My Answer to a disturbing insurgent propoganda film

Sino Defense Forum ^ | 21 Oct 2005 | Jeff Head

[Jeff Head]

Here is a quote from a military/defense forum I also post on. I normally post on the Navy portion of that forum with a few other Americans, but this is from a poster in their World Armed Forces Forum who linked to a disturbing insurgent propoganda film about their use of IEDs against American and Iraqi forces.

Insurgent propoganda video about IED attacks against Americans (Choose free download and then look for doanload message at bottom of next page)

Be warned, the film is disturbing...but it is also a huge mistake by the insurgents because there is tremendous intelligence that can be gleaned from it by our forces to be used against those same insurgents.

Anyway, after viewing it, I replied to the author as follows:

Here is the intro from the original poster, followed by my response:

By crazyandinsane: This thread is meant for the Iraq war. Videos are fine (as long as it isn't a beheading video or something like that). So I will first post up a 13:46 Windows media video by the insurgents. I would like to say that this thread isn't meant to be anti-American or anti-Iraqi. It is just meant to see what is happening in Iraq right now.

Anyway, I found this video to be interesting because it shows attacks against Abrahams and other heavily armored veichles and what the condition of such veichles are after the attack. So please watch if you want.

Answer by Jeff Head: Well, I watched the entire video. I believe the insurgents are foolish in their bravado because this film in and of itself will be an intelligene bonanza for American and especially Iraqi forces.

That said, as an American citizen with friends and relatives in harms way in Iraq...it was a difficult video to watch as you can imagine. My points on the video are as follows:

1. In more than half the cases of the IED going off, the vehicle keeps going right past the explosion. Either the armor is effective, or the device (which is likely) just was timed badly and was not a direct hit. In either case, they are not all that effective considering that the insurgents, in making this film, surely filmed the best they had for propoganda purposes. I believe many, many more miss by a greater margin and cause less damage.
2. Many of the shots of individual insurgents shooting their weapons (short of the mortar and missile shots) seem staged for the film.
3. Clearly, the insurgents are damaging American and Iraqi force vehicles, and killing coalitoon forces. But they are dying in much higher numbers...and their impact, it seems to me, is becoming less and less telling on the Iraqi people themselves.

Why do I say this last? Look at the two votes. Earlier this year people (Iraqi people) turned out in vast numbers to elect their own government. The Sunnis largely boycotted that vote...but the people came out just the same, and they did so in the face of huge threats by the insurgents to thwart it...and yet they could not.

Then, last week, another vote was held. Again, in the face of great threatenings and blusterings by the insurgency. Again vast numbers of Iraqi people voted and this time the Sunnis voted to (see the trend), and not one Sunni providence voted the constitution down by the requisite amount...not one. This says volumes. The Sunnis themselves, in numbers not thought possible, voted for the constitution. This is supposed to be the largest, most agitated power base for the insurgents.

No, it is clear the insurgency is failing and will continue to fail in Iraq. It is also equally clear that all of the propganda and leftist talk about imperial ambitions by the US are just so many words. The Iraqis themselves are voting, determining their own future and such an occurance is an abject defeat for the inusrgency and all those who support them...and a corresponding victory for American policy there, which is simply a free and peaceful Iraq as a model for other Middle Eastern nations to follow. I believe if it comes about in Iraq, the people in those other nations will be the ones who make it happen in those other nations.

So, here is another video for this thread. It is not exciting. It is not flashy...quite frankly...it is pretty boring. But it speaks a language that thunders over the language of the insurgant film..becuase it is the Iraqi people themselve who are speaking it, and they are doing it peacefully and in spite of the threats and blusterings of those same insurgents.
The Iraqi people voting for their constitution

[Jeff Head]

For your information. If you know someone in military intelligence, have them get the link to the insurgent and download and view it.

[Jeff Head]

Here you go.

[King Prout]

bumping a great post

[jveritas]

The Pentagon must change its policy of not showing " the killing of the enemy" and start releasing videos and footage of us annihilating the enemy.

[Jeff Head]

All of the naysaying and disparaging by the left and the media...all of the blusterings, threatenings, and even killings by the insurgency cannot hide or quiet or stop the pull of freedom that is taking hold in the hearts and minds of the Iraqi people.

[SnarlinCubBear]

ping pong

[Jeff Head]

No need to. Its obvious. These people, in trying to create support, are giving away valuable intelligence about their own methodsa and activites that will help our guys better protect themselves while killing more of them...while the Iraqi people keep voting and setting up their own government.

