Schiavo Gives Kiss Of Death To Virginia Democrat

North Country Gazette ^ | November 4, 2005

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

"So, we found out that Michael delayed calling 911 from ... Michael himself! You are a piece of work."

Ever hear the concept of ... "keeping your story straight" ... ?

I may not be a lawyer or law enforcer, but I do know the concept. Keeping your story straight is not easy if you aren't telling the truth.

"Pretty selective, aren't you?"

I collect information and try to make sense out of it. That's how I pursue truth.

"Tell me. Did you actually go out and buy Fuhrman's piece of sensationalist trash book? You did, didn't you!"

No, but I heard his interview with Hannity. It was Hannity who suggested to him to go check the thing out, because Hannity also found disturbing information.

"I never said she couldn't speak, though whatever came out of her mouth would have been gibberish -- thus explaining Judge Greer's disinterest. I'll ask you again, What did Michael fear -- what do you think happened to her?"

It sounded very much like ... "I want to ..." That's about all she was able to manage before the hospice concluded they were disturbing her. Of course, if you are vegetative, I don't know how you could be disturbed. Brain full of mush and all that.

"Be that as it may, the autopsy negated their gossipy speculation."

Who witnessed the autopsy? Was it taped? And did the autopsy factor in the damage done to her through dehydration?

"Michael is already vindicated in the eyes of the majority."

So was Bill Clinton. I don't care what the majority thinks about Michael. But I do respect the collective conclusions of Hannity, Rush, Savage, Fuhrman, congress, and the Bush family. Only a fool would think they all were conspiring against Michael. Talk about needing tinfoil!

[willyboyishere]

Michael Schiavo reminds me more of Joey Buttafuoco.

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

Oh and others you seem to think were in on the Vast Life Wing Conspiracy against Michael: Laura Ingraham, Rusty Humphrey, Jesse Jackson, the Pope, and a long list of others. Yeah. We all conspired against him. I guess See-BS, N-BS, and A-BS were able to see through our mass conspiracy.

[willyboyishere]

I have seen that scenario in any number of movies. Invariably the enemy soldier passes by and his attention is not drawn by anything. NEVER have I seen the baby smothered, and dead, from the attempt of an adult to save other adult lives. But this is a very provocative ethical dilemma question, because you could make a lot of different cases for who represents who in this example.

[robertpaulsen]

The were all on the anti-euthanasia bandwagon, something this case was NOT about. That's what was most upsetting to me and the other fans of these conservative talk show hosts.

It was actually painful to listen to them repeat the rumors, gossip, innuendo, and character assassinations, and their intentional ignorance of the facts in the case. I have a much different opinion of them now, that's for sure.

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

"It was actually painful to listen to them repeat the rumors, gossip, innuendo, and character assassinations, and their intentional ignorance of the facts in the case. I have a much different opinion of them now, that's for sure."

Or maybe, just maybe, they had a point. They are the same people they were five years ago. Rush hasn't changed. Hannity hasn't changed. Savage well-- he's essentially the same too. They aren't part of some 'machine'. They're just like you and me-- offering their opinions as they see it.

Did you ever hear Terri's taped message? It put chills down my spine. Admittedly, perhaps it was a hoax. Perhaps it was some incredible fluke. But it merited investigation, because a human life was in Greer's hands.

OK well, this may be my last post on this thread: maybe. We are beginning circular arguments.

FRegards....

[robertpaulsen]

"Or maybe, just maybe, they had a point."

No, they didn't. Why do I say that?

What if Terri had a Living Will which essentially said, in writing, what she had told Michael and two others about not wanting to live that way. I believe Rush and the others would have taken Michael's side, and told the right-to-life fanatics to pi$$ off.

Now, I ask you, what's the difference between a verbal request and a written one? Under Florida law, there is no difference. So what happened?

"Did you ever hear Terri's taped message?"

No, but I did watch the equally compelling follow-the-balloon-with-your-eyes video. Or was it the follow-the-eyes-with-the-balloon video?

