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FR Poll Thread: Does the Interstate Commerce Clause authorize prohibition of drugs and firearms?
Free Republic ^ | 11-3-05

Posted on 11/03/2005 2:24:08 PM PST by inquest

There's a new poll up on the side. Do you think the interstate commerce clause of the Constitution authorizes federal laws against narcotics and firearms? Now lest everyone forget, this isn't asking whether you personally agree with such laws. It's about whether your honest reading of the Constitution can justify them.

While you're thinking it over, it might help to reflect on what James Madison had to say about federal power over interstate commerce:

Being in the same terms with the power over foreign commerce, the same extent, if taken literally, would belong to it. Yet it is very certain that it grew out of the abuse of the power by the importing States in taxing the non-importing, and was intended as a negative and preventive provision against injustice among the States themselves, rather than as a power to be used for the positive purposes of the General Government, in which alone, however, the remedial power could be lodged.
I'll be looking forward to your comments.


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: alito; banglist; commerce; commerceclause; frpoll; herecomesmrleroy; interstate; interstatecommerce; madison; no; scotus; thatmrleroytoyou; wodlist
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To: robertpaulsen; Mojave
Hey spike, can the States & Feds cooperate to prohibit guns?



NY: State to hire 100 new troopers to tackle illegal gun sales
Address:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1546110/posts

"We will go after guns from the streets to the source and not just in New York, but outside of New York," Pataki said.

The troopers will be deputized as federal agents to go after the sources of the guns, often people in southern states with more lax gun control laws, said ATF special agent in charge William McMahon.
A recent ATF study found 80 percent of the guns used in crimes in New York City were originally bought out of state.
3,001 posted on 12/23/2005 10:37:21 AM PST by don asmussen
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To: robertpaulsen

On a conservative site, you try to make the argument that the 9th Circuit is a legitimate source of constitutional reasoning?

You've gone off the deep end. The quote that you provide is utter nonsense and any reading of any literature other than from the Brady Bunch will clearly show it as such.

We are not 'afforded' rights. Our rights are inherent and ours from birth. The BoR is a reminder to government to mess with them.

Sheesh. Haven't you learned anything in all the time that you've been here?


3,002 posted on 12/23/2005 10:38:35 AM PST by Badray (Limited constitutional government means protection for all, but favor for none.)
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To: Badray
"On a conservative site, you try to make the argument that the 9th Circuit is a legitimate source of constitutional reasoning?"

Not at all. The discussion concerned the predicted end result if the U.S. Supreme Court ruled on the second amendment today.

I say that, based on lower federal court rulings (including the very vocal 9th Circuit), the U.S. Supreme Court would favor the collective rights interpretation. If you disagree, I'd like to hear why.

"We are not 'afforded' rights. Our rights are inherent and ours from birth."

Sure. And as a society we decide which of those rights we will protect, and to what extent. Not all rights are protected -- but you knew that.

"Sheesh. Haven't you learned anything in all the time that you've been here? "

Me? Yes. You?

3,003 posted on 12/23/2005 1:09:05 PM PST by robertpaulsen
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To: robertpaulsen
The discussion concerned the predicted end result if the U.S. Supreme Court ruled on the second amendment today.

The discussion to which your comment pertained was with me, and I can assure you I was making no such predictions about how the court would rule, nor was that the subject of discussion on this thread. Only you brought up this "prediction" business, for reasons known only to you. The issue under discussion is what the Constitution actually requires.

3,004 posted on 12/23/2005 1:26:11 PM PST by inquest (If you favor any legal status for illegal aliens, then do not claim to be in favor of secure borders)
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To: robertpaulsen
Paulsen admits:

" --- as a society we decide which of those rights we will protect, and to what extent. Not all rights are protected -- but you knew that.

The discussion concerned the predicted end result if the U.S. Supreme Court ruled on the second amendment today.

I say that, based on lower federal court rulings (including the very vocal 9th Circuit), the U.S. Supreme Court would favor the collective rights interpretation. --"

Until you 'predicted' so, [in your effort to justify existing gun prohibitions] this discussion was not overly concerned with the U.S. Supreme Court making a definitive ruling on the second amendment in the near future.
- They are terrified to do so, -- but you knew that.

Your argument that the 9th Circuit is a legitimate source of constitutional reasoning is yet another of your amusing attempts to take your foot out of your own mouth..

It bears repeating -- "Haven't you learned anything in all the time that you've been here?"

