Russians Again Wonder, What To Do With Lenin

Voice of America ^ | 9 Nov 2005 | Bill Gasperini

[Our_Man_In_Gough_Island]

For almost 80 years, the embalmed body of Vladimir Lenin has laid in an elaborate mausoleum on Red Square in Moscow. In the Soviet era, crowds would wait hours on end for a chance to glimpse the remains of the Communist leader who changed the course of history during the Russian Revolution. But times have changed, and now Russians are debating whether to leave the body in place, or not.

Russian Communists line up at the Lenin mausoleum The lengthy queues of people waiting anxiously to see Lenin may be long gone.

But, three days a week, it is still possible to walk down into the red and black stone mausoleum that was once revered as a shrine to Russia's revolutionary leader.

Vladimir Lenin (1997 photo) Lenin lies in a black suit inside a glass coffin, his face lit up in a way that makes him look almost like a wax figure.

After walking around the coffin, visitors head back outside to see the graves of other Soviet leaders, including dictator Josef Stalin.

Vladimir Lenin died in 1924. Technicians used a method of embalming that was a state secret.

The cult of personality built up around him silenced any question of whether his remains should be preserved in this way.

However, since the 1991 collapse of the Soviet Union, questions have lingered over his continued presence in the heart of Moscow.

Recently officials again suggested it is time for the long-dead leader's remains to be buried elsewhere. Polls suggest that the debate splits the country right down the middle. And, a brief survey of visitors to Lenin's mausoleum seems to reflect that.

Sergei and Olga are a married couple from Russia's Far Eastern region, on a visit to Moscow. Sergei says Lenin should be left where he is, to remind future Russians of their history.

But Sergei's wife Olga begs to differ. She says it is not a Christian way of treating a person after their death.

Olga's comment about religion reflects the concerns of the Russian Orthodox Church, which has grown increasingly influential since the end of the official atheism of Soviet times.

Church leaders have long suggested that keeping an embalmed body on public view conflicts with Christian tradition.

Many bolster the argument, saying that Lenin left a will stating his desire to be buried next to the grave of his mother in Russia's second city, Saint Petersburg.

Olga Ulyanova However 83-year-old Olga Ulyanova says this is untrue. And, she speaks with some authority. Ms. Ulyanova is Lenin's niece - his closest living relative.

She says that at 53 Lenin was too young to have left a will and too caught up with affairs of state to think about such a thing. She adds he should be left where he is.

Ms. Ulyanova's comments concur with those of Russia's Communist Party, which strongly opposes moving Lenin's remains.

When the issue first arose, in the early 1990s, huge marches were held as the party denounced any talk of taking Lenin away.

One of Russia's most-senior Orthodox Church leaders is Metropolitan Kirill, head of public relations for the Moscow Patriarchy. The metropolitan takes a cautious approach and proposes that a referendum be held to decide the issue.

"From a religious point of view, there is only one way to consider his question," he said. "He should be buried."

But Mr. Kirill adds that any decision must carefully thought out, to avoid inflaming political passions. He says that Russian society is already strained by conflict and actions must instead contribute to a reconciliation among people.

Ivan Klimov is a sociologist with the Public Opinion Foundation in Moscow. He says such a sensitive issue must be handled carefully.

He says a meaningful discussion should be held on a socio-cultural level, not on the basis of politics.

Mr. Klimov says opinion polls taken by his agency find that 56 percent of Russians favor burying Lenin, but a similar percentage also feel he had "done more good for Russia than bad."

Any thorough debate about Russia's Soviet past is likely to be difficult, making it likely there may be no resolution about Lenin's future, anytime soon.

[Aquinasfan]

For some reason the corpse started slowly `sitting-up' during the service!

Rigor mortis.

I knew a nurse who said that she and her buddy witnessed this in the morgue. They beat a hasty retreat. 8-)

[sergeantdave]

Communist Table Fruit

Vladimir Lenin, Russia’s most famous communist preserve, now resembles waxed fruit and may finally get buried this winter.

The fact that Lenin might be better displayed as a table decoration in a kulak’s dining room is hurrying along this question of final internment.

For now, his molding body is entombed in a granite-and-marble mausoleum in Red Square, sealed in a glass sarcophagus which is cooled to 61 degrees.

The mass murderer died of a stroke and heart attack in the winter of 1924. His widow said bury him next to his mother in a simple cemetery plot; however, the communists had other plans.

They wanted to freeze his body, but the lips soon started falling off. Instead the communists tried a chemical preservative, and Lenin’s corpse has been here since.

That Lenin now resembles a waxed banana is alarming some Russian people, although mausoleum caretakers insist he appears life-like, if you consider waxed fruit apealing.

The caretakers wash Lenin’s face with bleach now and then to combat fungus stains or mold spots. Every 18 months or so the body is immersed in a bath of glycerol and potassium acetate for 30 days.

The majority of people under 50 years old want this old communist mold buried and forgotten, while older Russians consider the idea sacrilegious. Stay tuned.

[scooter2]

Send him to Seattle, The commie leftists here already have a statue of him. I'm sure they would be willing to build him an elaborate tomb.

[oyez]

I always thought that the Lenin corpse is a fitting symbol of Soviet Communism, dead and Godless.

[GarySpFc]

Look here: Soviet Spy Chief Back -- On Pedestal

From another article on this subject:

Moscow's police force has restored a bust of the once-feared "Iron Felix" in the courtyard of its headquarters at Petrovka 38, where the bust had been removed by police officers on Aug. 22, 1991, due to fears that the angry mob that had brought down Dzerzhinsky's 16-ton statue on Lubyanskaya Ploshchad would attempt a repeat performance.