Since we now know she was blind, do you still believe her mother was the paragon of truthfulness?

[robertpaulsen]

"Who witnessed the autopsy? Was it taped? And did the autopsy factor in the damage done to her through dehydration?"

I'd bet 10 bucks that if Michael didn't have the body cremated you'd be calling for an exhumation. You will NEVER be satisfied.

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

"...Now, I ask you, what's the difference between a verbal request and a written one? Under Florida law, there is no difference. So what happened?..."

Well, we have a tape of [allegely] Terri trying to say whether she wanted to live, with multiple witnesses in the room, seeking to testify that it was her voice. How did Judge Greer react? He dismissed the motion and BANNED tape recorders in her room.

"Since we now know she was blind, do you still believe her mother was the paragon of truthfulness?"

At what point of her dehydration did she become blind? Unfortunately, so far as I know, Judge Greer corrupted the physical evidence with his decision.

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

"You will NEVER be satisfied."

When will the courts be satisfied? They unconstitutionally rebelled against Congress's legislation regarding Terri. If there was enough public awareness of what the nurses were saying, of what the Schindlers were saying, and of what others said, those judges would have been removed in disgrace by the senate.

Then the courts legislated from the bench on the Kelo decision, neutering our land rights. The courts are intervening in presidential elections, for goodness sake, claiming authority on that matter! They allow the infringement of the right to bear arms. And they have 40 million corpses under their reeking benches.

Why should I respect a judge any more than a nurse? Give me one good reason.

[robertpaulsen]

"Well, we have a tape of [allegely] Terri trying to say whether she wanted to live,"

Say what? First it was, "I want to ....", and now it's "I want to live"? Geez, what's next? "I want to live to see my children grow and marry and have children of their own ..."?

Hey, why not? If you're going to make something up, go big.

"At what point of her dehydration did she become blind?"

Given her lack of a cerebral cortex, dehydration never came into play.

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

"Say what? First it was, "I want to ....", and now it's "I want to live"? "

I need to add, her utterances were in response to the question of whether she wanted to live. Yes, perhaps she was off in la-la-land. But if any words were formed, then I didn't realise how 'hip' Euthanisia is becoming these days.

I would like to euthanize homocidal maniacs and extreme perverts. Anyone who deliberately kills someone else, molests an 11 year old child, or tries to profit from kiddie-porn isn't worth rehabilitating, no matter how insane the experts think they are. Funny how few euthanisia types would agree with that statement. Only innocent people should be euthanized, I suppose. I hope you aren't one of them. Perhaps we could call it a 'delayed abortion'. I'd rather call it 'the death penalty', but whatever works.

"Given her lack of a cerebral cortex, dehydration never came into play."

Based on what several people said, someone was lying about exactly how brain damaged Terri really was. But, well, just belittle all those people who conspired against Michael, and let her bleed from her eye sockets from a slow death [which may have damaged her eyes, I would imagine]. Both sides can be accused of wearing tinfoil, you see. And if I am to be wrong, I'll be wrong on the side of life, because I can't live with myself if I err on the side of death.

Now, since you like Michael Schiavo so much, and since you are feeling so perky, please allow me to "ax" you a few questions:

Is it true that Cindy Shook, his former girlfriend, testified that he frequently stalked her on the road and even ran her off the road? Is it true that Cindy Shook [now Mrs. Brasher] was so intimidated by Michael, fearful of what he might do to her family, that she had to be subpenoed in order to testify at all? Is it true that Sandy Shook testified that Michael admitted to her that he and Terri never discussed life support matters?

And is this correct?

"Nurses’ testimony: Heidi Law, Carla Sauer-Iyer, Carolyn Johnson have been ignored and dismissed without hearing; each testified that Michael was abusive to Terri and may have attempted to kill her by insulin injection and attempts to induce pneumonia by turning the thermostat in her room to 64 degrees."

