[holymoly]

The army has been experimenting with a 6.8mm round, but now some are demanding that the full size 7.62mm round be brought back.

Pssst, guys...

[The Red Zone]

Itty bitty bullet bump

[CrawDaddyCA]

While the Garand is a fine rifle, I prefer the M14.

[Lauretij2]

I think the XM8 in 6.8spc would be a great choice. I'm surprised it's taking so long.

However, the M16/M4 are still very viable systems.

[mmercier]

BAR with armor piercing ammo is fine for shooting a door way through a cinder block wall in about two seconds.

[Flavius]

FN SCAR-H / Mk.17 rifle prototype in CQC (Close Quarter Combat, short barrel) configuration, 7.62x51 mm NATO version

[Tarpon]

M14 bump ...

Truth comes out, eventually.

[PeteB570]

I suppose talking about the 55 grain vs 62 grain, 14, 12 and 7 twists per barrel, steel vs lead, tumbling vs stable, 11 vs 20 inch and the needed 2,700 fps needed to start tumbling is a waste of time on the anti 5.56mm round crowd.

[the crow]

bump for later. thanks for the post.

[plenipotentiary]

The Germans had a good design too:

The caseless ammunition in its early appearance was designed as a block of the propellant, coated with flammable laquer, with bullet and primer "glued on" the propellant. Final ammunition design DM11, that appeared in the mid-1980s, featured "telescopic" design, when bullet was fully enclosed in the block of the propellant. The cartridge propelled the bullet that weights 3.25 gramms, to the 930-960 meters per second.
Early prototypes were prone to the ammunition cook-offs during the sustained fire, but later Dynamit Nobel solved this issue.
In the late 1980s the Bundeswehr (West German Army) began the field tests of the pre-production G11s. After the initial tests, some improvements were devised, such as removable optical sight, mounting of two spare magazines on the rifle, and bayonet/bipod mount under the muzzle.
The modified variant, called G11K2, was tested in 1989, scoring at least 50% better combat accuracy when compared to G3 rifle. Initial batch of some 1000 G11K2s was received by Bundeswehr in 1990 or so, but due to some reasons the whole programme was cancelled by German Government. Main reasons of this cancellation were, in my opinion, the lack of fundings after the re-union of the West and East Germanies, and the general NATO policy for unification of the ammunition and even magazines for the assault rifles.
The slightly modified G11 was also tested in the USA under the ACR (Advanced Cobat Rifle) programme, in 1990. The ACR programme was not intended to result in adoption of the new rifle for the US Army, just to test new technologies and designs, and the G11 proved itself as a very accurate, comfortable to handle and fire, and reliable weapon.

13th prototype of the G11 (HKpro.com)


caseless ammunition - early variant at the left, latest variant DM11 (cutout view) - at the right


schematic drawing of the G11 bolt & feeding system

http://world.guns.ru/assault/as42-e.htm

[WKUHilltopper]

I never understood why in the world they changed the M16 to a three round burst and got rid of the full auto feature. Kinda defeats it's sting. Without the full auto, you might as well take a .22 squirrel rifle in the field.

[Dick Vomer]

Amen.... something about a 30-06 hitting somebody..... just makes you feel all warm and fuzzy.

[RightOnline]

Ping.

[Redleg Duke]

I never respected the 5.56mm. I have a Garand and it is a fine weapon, but I'd take an M-14 anytime!

By the way, do you remember how Clinton had a multi-million dollar machine built for the Anniston Army Arsenal whose sole function was to destroy the M-14 rifles in storage? I wonder how many of those wonderful weapons were destroyed by that criminal enterprise known as the Clinton Crime Syndicate?

[Lazamataz]

See this article? Perhaps our military experiences are finally being put to use.

[Kozak]

The "ching" of the empty stripper clip coming out was a major draw back. Bad idea to let the bad guy know you are reloading. We can do better then 1930's technology.

[fireforeffect]

Money, this is why the 5.56 will stay around and why the M-16 type rifle will too. The Army is spending lots of money on new electronics and other weapon systems (Striker, etc.). Also we are in the middle of a war, doing a change would require shutting down the current 5.56 production and producing enough 6.5, 6.8 or whatever to fully supply the troops. The Army is contracting out ammo production now, where will they get the needed production without facing a shortage of 5.56?

Also new developments and requirements made the XM-8 dated. The Israelis are going to a bull-pup rifle, the Tavor, for their basic weapon. DARPA is developing thermoplastic cases for small arms ammunition (50+% of the weight of a round is in the case). The need for a rifle capable of long range fire (i.e.: a longer barrel) and a short rifle for close/urban combat (see the Tavor) made the XM-8 obsolete.

With the possible exception of the Stoner, no Infantry rifle has been field convertible into light machine gun.
The Johnson came close and did have many common parts.

The article is right in that the troops are dissatisfied with the performance of the 5.56 and 9 mm. Multiple accounts from Afghanistan and Iraq detail their shortcomings. The 6.8 SPC is a good compromise. As is the .40 S&W or the venerable .45.

But as I said, there is no money to pay for a conversion at this time.

IMHO nothing will change in the near future unless SOCOM or the USMC force a change. Neither are happy with the status quo. The Army is not either, but they have more generals who are not combat arms making these decisions.

What I would like is a M-1/14 in a bull-pup configuration. New design trigger group and would require the Knight pic-rail to mount any sights. Just a thought.

[jordan8]

Here's a blog on weapons from some guy whose son is in Iraq

[Lion Den Dan]

The 5.56 with a 52 to 55 gr. bullet in a 1:12 twist barrel is a good man stopper and accurate to minute of man or even minute of head at 300 meters. Too many ignoramuses played with the rifle and cartridge and now the projectile is too stable.

I won't argue that the M16 series needs its detail cleaning to work but it will work well when maintained. For those who are determined to have a new weapon, the FN will not make them happy but it is likely the most user friendly, fuss free rifle in the world next to the AK/SKS type weapons. The FN, as a cost measure, is produced in a 5.56 version as well as 7.62. The 7.62 can be re-chambered to a lot of other calibers very easily. For the 6.8mm fans, there is the 7mm Mauser that has been kicking about for a number of years. If you want holes in things, the 7mm will make them more readily than the fatter 7.62 designs. If we stopped with the effort to make the M16 series rifle an 800 meter weapon and stopped expecting great things when the barrel is chopped to 16 inches folks would not be having the current problems. If you want short with a thump, there is always the M3 sub machine gun.

[Conservative Firster]

McMILLAN MFS-14

[planekT]

Personally I think the future of the gun will be rocket power. Besides nuclear power, it is the best we have.

Recoil could be controlled via a vent out the back of the stock, a much smaller hole then the barrel since it would not be pushing any weight.

Heavy bullets (depleted uranium for instance) could be used for destruction and for withstanding the extreme velocities obtainable. Use your imagination.

I really don't know why this has not been tried. I came up with this idea several years ago.

As for conventional cartridges, there is nothing new under the sun. I think it's time to move on.