Posted on 12/19/2005 6:23:54 AM PST by NYer
With many large churches across the U.S. announcing they won't be open on Christmas Day, some pastors are defending their decision to stay closed, even going so far as to blast those who question their motives.
Among them is Jon Weece, pastor of Southland Christian Church in Lexington, Ky., who received complaint e-mails from Christians in all 50 states.
"I was deeply saddened by the knee-jerk response of the Christian community as a whole to give the benefit of the doubt to the media and not a church or a brother in Christ," Weece said in his Dec. 10 sermon. "I'm still troubled that more Christians in this community specifically did not stand up for us knowing what this church represents."
(Audio of the entire sermon is available here.)
Weece blamed Satan the devil for using the Christmas issue as a distraction, prompting Christians to bicker among themselves.
"People are not the enemy," he said. "The devil is, and it is obvious that he has been at work in this situation."
Weece said the services being offered on Christmas Eve were still technically the "first day of the week" if one went by the custom of starting days at sunset, which some believe was the case in Jesus' day.
He went on to note: "Christmas began as a pagan holiday to the Roman gods, and if we were to really celebrate the historical birth of Jesus, it would either be in January or mid-April. I'm only pointing out the historical technicalities not out of intellectual arrogance, but again because of the illogical, ill-informed and even hypocritical arguments that were aimed at me personally this last week."
Weece also said Jesus himself walked all over opinion and tradition: "Do not lose sight of the controversy that Jesus incited by turning traditions on their head. And always remember in the economy of Jesus, the one whose birthday so many are claiming to be so passionate about, Jesus placed value and emphasis on people over policy and procedure and protocol every single time."
Meanwhile, the largest Christian church in South Florida has reversed itself on its closure Christmas Day, and now says it will be open for a single service next Sunday morning, Dec. 25.
![]() Calvary Chapel of Fort Lauderdale now promoting its Christmas Day service online after initially announcing a Dec. 25 closure |
Calvary Chapel of Fort Lauderdale originally decided to give its members and workforce a day off to spend with their families on Christmas, even though it falls on Sunday, its traditional day of worship. Instead, it had scheduled a slate of extra services for Saturday night, Christmas Eve.
![]() Pastor Bob Coy |
"I've been called a bad person and a shame to Christianity," pastor Bob Coy told the South Florida Sun-Sentinel. "It made me realize that many people misunderstood our motives."
But after an onslaught of negative public reaction from both inside and outside his congregation, Coy had a change of heart.
"Say it isn't so," read one e-mail, according to Coy. "You're shutting your doors on Jesus' birthday. I'm appalled at the message you're sending to the community."
Coy also was advised by some church members who said they wouldn't be able to attend services on Christmas Eve, and preferred to come on the actual holiday.
"Christmas is filled with unrealistic expectations," he said. "I don't want to fuel that. If people need Jesus on Christmas, I want to make Him available."
The entire issue has exacerbated the national Christmas controversy at a time which many believe is supposed to harken back to the Gospel of Luke's "peace on Earth."
"There is no biblical mandate that we meet on Sunday, only that we meet," writes Larry Baden in an online messageboard. "This is clearly a nonessential issue. Nobody's orthodoxy stands or falls on having a Sunday service. Nobody's salvation depends on having a Sunday service."
Minister Jeff Chitwood contends: "I think the issue centers on canceling worship on a day that is supposed to be centered on Christ. Too many times the church accuses the world of taking Christ out of Christmas but now the church is the one changing things because a day centered on Christ conflicts with schedules. What kind of message does it send to those who we have condemned in the past? At our church we are rescheduling service times but not eliminating the opportunity to worship on a day centered on Christ."
One poster said true worship is about much more than just singing or attending a church service.
"The way I greet my family when I go home from work is an act of worship. The way I talk to my co-workers. The dedication I give to my employer. The passion and inspiration I find in teaching or writing or editing or reading or mowing the lawn or ironing my shirts. ...
"Let's all just focus on God this Sunday. He's a big Guy. I'm sure those who look for him will find him even if they don't set foot in a church building."
The Puritans?
Do you also agree with their views on predestination and that children who die without verbally accepting Jesus burn in hell?
Tell me RW, do you count the number of steps that you take on the Sabbath? Do you do any type of "work" on the Sabbath, such as washing clothes, clearing dishes after your meal, taking the dog for a walk?
Those phylacteries must be heavy to carry around.
I'd be interested in knowing what the attendance records are of all those complaining. It's like these people who complain about prayer being taken out of schools when 90% of them don't pray with their kids at home.
Sounds to me like a bunch of self-righteous hippocrits.
"That Bible came from the Catholic Church."
That's what the Roman Catholic Church wants you and the world to believe, even though copies of the New Testament were proliferating all through the Byzantine region and northward and westward from the time of the Apostles without anything at all like (what we see as) the Roman Catholic Church having anything to do with it.
Jots and tittles relate to written documents....specifically, documents written in Hebrew.
I am not Hebrew. I am a gentile Christian. While Paul, a Jew, demonstrated that he was not bound by the law, it is even moreso for a gentile Christian.