I've learned about high profile cases, more than once, when shoddy autopsy work done in the dark of night. And I've learned a lot about insurance fraud scams. That makes a lot more sense than thinking that there's some Vast Life Wing Conspiracy against Michael.

I mentioned once before that Michael was trained to perform CPR. Why didn't he? Didn't he give a fig about his wife? You once asked if I think he tried to kill her. No. I think he lost his temper and did something really stupid. It wasn't a classic act of strangulation, BTW. What exactly? I don't know. And when he saw her collapsed, I think he panicked. He didn't give her CPR because he was scared what might happen if she recovered. That seems pretty obvious, best I can tell.

I don't think this was a planned act. Then he had a chance to get rich.

One last question. Is this true? "Investigate Insurance company established in Jan 2001 at the home of Michael Schiavo and his girlfriend/fiancee Jody Centonze. (Jerger and Centonze Insurnace Agency Inc.) Michael is listed on the Board of Directors for the corporation."

Was "Insurance" deliberately misspelled in the corporate filing to avoid investigation? Is this the kind of guy that the Old Media defends on a regular basis?

[robertpaulsen]

"Is it true that Cindy Shook, his former girlfriend, testified that he frequently stalked her on the road and even ran her off the road? Is it true that Cindy Shook [now Mrs. Brasher] was so intimidated by Michael, fearful of what he might do to her family, that she had to be subpenoed in order to testify at all? Is it true that Sandy Shook testified that Michael admitted to her that he and Terri never discussed life support matters?"

"And is this correct?"

I don't know. I don't see the relevance. Why didn't she testify in 2000 when it would have mattered?

""Nurses’ testimony: Heidi Law, Carla Sauer-Iyer, Carolyn Johnson have been ignored and dismissed without hearing; each testified that Michael was abusive to Terri and may have attempted to kill her by insulin injection and attempts to induce pneumonia by turning the thermostat in her room to 64 degrees."

Thank you for the quotation marks around 'nurses'. Yep. That's what they said. You believe them? I don't. Again, why didn't they testify in 2000?

Michael waits (for good reason) to bring up Terri's wish not to live like that and you go ape$hit wanting to know why he "suddenly remembered". Iyer waited 8 years to say she witnessed what looked like attempted murder and she's your star witness! You lose credibility with each post.

Oh, by the way. Take a position, will you? You post, 'Here's what person "A" said. Here's what person "B" did'. Yada, yada, yada. So what? Do you support what they said and did? If so, then say, "I believe Terri was murdered because ...." or somesuch. Stop hiding behind other people's words.

"He didn't give her CPR because he was scared what might happen if she recovered. That seems pretty obvious, best I can tell."

Maybe he thought he would injure her further, her having fallen down the stairs and all with a possible broken neck or back. I have no idea.

"I don't think this was a planned act. Then he had a chance to get rich."

There are no guarantees in life. Yeah, he got $300K, but he got lucky and I wouldn't call that "rich". Also, he did offer to donate Terri's jury award to charity, so what makes you say, where did you possibly get your gossip, that money was an issue here? I'd really like to know. You pull this crap out of the air with nothing to support it, you never say that you yourself believe it to be true, and you treat it as somehow significant to the case. Gossip and innuendo is all you got.

"One last question. Is this true? "Investigate Insurance company established in Jan 2001 at the home of Michael Schiavo and his girlfriend/fiancee Jody Centonze. (Jerger and Centonze Insurnace Agency Inc.) Michael is listed on the Board of Directors for the corporation."

"Was "Insurance" deliberately misspelled in the corporate filing to avoid investigation? Is this the kind of guy that the Old Media defends on a regular basis?"

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Gossip and innuendo.

Look, tell me your point. What are you saying? What are you attempting to prove? WHAT DO YOU BELIEVE?

Are you saying there was some insurance scam going on? Something illegal? What? I have no idea what you're trying to say here. I don't see any relevance to anything.

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

bump to self... BRB

[justshutupandtakeit]

That is pretty hilarious. It wasn't the debilitating effects of old age or sickness but MS that did the Pope in. Award winning nonsense.

