Jamaica: Ganja and crime (shocking new suggestion that pot may be related to crime in some way)

The Jamaica Gleaner ^ | November 27, 2005

[Stoat]

Ganja and crime
published: Sunday | November 27, 2005

The scientific debate in Jamaica about the dangers of marijuana use is often obfuscated by a subtle cultural bias based in part on a support of Rastafarians who claim that the herb is a sacramental part of their religious practice, but also by years of its use in folk medicine.

Now comes Dr. Winston De La Haye, director of the detoxification unit at the University Hospital of the West Indies and president of the Psychiatry Association of Jamaica, who believes that the use of ganja may well be a major contributing cause to the level of crime and violence in the society.

Dr. De La Haye points out that marijuana contains tetrahydro cannabinol which has been proven to exacerbate aggressive behaviour. If this is so, and given the wide use of ganja in Jamaica, the doctor's warning certainly deserves serious consideration and further objective assessment.

He contends that the drug can drive a person mad and, with understandable prudence, asks: Why take a chance?

We note that Professor Fred Hickling, another respected expert, while not disagreeing with Dr. De La Haye's bottom line warning about the dangers of using the drug, defuses the argument by listing a number of other social causes of violence such as poverty and despair, a position that can readily be conceded without in any way detracting from what might be a significant breakthrough in lessening the degree of violence in Jamaica.

Other causes of violence there may well be, but if smoking ganja is like throwing gasolene on smouldering coals, the unequivocal condemnation of its use may be worth trying, backed up with a strong public education campaign to bring home to the populace, especially the youngsters, that by smoking ganja, they may be playing with fire in more ways than one.

This suggestion runs counter to the present popular attitude that the use of ganja should be decriminalised, supported by the recommendations of the National Commission on Ganja which was set up in November 2000.

But in light of Dr. De La Haye's pronouncement, a renewed debate about marijuana use would seem to be in order, one that is non-emotional and focused, not on the general question of whether marijuana is good or bad, but whether it is indeed a contributory cause to violent behaviour.

Certainly there has developed in Jamaica an almost knee-jerk violent reaction to 'dissing' or other relatively minor provocations which needs some explanation. Dr. De La Haye has provided one such possible reason and we think his warning should be heeded.

[little jeremiah]

Oddly enough, when I used to smoke MJ and hash on a regular basis, I was also a hardcore liberal. Commie, in fact.

Once the smoke cleared, and I got some cold water of reality, understood that there is order in the universe and and Orderer, I became a conservative.

Funny, hunh?

[little jeremiah]

Actually, if I was emperor, I would include alcohol in the list. Brew it yourself, fine. Just no selling.

Obviously most people (or many of them) must have their drugs - be they legal, illegal, grown from the ground, made from grains, or created in factories. Or kitchen labs.

So my logical stance pleases no one. Except those who like their reality undiluted, with no mental novacain.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

You see, I have a perfectly libetarian solution (not liberal-tarian).

I say legalize all drugs but test people for every job, license or tax exempt status. Recipients of grants and loans could also be subject to drug testing!

Let them do all the drugs they want!

Let the rest of us who want clean living people with sober minds on the job, teaching in our schools and living in our neihborhoods have that!

Everybody wins!

[little jeremiah]

I subscribe to Thomas Jefferson's view:

"Reading, reflection and time have convinced me that the interests
of society require the observation of those moral precepts ... in
which all religions agree." --Thomas Jefferson

My beliefs aren't easy to pigeon hole by labelling; I see some universal truth everywhere. More some places than others, naturally.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

You see, I have a perfectly libertarian solution (not liberal-tarian).

I say legalize all drugs but test people for every job, license or tax exempt status. Recipients of grants and loans could also be subject to drug testing!

Let them do all the drugs they want!

Let the rest of us who want clean living people with sober minds on the job, teaching in our schools and living in our neihborhoods have that!

Everybody wins!

[mugs99]

I became a conservative.

ROTFLMAO!!!
You sir, are no Conservative.
Limited government, personal responsibility and freedom is Conservative.
I have seen no hint of Conservative ideals in any of your posts.
.

