Posted on 12/16/2005 10:57:51 AM PST by kingattax
Anti-smoking activists who are driving cigarettes from public places across the country are now targeting private homes -- especially those with children.
Their efforts so far have contributed to regulations in three states -- Maine, Oklahoma and Vermont -- forbidding foster parents from smoking around children. Parental smoking also has become a critical point in some child-custody cases, including ones in Virginia and Maryland.
In a highly publicized Virginia case, a judge barred Caroline County resident Tamara Silvius from smoking around her children as a condition for child visitation. Mrs. Silvius, a waitress at a truck stop in Doswell, Va., calls herself "highly disappointed" with the court's ruling.
"I'm an adult. Who is anybody to tell me I can't smoke or drink?" she said in an interview yesterday.
An appeals court upheld the ruling, but not before one judge raised questions about the extent to which a court should become involved in parental rights and whether certain behavior is harmful or simply not in a child's best interest. Mrs. Silvius says she complied with the decision by altering her smoking habits.
"My children know not to come around when I'm on the front porch with my morning coffee, tending to my cows or out in my garden, because I'm having a cigarette," she said. Still, she thinks this was not a matter for the courts because it was not proven that she posed a risk to her children's health.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
You are mixing apples and oranges. First of all correlation does not equal causation. And secondly, smoking and being exposed to the smoke of others are 2 entirely different issues.....which you know, but choose to ignore.
There was something in the news, months back, about smoking being banned on one of the turnpikes. I watched Shep Smith go NUTS about this on the air. His arguement? What's next? Are they going to ban Big Macs, too?
sorry but Lungusa is not an unbiased source for information,and they are the ones promoting smoking bans. you need a better source.
You brought up the costs, I did not - I was just correcting your erroneous comments.
Anyway, the issue here is not about smokers costing anyone anything - but about the government becoming more and more of a Big Brother every day. And it appears you seem to agree with that premise when it comes to smokers.
I am sorry about your Uncle, and what your aunt is going through...........but being around second hand smoke is not the issue in the case of your uncle.
It is a completely and totally different and seperate issue.
That would be the fallacy of the ignorant: to conclude that everything must be either bad or good. The absense of "good", then, does not entitle you to decide all on your own that harm must exist. And that harm must be real and measurable and universal, to jam your neuroses down everyones throats as a result.
You are mixing apples and oranges
You're entitled to your own prejudices, but not to your own facts.
The most expensive costs are the result of AIDS and the walking whales (heart disease).
Second hand smoke is not even on the radar.
Ummmm...they are not breathing my smoke. I am out on the front porch and they are playing in the house or out in the back yard...geez, I have 1 1/2 acres and their play fort and the basketball court are at least 100 yards away from the porch...I'd be more worried about the toxic fumes from the horse patties in the pasture next door, LOL! The smoking-Nazi restaurants only require 25 feet from their door. My grandkids are old enough to understand that when I tell them I am going to smoke, they stay away from the porch. Lighten up.
Just because you don't agree with a statement doesn't make it wrong...just disturbing to you.
The financial cost issue is a central point to the discussion and that is why I as well as others have brought it up.
Hellooo - I call BS. The worlds largest metastudy of Environmental Tobacco Smoke (ETS, aka second-hand-smoke) says it IS GOOD FOR THEM.
Post evidence otherwise.
Geez...you are lucky, if I get a hangnail my doctor blames it on my smoking, LOL!
The answer must be "yes", if you are prepared to call the WHO of the U.N. who set out to prove your "suspicion" "evil liberals", LOL!
Even they were unable to risk what little credibility they had by doctoring the decades long study results!
Let's be careful here. No doubt smoking cigarettes does direct damage to the smoker.
As for modeling as a parent, once a kid is a certain age, they are going to make their own decisions on things like smoking or drinking. My dad never touched a drop, and I like bourbon. Mom smoked, and never drank, but smoked a tremendous amount of marijuana.
I don't smoke, don't smoke weed, but drink moderately (glass of wine a week or so).
Is smoking moral or immoral if done in front of children? Well, drinking is far worse than smoking. Alcohol is among the most addictive drugs on the planet. There are definite confirmed links between alcohol use and bad parenting in general.
Having said all that, what's worse: having the occassional cigarette in front of junior, or having two beers a night after work in front of junior?
I think being morbidly obese is FAR, FAR, WORSE an example to set for kids than drinking or smoking. Talk about modeling, and its effects on future behaviour? The parents eating habits have a lot to do with the way your kids are going to eat - that's medical fact. Is it bad for the kid? Almost always.
I think that one of the most important attributes of parenting has little to do with things like your vices. My father worked three jobs, while my mother dissolved herself and made our lives miserable.
My dad, every single time we were with him, paid undivided attention to us. We didn't feel like luggage, and we didn't feel like we were his friends. When we got out of line, he'd whack us, but that was the end of it, and because he cared about experiencing life with him in the daily stuff he did, I turned out very nicely, and I also found Christ in the bargain (THAT was modeling, as Dad went to church with us EVERY Sunday, without fail).
I want my kids to respect me so that I can discipline their behavior and have it mean something. I want them to know that when I'm with them, I'm involved completely in them, no matter what it is we do together.
Overworking is a dangerous habit. Downhill skiing is a dangerous habit.
Smoking and drinking in front of your kids: I can't even say its less than optimal. I can absolutely say its bad for you personally if you do it.
So, which is worse? 180 pound guy having a cigarette in the garage while he's working on his car with his boy, or the 320 pound dad stuffing another cheeseburger in his maw while his 3 year old sits in front of his happy meal?
Now, at which point should we attach some sort of morality to any of this. I'd just as soon stay away from whether any or all of this is 'moral'.
Two men shoot two separate other men at point blank range in the face. Which one committed an immoral act? I'd submit we don't have enough data.
One thing for definites, we let these morons tell us what we can do in our own homes, and there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that context will have nothing to do with whatever proscriptions on behaviour they will feel justified in foisting.
Changing the subject is a sure sign of a losing argument.
I don't think we should pay for the nutcase rockclimber who takes a fall and becomes a quadriplegic, either, but this thread is about second hand smoke. To tough to focus with a losing argument?
it are ready done by most if not all ins co for pre-ex conditions, what risky behaviors do you suggest?
Should we give a liver to an alcoholic who need a transplant?
that is already being done all the time.
Now, there are two sides to this -
A) we must protect our children from the least harmful influence.
B) Immunize them.
Children raised in a bubble die young. But I suspect that you are about to find that out.
My mom died of lung cancer at the age of 76. Never smoked a cigarette all her life. My aunt smoked all her life and lived to be 93. I have 10 brothers and sisters and all but 2 smoke and none of them have health problems. My youngest brother is in remission from cancer but he is one of the 2 that doesn't smoke. Go figure.
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