Posted on 11/08/2005 2:18:45 AM PST by JoeGar
I have a SIGARMS P239 .357 SIG for concealed carry and inside-the-home defense, but I feel I need a good rifle for neighborhood defense outside -- just in case somebody wants to torch some cars. I'd love an M1 Garand -- just to hear the ka-ching when the clip ejects -- but it's too expensive. The Ruger Mini Thirty looks interesting. What are your suggestions?
Actually, around here when the hurricanes kill your power for days, the biggest threats are guys trying to steal your generator.
I'm a great fan of the 870, along with 00 buck, but I've been rethinking the 00 buck part.
For $16 I can buy 100 rounds of 12ga 7 1/2 shot. The stopping power is less at greater ranges, but mobs, at closer distances, would more readily disperse when lots of pellets are coming down range at them. It may not kill one or any, but I believe it would convince them to disperse.
I suppose with a couple of 00 in the tube, some will get seriously injured/killed while many others are pelted with 7 shot.
Also, for indoor home defense, a smaller shot is still capable of killing an intruder and less likely to pass through interior walls and injure/kill valid occupants,
Thoughts?
I've related the story before of the Lebanese family that bought a grocery store in my old neighbor in Queens. The store had become plagued by robberies, the police advised the Italian-American owners to hire an armed guard. (What a fiasco that was. The elderly Black gentleman fired into the ground at some yoots who were taunting him, the ricochet hitting one of the yoots in the ankle.)
The Lebanese, apparently, were votaries of the II-Admendment. The first time some "brother" hit on one the young female cashiers, her male relative told him firmly to beat it. When the brother told him to mind his own bizniz, the male relative produce a nine-millimeter argument. The brother fairly knee walked out of the place. Word gets around and the store was never robbed after they bought it.
On the night of the 1977 Blackout, when many businesses were looted and burned in NYC, their store should have had a target on it. The family, thinking ahead, showed up in force with lawn chairs and long rifles. Needless to say, the rioters passed them by.
"practical role of firearm is to allow a person to escape from the immediate vicinity of the threat"
Not in Florida!!!
Thankfully, we are no longer required to flee from attackers, and are protected from civil lawsuit by the relatives of the Darwin Award recipient who got shot.
People will form informal militias or they will submit. Being armed makes the first choice possible. Not being armed makes submission the default.
I agree with some of what you say, but I personally have always assumed that the veneer of civilization can be ruptured more easily than many of us imagine.
Beyond that, I actually disagree with your premise - I believe that mobs, rather than being enraged at a show of force, will more likely pass up armed targets in favor of other prey. And neighborhoods can band together too, making a much more intimidating show of force. That's what I imagine would happen, from necessity, if civilization begins to break down.
For home defense, my 'ready long guns' are a Winchester '94 in .44 magnum, and a 12 gauge side-by-side with shortened barrels. The Winchester is loaded with 240 grain .44 specials, the shotgun with 00 buck. The plan is to go with the shotgun first, and the Winchester if there is anything left to shoot after the shotgun clears the hallway. However, in a real emergency I would grab whatever was closest to me at the time.
I'm not familiar with all the .32 calibers but do know that 32-20 (pretty weak ) and 32 Winchester Special(30-30 equivalent) are available.
Ruger 10/22 with a drum clip.
Filled with Yellow Jackets.
You can carry tons of ammo in your pocket, throw a gazillion rounds in any direction out to 100 yards.
Yellow Jackets (hypervelocity) can kill. OTH, you need not kill. Bad guys on the receiving end only know that a lot of "stuff" is buzzing around their heads like mad bees.
They leave and never come back.
I agree, and that is generally a good thing, but I also think there is a concern for militias that are no better than thugs. Not everyone is noble and wants to save their family/neighborhood.
Power corrupts . . . It is not unlikely that when the SHTF some militias will prey on the less armed.
In 3rd world countries they are called warlords.
32 Special was an alternate chambering for the Model 94. My friend had one and loved it. It's just the 30-30 brass with a little bigger bullet (32 obviously)
The 30-30 was named by the old blackpowder system, i.e. 30 cal/30 grains of black powder. Some others that are still around are the 45-70 (45 cal/ 70 grains powder), 30-40 Krag, 32-20, 25-20, 44-40
If we were "picking off thugs at 300 + yards" we would later be "defending off 300 + pound 'Ben Overs' at 1 yard" in the slammer.
True--total anarchy, night of the living dead type stuff could cause a need for a long range rifle for self-defense, but I do believe most married people should have has and her handguns and his and her shotguns first (with the kids trained to be reloading a possible 3rd set of guns) before any homeowner shops for a long range rifle.
Legally, your need for a shotgun/handgun combo far outweighs the need for an assult rifle/long range rifle.
Granted, scare power does play a role that does boost the usefulness of the AR and may "posssibly" scare off the mobs.
I have a .357 Magnum (always loaded with the real stuff) and am in need of a shotgun. I will take the word of the suggestion of the Remington 870. Does anybody else second that opinion or do you have a better shotgun choice?
Not true here in Texas.
Someone said that "every man, from time to time, wants to rasie the black flag and start slitting some throats". We all try to control that urge; it's called civilization.
Sometimes we are forced to abandon that control. I call that war.
My personal choices: .45acp, 12ga., .308, and .338 Lapua magnum.
Tell it to a judge or DA in my NYC hood my friend. If the guy robbed your house and you shoot him in the back while he is running away, you are going to jail for a long long long time.
I assume the car you wish to protect is not garaged. Rather than an expensive rifle why not try a cheap car. With an M1 you run the risk of reaching a bit to far.
Hi end and with the fastest cycle (semi-auto) Benelli.
Personally for home applications, a good pump with an 18 inch barrel, mixing up 00 buck and bird shot.
Not if you cover up the drag marks going into the house....
So, if a guy comes and writes graffiti on your house you can shoot him dead????
That is not the law anywhere.
Also can't quite make up my mind whether buck or smaller pellets are better. Up close it really doesn't matter. At longer ranges the buck will injure seriously or kill while the smaller shot will do little more than sting. On the other hand the smaller shot will be much more likely to hit.
I have switched loads between BB or #4 buck and double ought several times.
Right now my Winchester defender is loaded with OO Buck.
I purchased a Garand through CMP...the price was reasonable, the weapon is wonderfully designed, and...it is a piece of history!
I am no real shooter, my eyesight bites, but even I can get an occassional bullseye at 100 yards with my Garand (I know, but...that's good for ME!)
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