The Barbarians at the Gates of Paris

City Journal ^ | Autumn 2002 | Theodore Dalrymple

[rmlew]

immigration bump

[Hank Rearden]

I certainly hope Bush isn't making plans to spend billions more of our dollars attempting to rescue these cretins from the consequences of the crappy world they've built for themselves.

[rmlew]

Mexican culture is Christian, not slammie like the maghrebins (nord-akfrikans).
1. It is both Catholic and native.
2. They area different civilization, regardless of their religion.
They may be one with you in belief, but they are not Westerners.

[Skywalk]

Trust me, no one is overlooking the Islamist aspect of France's situation but it goes far beyond Islamism's creeping influence.

In fact, one of the problems is that these thugs are distinctly NON-Islamic in their daily lives and that more of them are turning into more 'upright' terrorists. You know the kind, like the Nation of Islam--no drugs(at least no use or sales to the faithful) and more disciplined behavior--but hatred and racism at the base of the ideology. But these Muslims in France will be much more dangerous.

I just think it's way too easy to just blame these riots and France's problems on Islam vs. the West, when I see some of these SAME cultural issues(but to a lesser extent, or at least less separated) in the US with NON-MUSLIM underclass culture.

In fact, what he describes in the Zone could just as easily be blacks or Latinos in the "inner city" and the 'extremists' who are willing to provide meaning and discipline would be like Nation of Islam types or god knows what other garbage here. (whereas in France, radical Islamist terrorist beliefs are gaining more and more adherents--as they are here.) THe intiial problem (underclass pathology, multiculti inability to confront) is not with Islam specifically. But it is Islam that will make this terrible situation become fatal for Europe.

[Cronos]

Oh, I agree, they don't belong to the broad, Western Culture, but I think any non-slammie culture is a live-and-let-live kind which can be tolerated. Non-Western cultures would include the Russian, the Chinese, the Indian, the Latin American, the JApanese etc.

[little jeremiah]

Thanks for your articulate comments.

[jb6]

Newsflash: this already happened. Thousands were killed. We have already figured it out, and we're fighting it in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc

News flash, both parties in our government and the MSM constantly tell us that Islam is the great religion of peace and dignity and that the terrorists are a minority.

Newsflash: we are still supporting the KLA, giving money to the PLO, arming Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Jordan and a score of other Islamic states. We are still keeping the Serbs out of their ancestral homeland of Kosovo and making the Israelies walk down the Road Map to Suicide.

We have a long, long way to go before we wake up, stop supporting the "good" Islamics. Close our borders and form the real alliances we need to.

[jb6]

911 was a shock but the entropy is to great...now a nuke and well, the slammies have signed their own death warrants...not to mention what will happen in the streets of America.

[justa-hairyape]

But it is Islam that will make this terrible situation become fatal for Europe.

The US has experienced and handled racist riots in the past. Riots alone are not a lethal problem to western nations. Granted in Los Angeles we had to call in Marines from Camp Pendleton. The National French Police force is armed with machine guns and they have armored cars. They have the weapons to handle the situation. Personally I was greeted by two machine gun wielding representatives of the National French Police Force in the Nice airport last year. The immediate question is will French politicians put their petty political ambitions ahead of national security issues ? We already know that leftist within the US, will not. What France and Western nations definitely cannot handle is a collusion or melding of Islamic Extremists with our traditional disgruntled occasionally rioting populations. The US does have racist problems within certain communities. For example, within the past year I personally experienced racism against whites from blacks in Cincinnati. A black waitress refused to serve me and my white partner. She then immediately served a couple of blacks who had just entered. Then the white cook walked out and asked if we had been served yet. We replied no, and he just grunted something in disgust and walked away. Me and my partner immediately got up and left. I did not mind it at all since I was not looking forward to a 'Steak and Shake'. It is not what I consider a healthy meal anyway but it was late at night. We ended up in a 'Waffle House' and I ordered a breakfast and ended up with a plate of grease.

[justa-hairyape]

Oops. Logic error. The following sentence should read.

We already know that leftist within the US, will.

[Diva]

Thank you for posting this. I have been worried about this sort of situation for awhile. I have a friend who was born in Paris but is now a US citizen. I am interested in finding out what she thinks as she still has relatives and friends in France.

[Zeke 1]

I agree! This Isamist attempts at taking over Europe is not new. We truly are in a fight of civilizations.

An excellant article in refference to this is written in the Washington Times by Tony Blankley.

http://www.washtimes.com/national/20050912-122024-9420r.htm

[Diva]

Nation of Islam types or god knows what other garbage here

This is not an attack on you but I find that a big part of our problem is many of us, in our darker moments, think of the under-class as garbage. It could be that I have mis-interpreted your remark and I apologize in advance it I have. But, no matter how horrid people act they are still humans with souls and they are loved by God.

Other than being a very good article about the specifics of the current situation in France the article is marvelous in that it shows how history repeats itself over and over again. When I read about the "cheap labor" being brought in to France to solve a temporary labor shortage I was reminded of Abraham, Joseph and the Hebrews in Egypt.

I wonder how many times a government has found itself in a similar situation? Look at what happened to the poor Egyptians who thought they could continue to "use" their cheap labor and didn't they complain over and over again about the Jewish tribes over-populating Egypt? As I recall there was a little "plan" devised by Pharaoh to "fix" the problem, which of course didn't work. The big difference, I guess, is that the Hebrews wanted to leave Egypt. I'm sure there are French citizens who will soon begin, if they haven't already, to consider paying the North Africans to return to the "old country."

Don't Muslims consider themselves to be descendants of Abraham as well? I wonder how they read and interpret the Covenant made by God with Abraham.

[jslade]

Islamist proselytism flourishes in the prisons of France (where 60 percent of the inmates are of immigrant origin), as it does in British prisons; and it takes only a handful of Zacharias Moussaouis to start a conflagration.

This is happening here.....the good old US. The hammer needs to come down. HARD! France is lost through it's own malfeasance. They fowled their own nest. We must take a lesson from their own self-destruction.

[Graymatter]

Sooner or later, what goes on in France will become our problem. They are only doing the cooking.

[The Cuban]

Not an accurate perception. Poland is a better model.

[stocksthatgoup]

Concealed carry now.

[rahbert]

verily..

[Tolik]

Revisiting the 3 years old article by Theodore Dalrymple that provides an excellent explanation of what is going on in Paris now. Prescient and disturbing!

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[Renfield]

Bump for later copy.