Sabbath-keeping was part of the written law. Man was not made for the Sabbath; the Sabbath was made for man.
A2J,
Did you miss my post which answered your earlier questions? Because you seem to keep repeating the same anti-church talking points without taking anything that you're being told into account. I'll re-post it for your convenience:
>>Chapter and verse, please. From the bible. You sound just like the Pharisees.<<
- Exodus 20:8 (on the sanctity of the Sabbath)
- Neh 13:15-22 (on the sanctity of the Sabbath)
- Is 58:13 (on keeping the Sabbath holy)
- 1 Cor 16:1-2 (On meeting in fellowship the first day of the week - the new Sabbath day as recognized by Christ's resurrection)
- Acts 20:7 (Gathering in prayer and communion on the first day of the week)
- Rev 1:10 (the Lord's Day being the first day of the week)
- Acts 2:42 (on the importance of meeting together)
- Heb 10:25 (In not forsaking the fellowship)
>>Christians worship every day because worship is not something you do but something that you live...just like eating or drinking which is not bound by certain days or times.<<
I understand that. You must have missed the part of my post wherein I said that a Christian is to worship the Lord privately, and/or as a family every day. However, the Lord's Day, Sunday, is set apart and sanctified for the gathering of the fellowship to worship God corporately.
>>Biblical/historical worship has little to nothing to do with song or being with others but how we live our lives as to whether we please Him or not.<<
Again, then Paul's letters to Timothy on church structure, offices, and order must be hereby null and void, since their not important, right?
To the contrary, public worship, teaching, and exhortation is commanded.
1 Tim 4:13; 2 Tim 4:2; Col 3:16; Eph 5:19
If you were to have your way, there would have been no need for any of the epistles on the subject of corporate worship or church government
If I may, I'd like to ask you a question:
Why do you seem so bent on ignoring and/or downgrading the importance of corporate worship? Did you have a bad church experience, and that is what has jaded you from fellowship with the saints?
The Bible is very clear on the importance of corporate worship, prayer, and teaching, as I have shown in the above verses. Where are your verses which state that corporate worship, prayer, and teaching are not important?
You don't believe that man is judged on his works?
Of course he is. But our power to do them is from God. Judgement on works is based on our cooperation with the grace of God. Those who do not do good are rejecting the Lord and His grace. Those who do good works are cooperating with God and His grace by living in faith.
Good works do not earn, but do merit eternal life because they are the outward sign of the inward working of God's grace within us, regenerating us from the sinful old man to a new man in Christ.
Merit implies that by doing X, which God gives us the power to do, and to which He has attached the reward of eternal life, we will certainly gain the reward. First among all these works is that of conversion to the Lord Jesus from the Devil and sin. All other works are part of that conversion and flow from it, providing proof of its continuing activity within our soul.
Sunday and Holy Days, per command of the Catholic Church, given authority to bind and loose men in obligations by Christ.
Moreover, the grace within the changed soul is the cause of those works, and a man without those works does not have that grace. The works are not from us, but are done by us through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
A man with no good works clearly does not have the Holy Spirit.
Yes, Saint Nicholas was an early Father of the Church, a Bishop at the Council of Nicea, and he really did give gifts in some stockings to help out some poor girls unawares.
No I don't believe in a jolly old man at the North Pole though.
Could you please find someone from prior to the year AD 1500, who taught that 1 Tim 3 meant that Church leaders could marry or continue to have children?
"He (Paul) was not speaking of a man who might persist in the desire to beget children; he was speaking about continence which they had to observe in future." (Pope St. Siricius, Decretal "Cum in Unum", AD 386)
Apparently, everyone who just took a Bible off the nightstand prior to AD 1517 did exactly what you say they would not.
In the Catholic Church, the Sabbath is Saturday. In our Liturgical Books, it is clearly called "Sabbato" in Latin - "Sabbath".
The obligations of the 4th Commandment, however, are transferred from the Sabbath, and the Jewish feasts ordained by God through Moses and by the High Priest (i.e. Hannukah), to the Lord's Day, and Christian feasts created by the Church by the Pope (i.e. Christmas, Ascension, All Saints, etc.).
By what scriptural authority did the Pope do that?
Ergo, Hermann, before you boast, "I can handle it on keeping holy the Lord's Day," and throw stones at others perhaps you should consider that you yourself, and indeed your entire denomination, is not keeping the Sabbath on the day that the Lord Himself set aside as holy. Nor, for that matter, are you keeping any of God's Appointed Times at their appointed times.
Show some grace.
And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven. (St. Matthew 16.18-19)
Amen I say to you, whatsoever you shall bind upon earth, shall be bound also in heaven; and whatsoever you shall loose upon earth, shall be loosed also in heaven. (St. Matthew 18.18)
Take heed to yourselves, and to the whole flock, wherein the Holy Ghost hath placed you bishops, to rule the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. (Acts 20.28)
They are correct on predestination. Not on babies, if that is what they actually believed.
Certainly true.
However, there is still an appointed day set apart for that.
It does not mean we aren't to live every moment though worshipping God.
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