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

Funny how I can put up depositions, studies, and even a witness forcibly subpeonoed, but it's all 'gossip and innuendo', because your research [supposedly so superior] is slanted by a pro-death bias. So far, I'm the one going in-depth, while your points are repetitive exhortations. I don't want the 'Kill Terri' Crowd to squirm out of their mistake. They need to face something inside themselves. Your primary ally is the Old BS media, for goodness sake. That ought to be a warning flare right there.

You keep looking for my opinion. I don't need to offer much opinion other than to seek the truth. This isn't a question of opinion, but a question of superior research. Hiding behind ignorance doesn't cut it with me.

You conveniently don't know that Cindy Shook [maiden name] was too scared of Michael to step forward. It took a subpoena to make her testify. And then she testifies, under oath--NOTE not mere gossip that Micheal [a]-- ran her off the road with his car -- and [b]-- admitted to her that he never talked with Terri about what to do if she were PVS. His belated testimony, and note he refused to give her CPR during her collapse, is worth squat to anyone but a typical US judge. What are colleges teaching those guys?

The only reason they weren't in the court record was because Greer wouldn't allow it. Judge Greer has financial ties to Terri's hospice, BTW. He also was incapable of sizing up the body language of witnesses. He was unable to personally see videos. He's legally blind. Did he recuse himself? Of course not. We're only talking about a life-and-death trial here.

Now for your trump card. Your only strong suit is 'cerebral cortex'. Common sense told me that if you kill someone through dehydration, causing blood to flow out the eye sockets, wrecking organs, etc. that the evidence of an autopsy is severely compromised. I predicted that it would make it impossible to ever resolve this controversy through an autopsy. While I'm health-care illiterate, I was correct according to Sherry Eros, MD, a neuropsychiatrist. She and her husband completely blew away the deceitful way the autopsy report was handled by the ME and your allies, the Old Media:

http://www.renewamerica.us/columns/eros/050629

"The brain no less than the rest of the body is composed largely of water. Common sense dictates that there will be significant weight loss in all organs under circumstances of extreme longterm dehydration...At this point it is impossible to determine to what degree Terri's presumed loss in brain weight is attributable to longterm cerebral atrophy vs. nearly two weeks of total dehydration."

Regarding blindness:

"To use the language of the ME, it is perfectly "consistent with" the postmortem findings that the damage to her occipital lobes occasioned a less-than-complete blindness. There are several possible causes of occipital lobe damage capable of causing cortical blindness or cortical visual impairment" [partial blindness]"..."Lastly, we suggest it is also possible, according to recent reports in the medical literature such as this ...

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=6835679&dopt=Abstract

...that the devastating dehydration to which Terri was subjected during the last two weeks of her life, might have exacerbated her already existing cortical visual impairment."

So, now we go back full circle. You need Judge Greer's tests to back up the BS media spin swirling around the autopsy. Many eye witnesses, most of whom are medical professionals, contradict those tests. It's now up to the neuropsychiatrists, Michael's future and past behavior, the hospice's future and past behavior, Judge Greer's future and past behavior, and the people who had the pleasure of spending moments with them to sort this out. Time will tell. And I predict pain for Michael defenders.

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

I guess you forgot how distressed Saint Paul the Great was over Terri. And I guess you aren't informed about how important the will to live is. The Pope was reportedly heartbroken, but factoring that in his death during her dehydration doesn't fit with your agenda. Laugh all you want.

[justshutupandtakeit]

The Pope was living on borrowed time for a couple of years before the Schiavo debacle ever arose. You expect me to believe that his heart was broken over the stoppage of pretenses while millions died from disease, tyranny, tsunamis, earthquakes and sheer evil running rampant (Islam)? Ridiculous.

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

Saint *** John Paul*** the Great [My apologies to a Christian whom I admire.]

[Arthur Wildfire! March]

The Pope's strong feelings are history. Try a google if you like.