attempt to Censor Science Education
Evolution News.org ^
Posted on 12/20/2005 12:12:16 PM PST by truthfinder9
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To: truthfinder9
It's been the biggest shift in thinking in human origins. It doesn't count if you don't tell anybody about it.
Come on. Where can I find the fantastic news that Humans and Great Apes are not related?
101
posted on
12/20/2005 1:26:26 PM PST
by
Oztrich Boy
(so natural to mankind is intolerance in whatever they really care about - J S Mill)
To: WinOne4TheGipper
What faith? Evolution is based on scientific evidence, not faith. Unlike ID. If presentation of scientific evidence is an attack, then attack away.
102
posted on
12/20/2005 1:28:08 PM PST
by
RonF
To: JustRight
ANd so, what if the judge is a Muslim who wants to spread his religion? The problem is this works both ways. I would rather see the people making the decision, not one man. (and it sounds as if the people would have made the same decision the judge did in this case).
When we get to the point where one group has enough numbers to play our your scenario, it hardly matters anymore, it's going to happen.
susie
103
posted on
12/20/2005 1:29:21 PM PST
by
brytlea
(I'm not a conspiracy theorist....really.)
To: WinOne4TheGipper
The entire argument seems seems to be "it's not science" from what I read here.
To: brytlea
At least we agree that taxpayers should get to determine what gets taught in schools. We just disagree on what should be in science classes and what shouldn't be.
105
posted on
12/20/2005 1:30:40 PM PST
by
Siegfried The Red
(Subgeniuses are the last TRUE Americans!)
To: onja
Not all theories are "created" equal, and not all theories need to be given equal consideration.
If all theories are to be considered, I guess we should study every creation myth in the history of man and give them all equal time, right?
I also demand that we teach the Subgenius Yeti theory of the origins of humankind and Subgenii. I think it's disgusting what the secular Trevinoists are doing in our public schools. They never teach anything about the word of "Bob" or the Bleeding Head of The World Cup Golfer!
106
posted on
12/20/2005 1:33:52 PM PST
by
Siegfried The Red
(Subgeniuses are the last TRUE Americans!)
To: Siegfried The Red
Actually, I have no desire to teach ID. I would like the freedom for it to come up and be discussed. You probably have no idea what it's like teaching evolution in the middle of the Bible belt! It was always touchy (and it wasn't the parents, it was the kids!)
susie
107
posted on
12/20/2005 1:34:48 PM PST
by
brytlea
(I'm not a conspiracy theorist....really.)
To: linda_22003
Doesnt matter who placed him on the bench, he shouldnt be dictating what can and cannot be taught in schools. That is up to the School Boards.
It will go down on appeal.
108
posted on
12/20/2005 1:35:18 PM PST
by
aft_lizard
(What does G-d look like then if we evolved from nothing?See Genisis Ch 1:26-27)
To: Siegfried The Red
Thats simply preposterous. Learning ID what create ditchdiggers and fry cooks. You bigot.
109
posted on
12/20/2005 1:36:02 PM PST
by
aft_lizard
(What does G-d look like then if we evolved from nothing?See Genisis Ch 1:26-27)
To: mpop
Dude, I was being facetious. Of course, a person can be very intelligent and believe in any number of untrue things, like you do. Don't worry, it's perfectly normal to be wrong sometimes, and perfectly natural not to want to admit it. I know it's hard to believe, but even I am wrong on occasion. ;)
But I'm not wrong about ID not being science.
110
posted on
12/20/2005 1:37:01 PM PST
by
Siegfried The Red
(Subgeniuses are the last TRUE Americans!)
To: mpop
That's the difference between science and dogma. Science, when found to be incorrect, changes to fit the facts. Dogma doesn't. ID is just dogma masquerading as theory.
111
posted on
12/20/2005 1:38:14 PM PST
by
Siegfried The Red
(Subgeniuses are the last TRUE Americans!)
To: aft_lizard
I think you need to recognize a joke when you see it. You sound rather defensive about your little fantasy. Could it be because you're ashamed to admit you might be wrong? Don't worry, we're all wrong sometimes. It's just that when science is found to be wrong, it changes to fit the facts. Religion and dogma don't, and that's the difference.
112
posted on
12/20/2005 1:40:38 PM PST
by
Siegfried The Red
(Subgeniuses are the last TRUE Americans!)
To: truthfinder9
There is no empirical evidence for the intelligent part of intelligent design.
