Racial Tensions Explode Again (Aussie Intifadah?)

The Herold Sun ^

[Actuality]

Racial Violence explode again

Groups of Middle-Eastern men descended on Cronulla seeking revenge for Sunday's attacks, smashing cars with baseball bats.

[Torie]

Is it possible that too much is made of a bunch of young punks (the Anglo ones being drunk) on both sides of an ethnic divide having a rumble on the beach? The US has had this sort of thing going on since the US began. The Irish had huge riots in NYC vis a vis blacks (killing many) and against the draft in the Civil War back in the 19th century. They were written about the way Muslims are written about today in France, and now Australia. I submit a bit of perspective is in order.

[montag813]

I think the radical Middle Eastern poor victims have merely protested against Australian occupation of Arab Muslim Australian land... The same as they shouted in Denmarh, 'this land is our land'.

Didn't you know Sydney is holy to Muslims? Mohammed took a dump at a motel there before descending to hell.

[Torie]

Irish ping. :)

[DoughtyOne]

Perhaps some perspective is called for.

I don't remember reading about drunken Muslims across France causing the violence. Now when the Aussies react to something that took place on the beach, they're drunken hooligans. Even when there was talk of cars slashed in reaction to the Aussie hooligans, there was no mention of liquor.

It seems to me that the Muslims are generally described as addressing grievances, and those who object to their violence are referred to as drunken sots.

The media and the authorities seem to be quite forgiving when the offenders are thought to be of the Muslim persuasion.

That may not be the case, but for all the world it sure looks like it from where I sit.

[Torie]

The white youngins rioting were as drunk as hell. Surely you don't think there rioting was some serious ideological statement. I suspect some of the Muslim punks in Australia and France were as well, but that would not be PC to suggest. By the way, were those Lebanese guys who started this Muslim or Christian?

[Torie]

Surely you don't think their rioting was some serious ideological statement.

[DoughtyOne]

Torrie, I have no way of knowing. I suspect there are problems on both sides, but I do find it rather humorous to see all this angst about racial strife.

What's the difference between what is taking place in Australia and what happened in France? I don't remember any handwringing over race as an issue when only Muslims were involved. I remember people getting upset because only Muslims were involved, but I don't remember people thinking it was racially motivated.

Now there's whites involved, and of course it's an issue of race. Look, if people don't sit by and watch their towns and other property torched, I don't necessarily see it as an issue of race.

Yes Muslims were targeted. And perhaps a message needed to be sent so that people are on record knowing this isn't going to be a one-way street like it was in France.

"Enough is enough. If you want to play, we're going to accomodate your ass."

[AD from SpringBay]

A little off topic - but wasn't there an election in Iraq Monday? Am I wrong on the day or is there no news about it?

[DoughtyOne]

Voting started Monday and will continue through the 15th, I believe it is.

[AD from SpringBay]

Thanks - I didn't see any threads about it and thought I was way off on the day. Can't imagine why the media wouldn't cover such an event.

[Thumper1960]

Never say that ME types are very bright. They're not messing with the cowardly and effeminate French, here.

Piss off an Aussie and you're writing your own obituary.

[Actuality]

You have a point, but the Arab radicals' Racism and Islamic Jihad are often 'working' together...

See -

http://geocities.com/arabracismandislamicjihad

But of course Arab Christians are victims by Arab Muslims too.

[Actuality]

Ya got that right MATE.

[DoughtyOne]

Well, outside of the obvious mourning period being observed by our media, the early voting is somewhat of a side issue. It has been mention here and there. The main vote in a few days has also. I will agree though, if this was something the media wanted to see take place, they'd be parading down the street with pom poms and sparklers.

[Torie]

all this angst about racial strife.

Not much angst from this quarter. That was the exact point I was trying to make.

[DoughtyOne]

Torie, I'll grant you that I am venturing off what I normally consider rational thought on this issue, and I'll explain why.

The western governments have been trying to mix oil with water and it's not going to work. The Muslim adherents and Western values systems clash.There simply isn't any way to weed out the good Muslim adherant from the violent. And a small percentage of Muslims are going to hate the west until the day they die.