[little jeremiah]

You must not read very many of my comments.

And did you not read the part where I opine that marijuana and opium poppies should be legal for anyone to grow, albeit solely for their own use?

Now how libertarian is that?

[muawiyah]

MJ does not induce a state of freedom in anybody. Nor does MJ encourage the limitation of the powers of government.

[PaxMacian]

"understood that there is order in the universe and and Orderer"

As designer, the Lord's creativity is readily apparent in this herb's reflection of the mind's chemistry emanating from its flower to draw life to the sustaining essential proteins residing in its seed.

[TKDietz]

"Glad you bothered digging through Dutch statistics. Irrespective of our relative stances on any number of issues, you have to recall every single time that the Dutch government publishes incorrect statitics.
They can't be trusted."


Funny how instead of disputing what I said all you did was try to attack Dutch drug statistics. You must have looked up the Dutch statistics yourself and saw how wrong you were. I don't think there is any reason to suspect that Dutch drug statistics are any less accurate than ours are. In fact, I trust their numbers more than ours because Dutch people have far less reason to lie to government workers collecting such statistics than people do in our country where the stakes are much higher for people who use drugs. Our drug use statistics from government surveys are obviously low, even our government thinks so. That's why they boost the number of addicts on drugs like cocaine and heroin by several times the number of past month users estimated from the National Survey on Drug Use & Health when they are estimating what Americans spend on drugs. It says so right on the ONDCP web page.

[mugs99]

Sorry jeremiah, I lost track of what I was doing at the time. Lights were going dim and the PC was running on battery back up and the damn generator wasn't starting and I'm probably getting a little senile to boot...If my dingbat blonde wife is right. I had another in mind when I posted...Honest!

[mugs99]

MJ does not induce a state of freedom in anybody. Nor does MJ encourage the limitation of the powers of government

Is that your reply to 246?
I have to admit that I find your Islamic logic hard to follow. I'm assuming you're Islamic by your name, Muawiyah, and your paternalistic dogma.
.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

You see, I have a perfectly libertarian solution (not liberal-tarian).

I say legalize all drugs but test people for every job, license or tax exempt status. Recipients of grants and loans could also be subject to drug testing!

Let them do all the drugs they want!

Let the rest of us who want clean living people with sober minds on the job, teaching in our schools and living in our neihborhoods have that!

Everybody wins!

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

What I do not hear from these perpetual masturbaters is that this “ganga” thing is related to the anti-caucasian and racist Rasafarian religion in Jamaica.

Their ideology is that white men are devils. Marcus Garvey in the early 1900's said an African King would become the black messiah. Ras Tafari was crowned King Haile Selassie of Ethiopia and proclaimed to be their messiah in 1930.

According to the Rastafarian pagans, Ras Tafari did not die in 1975, but went to another dimension. He is called “Jah” and considered to be a god. A pagan perversion of Christian theology (EXACTLY like Pax Macian saying God wants people to be drug addicts).

Of course all of this lunacy is centered around smoking the ganga weed.

That is partly why these feminized males will defend pot smoking, drug abuse and deviant use of their anatomy and are not safe to have around children...

IT IS THEIR RELIGION THEY ARE DEFENDING!

Now, I have heard all the sanctimonious crap on this thread, but not one of these pot head jerks ever bothered to check that I have actually advocated full legalization of marijuana and other illicit drugs for adults (*with a few qualifying conditions) and still do.

*The qualifying conditions make them crap their pants better than the baby laxative in their heroine, but hey, I don't want them around really...

1. Mandatory drug testing for all paid employees of 501(c) tax-exempt corporations as a condition in the IRS Code to have “non-profit” status.

2. Mandatory drug testing as an Occupational Health and Safety statute for any employment in the United States.

3. Mandatory drug testing for any license to operate motor vehicles (including quads, motorcycles, etc.), aircraft and boats (or water craft).

4. Mandatory drug testing for any professional license.

5. Mandatory testing to maintain such licenses and as a condition for such, any accident investigated would require the signature of a waiver for consent to be tested before such a license is issued.