113
posted on
12/20/2005 1:42:04 PM PST
by
bert
(K.E. ; N.P . Slay Pinch)
To: brytlea
I don't have a problem with it being discussed. If kids are kept from discussing what comes up in the natural course of inquiry, in a school of all places, that's just wrong and that bothers me too. I just don't think ID or creationism should be taught as part of the curriculum in a science class, because it isn't science, as I said.
If it comes up in the natural course of discussion in a science class, sure, talk about it. But don't call it science.
Anyone who wants to censor speech is wrong to do it. But teaching that creationism is scientific is a lie, disingenuous at best, promoting ignorance at worst.
114
posted on
12/20/2005 1:43:51 PM PST
by
Siegfried The Red
(Subgeniuses are the last TRUE Americans!)
To: aft_lizard
The court can, of course, decide whether something is unconstitutional or not, which was the matter at hand.
The School Board cannot suddenly decide to teach from a book like, say, "Islam: Convert You Infidels!" without expecting the constitutionality of such a program to come into question.
115
posted on
12/20/2005 1:44:19 PM PST
by
Sols
To: RonF
"Scientific evidence" for evolution posted on this thread alone...
To: truthfinder9
Ah, the creationist spin has begun....
2 posted on 12/20/2005 2:14:29 PM CST by highball ("I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have." -- Thomas Jefferson)
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To: highball
That's the neat thing about REAL science. It works whether you believe in God or not.
3 posted on 12/20/2005 2:16:27 PM CST by Siegfried The Red (Subgeniuses are the last TRUE Americans!)
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To: truthfinder9
Oh, man. Thanks. That was good for a laugh.
6 posted on 12/20/2005 2:18:00 PM CST by BikerNYC (Modernman should not have been banned.)
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To: truthfinder9
I think it's great when kids decide for themselves that ID is real science and evolution is an anti-religious conspiracy. After all, the world needs ditch diggers too and I like my fries nice and hot.
9 posted on 12/20/2005 2:19:37 PM CST by Siegfried The Red (Subgeniuses are the last TRUE Americans!)
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To: truthfinder9
What happened to schools being accountable to the taxpayers?
To which taxpayers? Islamists have more kids than Anglos. In 50 years do you want a majority Muslim sets of parents ruling the holocaust was a hoax and that there is but one God and that is Allah.
16 posted on 12/20/2005 2:26:07 PM CST by Dave S
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To: brytlea
"The bottom line is judges should not be deciding what is taught in schools (and I would think this would be the conservative viewpoint). The local taxpayers should decide."
The judge isn't deciding what should be taught in the classroom--he's deciding what shouldn't. ID is for the simple-minded.
30 posted on 12/20/2005 2:35:18 PM CST by soupcon
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........
And that's just to post thirty! Why, I don't know how anyone can doubt Uncle Chuck's Monkey Theory now!
116
posted on
12/20/2005 1:45:26 PM PST
by
WinOne4TheGipper
(When in Rome, yell and complain until Romans do what you want them to do. If that fails, sue.)
To: aft_lizard
I tend to agree. Courts really shouldn't enter into what subjects school boards decide will be taught. On that note, IDers shouldn't be dictating what is science when it should be left up to the scientists.
117
posted on
12/20/2005 1:47:00 PM PST
by
Siegfried The Red
(Subgeniuses are the last TRUE Americans!)
To: Siegfried The Red
Ummm I dont care whether I am right or wrong. You wrote a deliberate insult, not a joke. You should be ashamed of it.
Dont preach to me about science I am currently studying for my Masters as a Laboratory Technologist. I know the difference.
118
posted on
12/20/2005 1:49:19 PM PST
by
aft_lizard
(What does G-d look like then if we evolved from nothing?See Genisis Ch 1:26-27)
To: Siegfried The Red
Peer review is of course the best thing for any subject, regardless of what it is.
119
posted on
12/20/2005 1:50:48 PM PST
by
aft_lizard
(What does G-d look like then if we evolved from nothing?See Genisis Ch 1:26-27)
To: truthfinder9
Research over the last 30 years on Consciousness and Quantum Physics should be thrown in with Evolution, ID and Creationism. Today's young minds should be exposed to what is going on in labs like the Stanford Research Institute on these subjects.
All of it is hard to swallow as fact because trying to understand subjects like "When did time start" will never be explained with the type of logic we like to understand our world by.
Simply because Science can not explain processes to our satisfaction does not mean these don't exist.
120
posted on
12/20/2005 1:51:40 PM PST
by
jcon40
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