In every 1000 Muslims that immigrate to western nations, there are going to be a few that dispise the west. These people are potential time bombs waiting to explode. Each one of them is capable of killing hundreds to tens of thousands.

In every group that immigrates to the U.S., there are going to be a few bad apples. This doesn't just apply to Muslims, but we have to acknowledge that the Muslim bad apple is a special case. They aren't going to commit a few individual violent or some individual non-violent crimes. They have been raised in an atmosphere that preaches the dispisement and destruction of the west. That's just a sad unfortunate fact.

As I said, our governments are importing terrorists. That's an undeniable fact. Police Departments and Judicial systems seem unwilling or perhaps unable to counter the massive unrest these groups can muster. At some point, the populace is going to step in and end it themselves, if the governments that represent them can't, or worse yet, WILL NOT.

I'm not a particulary strong adherant to the claim that every Muslim is going to do their best to destroy the non-Muslim. I disagree with that premise.

Now if I'm going to look at that issue rationally, I must also admit that there is no other group that immigrates to the U.S. that has as a large an explosive component in their midst, as the Muslim immigrant.

It would seem prudent to place a freeze on immigration from terrorist states, and immigration from those who originated from a terrorist state within the last twenty years. That's not going to happen, and we're going to pay dearly for it.

What's happening in Australia today is merely the precursor to events that will take place as a growing segment of western nations populace wakes up to what's being engineered in their midst.

What's as sad as anything else about this, is the fact that good people are going to be hurt on both sides.

I will say though, that I was not taught to hate people from the Middle-East since childhood. I was not taught how to kill people from the Middle-East from childhood. I did not read about Middle-Eastern 'Great Satans' since childhood, thinking every Middle-Easterner was bad. That is not so for those headed in our direction.

As a general rule, I do not have anything against the Middle-Eastern individual who wants to live in peace along side me. I just can't tell them apart from those who would just as soon place a fifty pound explosive under my bed, than grow old together. Neither can our immigration officals, but then they don't seem to understand this.

[Torie]

Well there is not much evidence so far, that Muslim immigrants to America are particularly lawless. In fact, they tend so far to be middle to upper middle class. But then, the numbers have been rather small. The most elite immigrants are Indians from India. They have the highest per capita income, of any ethnic group in America, beating out Jews and Greeks, who are the runner ups.

[DoughtyOne]

There is some truth in your observation regarding Middle-Eastern immigrants. And the observation may hold true in perpetuity. On the other hand, niether of us knows what events might take place that would cause a shift to a different reality.

The seeds were planted since childhood. Given a little rain, who knows. Sadly, none of us.

There are many people in the world who live in nations where the U.S. is respected. I have never understood the impetus to immigrate people from terrorist states vs them.

[Cap Huff]

"Surely you don't think their rioting was some serious ideological statement."

Evidently many were drunk, but that does not mean that there was NOT a serious ideological statement being made.

I'd draw particular attention to Wretchard's blog over at the Belmont Club. He is an Australian of Philippino extraction who is one of the most perceptive and erudite commentators in the blogosphere.

http://fallbackbelmont.blogspot.com/2005/12/breaking-violence-breaks-out-again-in.html

Note not just the initial blog entry, but also his comments within the comments section. He has much more to say there.
Here's a snippet:

"I've been warning about this [perceived political correctness undermining public confidence] for some time now, both with respect to the torture debate and in an old post called the Three Conjectures. Like most people in Oz, I have Muslim or Middle Eastern friends and the way I got it figured is if we don't start cracking down on the Osamas and the Zawahiris and the al-Arians because they are draped in this bogus human rights shield, then the Joe Samadis and the Bill Mansours of the world are gonna start catching it. What's the use of being innocent if the guilty go scot free? One day if a nuke goes off in Sydney or Manhattan all the bets are off."

The anglos may have been "revved up by beer" as Wretchard notes, but the "tectonic pressures" built up relate to extremely serious social, political, and geo-political issues.

Please check out Wretchard. I think you'll see that this was most likely much more than a simple "rumble" at the beach.

[Ashamed Canadian]

Check out this Surfing messageboard from Australia, lots of interesting insight you won't get from the press:

http://forum.realsurf.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=31