City police chief Vladimir Pronin approved the request of a group of retired police officers to return the bust during a meeting with them Friday, former city police chief Arkady Murashov said.

"Apparently, Pronin decided to give them a gift for Police Day," Murashov said by telephone, referring to the annual Nov. 10 holiday.

Take a look at the above, and you will see it was at the request of a group of "RETIRED" POLICE OFFICERS. There is no difference between that and the 20 +60 year old members of the communist party you see marching in Red Square every afternoon with their flags. As these men die off the statue will be quietly removed. There are always a few nuts everywhere, including a statue of Lenin in the Peoples' Democratic Republic of Washington.

Earlier this year I heard crys of outroar over a statue of Stalin, Roosevelt and Churchill that was going to be erected in the city of Volgograd (Stalingrad.) All of the newspapers were reporting Russia was returning to Stalinism. I am married to a Russian lady from Volgograd, where we maintain a second home. I contacted the supervisor of monuments for Stalingrad, and he didn't know anything about it. Furthermore, he laughed and said they would not approve it under any circumstances. It was never erected. WND, the LA Times and others would not even issue a retraction after I notified them. Indeed, one carried the story again...so much for honesty in the newspapers.

[GarySpFc]

Less than 5% of Russians want to return to communism. We have more communists on our college campuses.

[GarySpFc]

I should add those Russians who want to return to communism are the pensioners who seek the security they lost when the Iron Curtain fell.

[LIConFem]

"We have more communists on our college campuses."

That, unfortunately, is almost a truism! ;o)

[COBOL2Java]

I say enter him as an honorary pumpkin in next year's Punkin' Chunkin' competition!

[rarestia]

Or maybe a 4' x 4' x 8' cage with iron bars just outside the public restrooms at the Ronald Reagan Memorial Library, with a plaque that reads" "Owned!"

LMAO!

PWNED!

[LIConFem]

More from Our Friends, the Russian Gov't

[GarySpFc]

Did you ever consider how many countries Venezuela could purchase those rifles from other than Russia? I'm ex-Special Forces, and can tell you we are hearing less than 5% of what is going on in the WoT. Russia is working very closely with the US in ways you would not imagine.

[LIConFem]

"Did you ever consider how many countries Venezuela could purchase those rifles from other than Russia? "

That's very true, and very beside the point.

"Russia is working very closely with the US in ways you would not imagine."

The Russians have every right to act in their own self-interest (as they see it), just as any other sovereign state does. And I have no doubt that they'll do exactly that. Unfortunately, it appears that, at this point in time, their interests conflict with ours.

Given our history with Russia (and the USSR) since ~1947, I'm not at all optimistic about relations between our two countries. And given all that we're hearing lately (yeah, it's from the MSM -- but so are 99% of the articles posted here on FR for discussion), I'm even less optimistic.

Perhaps I'm just a product of the Cold War who is clinging unnecessarily to old prejudices. Let's hope so.

[GarySpFc]

And you think I am not a product of the Cold War? I'm 63 and served on a Special Forces A-Team for 6 years fighting communism. I have several buddies listed on the wall in DC.

We complain when the Russians sell weapons to our enemies, and then turn around and do the same by selling advanced weapons to S.A. and other countries. The real enemy is China, but we are too busy purchasing our adult toys from them to notice.

[Clock King]

Quite common. The mortician should have "pinned" the body down. This sitting up is also believed to be the source of legends about vampires. Centuries ago, people were buried in somewhat shallow graves, and over time the body may sit up and come through the surface.

[cynicom]

Chertoff looks enough like Lenin to be his double, maybe he is interested in a job in Russia.

[LIConFem]

"The real enemy is China, but we are too busy purchasing our adult toys from them to notice."

I'll have to take your word for that! LOL!!

[LIConFem]

"It's ironic that Republicans do not trust the MSM in America, but they trust them for news from Russia. Russia has the same problem with their media as America. It is for the most part controlled by the oligarchs, and they are doing everything in their power to gain control."

With regard to the MSM, you're obviously right to question the veracity of everything they spew forth. What I can't figure out, though, is how does villifying Russia fit in with their leftist agenda? Can you enlighten me?

[GarySpFc]

The leftest MSM doesn't want you to know what is happening in Russia. Let me give but one example. You are well aware the MSM is pro-abortion. Have you heard one thing in the news about Putin signing into law a bill which restricts abortions in Russia to the first 12 weeks?

[GarySpFc]

When the Iron Curtain fell it was a major blow to the leftists, because it was very strong evidence their system does not work. Do you think the they want print articles admitting that, or that the Russian people have rejected their views? Do you think the MSN wants to admit there are many examples of capitalism succeeding in Russia? As an example, have you seen many articles informing us that Boeing's new 787 and 747 Advanced are being designed in Moscow at the Boeing Design Center?

Do you think the MSN wants to admit Putin has implemented a flat tax of 13%, got rid of the Sales tax, set the corporate tax at 24%, cut the VAT in half, cut 1/3rd off the payroll tax. He has cut back on government size (shrinking government). He has put up 20% of Russian land for sale, the government is in the process of divesting of the remainder of its shares in various companies. There has been judicial reform to a sitting jury from a triumvirate of judges. There has also been a total reform of the banking center, in order to make it transparent.

Can the MSM admit these things? I think not.