water baptism of course
Posted on 11/13/2005 6:11:40 PM PST by Ellesu
SACRAMENTO, Calif. The atheist who's spent years trying to ban recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools says he'll file a new lawsuit this week.
Michael Newdow says he'll ask a federal court to order removal of the national motto "In God We Trust" from U-S coins and currency. He says it violates the religious rights of atheists who belong to his "First Amendment Church of True Science."
The church's "three suggestions" are "question, be honest and do what's right." Newdow says it wouldn't be right to take up a collection when the money says "In God We Trust."
Last year, the Supreme Court dismissed Newdow's lawsuit over the words "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance because he doesn't have custody of his daughter, in whose name the lawsuit was filed.
Newdow has resurrected that case by filing an identical lawsuit on behalf of two families.
Maybe someone can scare up his mailing address and we can flood him with Christmas cards.
This man is a YAWN.
Remington 700 or Winchester 70? Only you can answer that question. Hold them both, work the bolt, grok them. Use the force, Luke. Either way, you win.
Don't you guys get it? He's also incensed about the churches' tax exempt status and, by "establishing" his own, he's challenging that at the same time.
Since this rattles his delicate conscience so much, I take it he has refused to handle or accept money tainted with those offensive words. Otherwise, he might be perceived as hypocrit.
I was going to say, can't someone classify this guy as a 'vexatious litigant' or whatever the phrase is, but your idea is really much, much better.
but if i worship libs, they have no place in government.
One nutjob and an ACLU lawyer does not an assault make. This is more like a fly trying to eat the horse.
Notes from
The Pschology of Atheism
Dr. Paul Vitz
Lecture delivered at the Augustine Club
Columbia University
September 24, 1997
Many people have psychological reasons for atheism. Factors of upbringing, sins of believers, etc., may be barriers to belief.
Nevertheless, we have freedom of choice. People can choose to move toward God or away from Him. A person with many impediments to faith may move in the direction of God, perhaps over a period of many years, without ever actually arriving at the point of belief. On the other hand, a person with no impediments may nevertheless choose to reject God.
Here are some of the common, superficial reasons for atheism:
1. The belief that atheism is realistic, whereas faith is wishful thinking.
2. Personal motives (I myself was an atheist from age 18 to 38, for personal reasons that had little intellectual or moral justification):
a. The desire for the sophistication of the secular urbanite; embarassment over one's provincial background.
b. The desire for acceptance. In my case, it was for acceptance by my psychology professors who seemed to have only two things in common: they were personally amibitious, and they had renounced religion.
c. Personal convenience. It is inconvenient to be a believer in a modern secular society. It involves the renunciation of sexual pleasures and the necessity of commiting time and money. We are reluctant to make radical changes in our lifestyle.
Perhaps the above reasons account for the motives of most atheists. Now let us examine some of the deeper reasons for the atheism of some:
According to Freud's "projection theory", we developed religion out of a need to defend ourselves against the crushing superior forces of nature. As a child needs a father for protection, so we feel the need to create a protector God.
This, however, is an ad hominem attack, and is applicable to almost anything. It can be used, in fact, to negate psychoanalysis.
Another weakness of this argument is that, if it were true, one would expect all gods to be benevolent father-figures. However, this is not the case with pre-Christian and non-Christian religions.
It is worth noting that there is no support for Freud's theory within psychoanalysis itself. Psychoanalysis is neutral with respect to the question of God's existence. The projection theory is an autonomous argument and was first developed not by Freud, but by Ludwig von Feuerbach, a philosopher who was avidly read by the young Freud.
There is another argument that can be made on the basis of psychoanalytic theory, although to my knowledge this argument has yet to be fully developed:
According to psychoanalysis, the child has a desire to kill his father and to lie with his mother. Freud called this the 'Oedipus complex'. (I personally do not believe that the Oedipus complex is universal.) The argument can be made that, due to this complex, we have an unconscious desire to kill God, the father figure. Atheism is thus merely Oedipal wish fulfillment.
In many prominent atheists in history, we see a strong antipathy toward their fathers. Voltaire was not an atheist, but he rejected the idea of a personal god. He vehemently rejected his own father, to the point of rejecting his surname and assuming the name 'Voltaire' (we do not know how he came by his adopted name). Diderot, likewise, was a profound atheist. He once stated that a child, if he had the strength of a man of thirty, would "strangle his father and lie with his mother".
Freud himself observed that young people tend to lose their religious faith as soon as they lose the authority of their earthly fathers. This can happen in several ways:
1. The father is present, but he is weak, cowardly, unworthy of respect.
2. The father is present, but is physically, psychologically or sexually abusive.
3. The father is absent, whether through death or abandonment.
What of Freud's own father? Jacob Freud was weak and unable to provide for his family. The money for their support came from his wife's family. Jacob was also passive in the face of anti-Semitism, whereas his son greatly admired courageous resistance and was himself courageous. Moreover, Sigmund Freud wrote that his father was a sexual pervert. Now, Jacob used to read the bible with his son, and he became increasingly religious over the years.
Another example of a prominent atheist with a poor paternal relationship is Thomas Hobbes. His father was an Anglican clergyman. Although the exact circumstances are unknown, he got into a fight with another man in the churchyard, following which he abandoned his family.