3,005 posted on 12/23/2005 1:38:23 PM PST by don asmussen
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To: don asmussen
"judicial fiat" health & safety decrees by Congress

Have a Happy Hangover.

3,006 posted on 12/23/2005 4:41:37 PM PST by Mojave
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To: Mojave
Paulsen supports "judicial fiat" health & safety decrees by Congress, and Moj is too confused to realize it.
So it goes for the brady twins.

Mojave toasts, inanely:

Have a Happy Hangover.

Sure thing kiddo. -- Sounds like you got a start on all of us, and the booze is talking..

3,007 posted on 12/23/2005 7:09:29 PM PST by don asmussen
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To: don asmussen
"judicial fiat" health & safety decrees by Congress

Alzheimer's.

3,008 posted on 12/23/2005 9:24:41 PM PST by Mojave
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To: Mojave; robertpaulsen
Here's Alzheimer's:


Rhode Island legalizes medical marijuana; House overrides governor's veto
Address:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1551270/posts?page=218
3,009 posted on 01/05/2006 11:00:05 AM PST by don asmussen
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To: everyone; robertpaulsen; Mojave

The revisionism never ends.

Replies
Address:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1551270/replies?c=452


3,010 posted on 01/07/2006 7:52:22 AM PST by don asmussen
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The Science of Medical Marijuana Prohibition (Op-Ed)
Address:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1650191/posts?page=254



More revisionism. It never ends.


3,011 posted on 06/19/2006 2:39:37 PM PDT by tpaine
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To: Mojave
The USSC remanded cases to the circuit for decision in response to a request from the Justice Department. The Supreme Court hasn't heard the case, decided the case or ordered what verdict the circuit must make.

The Supremes heard enough to know that the issues in Raich and Stewart were the same, so they sent the case back to the 9th, where the verdict was perfectly predictable back when we were having this discussion.

Now the 9th has concluded their reconsideration, and guess what? They found the same thing the Supremes found: that the issues in Raich and Stewart were the same, and that therefore Stewart's conviction was upheld in light of Raich.
3,012 posted on 07/03/2006 4:06:43 AM PDT by publiusF27
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To: publiusF27
The Supremes heard enough to know that the issues in Raich and Stewart were the same

I won't ask for your imaginary source.

3,013 posted on 07/21/2006 11:28:48 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: Mojave
Not imaginary at all. All I was saying was that they read the cert petition before granting cert and remanding the case. The petition and the remand order both say the issues are the same in Stewart as in Raich and Wickard. Now, the 9th has said the same. I hope this has all helped you to figure out what "in light of" means! ;-)
3,014 posted on 07/22/2006 7:44:39 AM PDT by publiusF27
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To: publiusF27
All I was saying was that they read the cert petition before granting cert and remanding the case.

You're in full retreat.

3,015 posted on 07/22/2006 1:24:58 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: Mojave

Huh? Retreat from what? Are you still saying the Supreme Court essentially never heard of Stewart, and Stewart is unrelated to Raich? The Supremes and everyone else have now said the issues in the two cases are the same.


3,016 posted on 07/25/2006 8:49:00 AM PDT by publiusF27
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To: publiusF27
1. The Supremes heard enough to know that the issues in Raich and Stewart were the same

2. Are you still saying the Supreme Court essentially never heard of Stewart, and Stewart is unrelated to Raich?

Strawman.

Don't trip running away from your original argument.

3,017 posted on 07/28/2006 9:47:19 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: publiusF27
The Supreme Court hasn't heard the case, decided the case or ordered what verdict the circuit must make. They read the cert petition on the case, decided to grant it, and ordered that the circuit reconsider their decision in light of the then-recent overturning of the very similar 9th circuit verdict in Raich, which is pretty much the same thing as ordering what verdict the circuit must make, to those of us who understand what "in light of" means... ;-)
3,018 posted on 08/01/2006 6:13:45 PM PDT by publiusF27
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To: Everybody

What precisely are the human rights that must be protected?
Address:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1742193/posts


A counter to the theory that: '-- Not all rights are protected; -- as a society we decide which of those rights we will protect, and to what extent. --'


3,019 posted on 11/21/2006 10:40:59 AM PST by tpaine
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To: y'all
Replies
Address:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1747810/replies?c=384


Sour grapes & revisionism never end for FR's prohibitionists.
3,020 posted on 12/06/2006 7:34:19 PM PST by tpaine (" My most important function on the Supreme Court is to tell the majority to take a walk." -Scalia)
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