6. Permanent revocation of such licenses for positive results.

I am preserving the liberty and lives of people who want to work in a safe environment, get rid of the liberty restricting leftist non-profits, and preserve the liberty of people who fly in airplanes, ride in motor vehicles, walk along the streets and ride bicycles... AND IT IS ALL DONE WITH DUE PROCESS THROUGH LEGISLATION!!!

I am not accusing someone of a crime or compelling them to do anything. The druggies can make their choices and so can everybody else!

You see, I have a perfectly libertarian solution (not liberal-tarian).

I say legalize all drugs but test people for every job, license or tax exempt status. Recipients of government grants and loans could also be subject to drug testing!

Let them do all the drugs they want!

Let the rest of us who want clean living people with sober minds on the job, teaching in our schools and living in our neihborhoods have that!

Everybody wins!

posted on 11/29/2005 by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)

------------------------------------------------------------------------

A really good post:

To: Sir Francis Dashwood

Without touching on their use of MJ, the rastaferians ALSO pointed Haile being the last "Lion of Judah". It is noteworthy that there's a Biblical prophecy that when the last LOJ goes down, Ethiopia turns into a desert.

And, when Haile went down, the Northern core of the country was turned into a desert by its new Communist masters.

They undoubtedly believe other stuff as well.

131 posted on 11/28/2005 6:04:36 PM PST by muawiyah (u)

[Hemingway's Ghost]

Sorry, but horseshit dressed up as science is still horseshit.

It's amazing what sort of flimsy rubbish desperate people hang their hats upon, eh?

[Hemingway's Ghost]

You realize I was joking, right? Although muawiyah repeated that "logic-based" argument exactly later on.

Of course. This Dashwood character is a complete clown. And Muawiyah has exposed himself or herself as a big government person.

[Hemingway's Ghost]

Crime occurs when folks break the law.

And disrespect for the law and the breakdown of society result when the law does not serve justice, and when there is no logic to the law. I'm not advocating for a lawless, wild-west society, and I daresay neither is anyone else on my side in this particular debate. Why you folks on the other side can't differentiate between the crimes of burglary or murder and the "crime" of possessing a substance is beyond me. Are you simply unable to think critically? Do you not understand that the only reason it's a crime is because a few people with vested interests declared it to be? Are you really comfortable with giving government the precedent to criminalize any human behavior by fiat?

BTW, there are a sufficiency of local laws against MJ use. What is it that's so "big government" about that?

If local law is sufficient to fight marijuana use, why has the federal government spent an average of $3.2 billion a year for the past three years for domestic drug law enforcement alone?

Look here, I think the weed has gotten to you ~ it isn't that you are irrational ~ just that there's nothing rational in anything you say. It's like you can't handle any idea that goes more than two steps ahead.

This is a bad sign.

Please: all the above rubbish means is that you no longer have an argument to make, and are merely playing to the crowd. If you want to be cute, why not just put a bow on your head and start singing a Christmas tune?

[Hemingway's Ghost]

The question is not "is it wrong" but "should it be illegal" and the two are vastly different questions.

Well done.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

This Dashwood character is a complete clown.

Cocaine in Jacko's pants ^

Posted by Sir Francis Dashwood to Hemingway's Ghost; Know your rights; PaxMacian; mugs99; muawiyah; TKDietz; JTN; halfright; chronic_loser; ...

On News/Activism ^ 11/30/2005 5:49:49 AM PST · 54 of 56 ^

HURRY!

PING ALL THE MARIJUANA AND DRUG LEGALIZATION ADVOCATES OVER HERE TO TELL US HOW JACKSON'S FREEDOM AND LIBERTY IS BEING VIOLATED!

THE WAR ON DRUGS MUST BE STOPPED!

Michael Jackson is a victim of the anti-drug brownshirts! Stop the jack-booted, crypto fascist Republican Christian Taliban conservative terrorist war on innocent drug users and defenseless sex perverts!

WODLIST PING!

(/sarcasm)

Nuclear Option pinglist...

If you want to be removed from this list please do so here...

[Hemingway's Ghost]

Please never ping me to another thread again. You're a clown---I have no use for you whatsoever.