As for Ludwig von Feuerbach, his father abandoned the family and lived with a married woman in the same town, then returned after the woman died. Feuerbach was twenty at the time of his father's return. It is also to be noted that his father's nickname was "Vesuvius".
Schopenhauer was rejected by his mother, and his father committed suicide when Schopenhauer was sixteen.
Nietsche's father died when he was four. Camus and Hume also lost their father's in early childhood.
Our contemporary Madeleine Murray O'Hare also had an unhappy family life. She often fought with her father, and on one occasion tried to kill him with a butcher's knife. We cannot know the reason for her hatred, but it probably was not without cause.
Another well-known living atheist is Albert Ellis, who developed rational emotive therapy. He founded an institute here in New York City. I once engaged in a debate with Ellis, during which I made the same arguments I make here. Afterwards, Dr. Ellis told me that my arguments did not apply to him, as his relationship with his father was fine. I said something about the large number of exceptions to any general truth in the field of psychology. However, some time afterward when I was describing my position to an acquaintance, he exclaimed, "Why, that sounds just like Albert Ellis!" I asked for an explanation.
Ellis grew up in New York. His mother did not function well, and his father was a philanderer who abandoned the family when Ellis was twelve. He and his brother had to take care of their mother and themselves. As an adult Ellis is polite to his father, but we can only guess how great the pain of his childhood must have been.
Dr. Anthony Flew (sp?) is another famous contemporary atheistic psychologist. Some while ago he was at a party and, having had too much to drink, ended up lying on the floor, hitting it and saying over and over, "I hate my father. I hate my father."
Russell Baker's father died when he was five. He describes raging against God as a child, and concluding that God was not to be trusted. Since then, by his own account, he has never cried and has never been able to love freely.
In contrast, many famous thinkers who were believers and contemporaries of the atheists named above, had very good relationships with their fathers. This includes Bonhoeffer, Chesterton, Pascal, and Wilberforce.
There are exceptions to my theory. John Stuart Mill was an atheist who was close to his father. However, his father was an atheist, and so it could be said that Mill came by his atheism the natural way. Diderot had a good relationship with his father until adulthood. As for Karl Marx, only a modest case can be made for poor paternal relationship. Kierkegaard had a good relationship with his father in childhood, rebelled against him in college, and subsequently returned to him.
In conclusion, rather than judging atheists harshly, we must have an understanding of the deep psychological pain underlying much atheism.
Questions and Answers:
1. Do some atheists with inadequate fathers feel motivated to find a good father?
This does not seem to happen. However, some people do find father substitutes. Bear in mind that the people I have been discussing are not agnostics or casual atheists, but people who have very strongly rejected God. In addition to their negative paternal relationships there may be other factors involved. They are frequently highly intelligent and arrogant people (intelligent people often are proud). There is, as well, some evidence that birth order affects religiosity. Younger siblings tend to be more rebellious.
In contrast to such strong atheists, people who are ambivalent toward their fathers are more likely to seek a substitute religion, possibly a New Age religiosity. Some have suggested that cults fill the need for a substitute father.
2. Have you done studies on a larger scale?
No, because I have tried to focus on intense atheists.
3. What about people who want to believe but can't?
Such people may look for substitutes. For example, C.S. Lewis, an atheist for years, found a substitute father in the novelist and minister George MacDonald. St. Don Bosco lost his own father but had priests as substitute fathers. His later ministry focused on the needs of orphans, first boys and later girls.
Those of you who claim to be Christians would not only represent Christ better if you prayed for this man instead of calling him names, but it would do more good as well. I was an atheist for most of my life. Christ eventually found me, despite the desperate work of so many of his alleged followers who tried to keep me away.
We hold these truths to be self evident : That all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their CREATOR ... whoops. Better get rid of that stinking Declaration of Independence!
Mike Newdow performing in Sacramento
November 22, 2005 at 7:00 pm
Mike Newdow
Performance in Sacramento, California
Our Coruscating Constitution
When the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals ruled in 2002 that the Pledge of Allegiance was unconstitutional due to its use of the words, "under God," a "storm of controversy" spread throughout the nation. Yet, if people truly understood how our Constitution came into being--and the principles upon which it's based--it is possible that the ruling wouldn't have been controversial at all.
In an effort to provide that understanding, Mike Newdow - the man who brought the case - will be giving a presentation on November 22, 2005. Actually, it's more of a performance--with musical numbers, humor and visuals--all used to examine the unique and extraordinary development of our governmental framework. With a more modest version having already received rave reviews, this new rendition is sure to be an experience not to be missed!
History has never been so entertaining ... or enlightening and inspirational. Mark your calendars and tell your friends about this wonderful event, which is being given in the Sacramento area one time only.
It will take place at the Performing Arts Center in Sacramento, located at 8333 Kingsbridge Drive. This modern 700-seat theater will provide the perfect venue for this performance, which will begin at
7:00 pm on Tuesday
November 22, 2005
Tickets are $5 for adults, and $3 for students.
Mike wants your money with "In God We Trust"
To donate by check, please send a check to
Mike Newdow
PO Box 233345
Sacramento CA 95823
Google: Results 1 - 10 of about 600 for PO Box 233345.
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