[R. Scott]

No, it is clear the insurgency is failing and will continue to fail in Iraq. It is also equally clear that all of the propganda and leftist talk about imperial ambitions by the US are just so many words.

Sure wish our own leftist MSM would come to that realization.

[Jeff Head]

They have come to that realization...that is why they are fighting so hard against it.

[R. Scott]

Guess so.

[Bobibutu]

Thanks Jeff - great find.

[MileHi]

Pretty disturbing stuff.

[Tax-chick]

Tanks.

[Darksheare]

Excellent find, good analysis too.
We do have intel types that lurk, so it may be that they will come across this thread.
Especially if it stays bumped.

[rlmorel]

BTTT

[mikegi]

You can see the individual clips on other websites, like ogrish. There's nothing fundamentally wrong with the other side producing propaganda videos even though they are mostly evil people. We show our successful attacks occasionally. I'm sure that our intelligence people have plenty of footage gathered from dead and captured insurgents. I believe I saw a video *we* released that was found on a dead one.

If anything, these videos make me respect even more our forces and the work they're doing to destroy this evil. The VBIED are particularly nasty.

[Watery Tart]

Good post.

Bump!

[fanfan]

Thanks for the ping Jeff.

BTTT.

[Steel and Fire and Stone]

Ok, interesting film. Inspiring, too.

If I were tiring of the fight, this video has invigorated me. I'm quite willing to see this country fight on for the next 100 years, right up until the last dead Arab.

President Bush stated, after 9/11, that "you're either with us or against us...". Was that just hyperbole? Or, did this President mean what he said. He took us to Afghanistan, and then on to Iraq. I'm thrilled that both countries may become stable, free democracies. But alas, they may become something entirely different after we leave, and we cannot control that. However, these nations will be unlikely to ever pose a threat to the U.S.A. or it's citizens again.

Nation building may have many fine moral points to recommend it. However, the need for national security is an absolute obligation for U.S. government leaders. If this country under the current President and Congress will not do what's necessary, either make war or peace, to protect it's citizens against hostile foreign nationals led by, supported by, or independent of foreign nation states, no one else will. Much as we have fine allies such as Britain and others, ultimately, the only country who can work in the interests of American citizens is the America herself. No one else gives a damn whether American's die or live.

As this video demonstrates, we are at war with an enemy who is killing our military citizens, and who can't wait to expand their war to include every American man, woman, and child. Again, I ask, was President Bush serious in his post-9/11 statements?

I know I'm dreaming, but there are a large number of veterans who still have usable logistics or fighting skills, who'd be delighted to join in the fight for a year or so. The only thing we'd ask is what every sailor, soldier, airman, or Marine on active duty would ask - i.e. that our service and lives not be wasted by a halfhearted effort. How many veterans would honor a national call for volunteers? 100's, 1000's, or hundreds of thousands? If we could start at the Syrian or Iranian border, it'd be worth the effort. I'm old and overweight, but I still have uniforms and boots in my closet, I can still hike, run, and fire a gun, and still act in my previous, military-professional position. We might not be our nation's "cutting edge" anymore, but I guarantee you that we're better than anything Syria, Iran, or their surrogates (Al Qaeda et. al.) can field.

If this is a war we're serious about, it's time to put the men of this country into the field to win it and end it. It's not just one American's pride speaking, but an informed American's concern that the Bush Administration is now playing Vietnam era politics with the war effort. (Of course, the Democrats made traitorous "hey" of the war from the start, perhaps in silent glee over every fallen soldier - every body - just that much better to damage Bush and their political enemies. They aren't worth bringing into the discussion; no Democrat is patriot at this point).

In 2001, my son was 14 years old. In 2005 he's 18 years old, and may have to decide whether he'll carry on the fight. We're not fighting Hitler's Germany. This country has the ability to end this war, but this will not happen unless Iran, Syria, and perhaps a few other silent-partner nation-states involved in the war against us are defeated or neutralized. Otherwise, the war will continue, our military men and women will continue to die, today yours, tomorrow perhaps my own, and after that - our grandchildren?

I'm willing to support whatever it takes to win the war, and for however long. But don't waste American lives. Don't play politics with the war. Get it done, Mr. President!

In 2001, we had a President who appeared to mean what he said. In 2005, it's not clear we have the same man in office. I could go into his promises versus results in the SCOTUS nominations as an example, but that's another issue. Unfortunately, Bush's do have an established record for going soft on their campaign promises, and compromising on the conservative principles AFTER elected. "W" appeared cut from different cloth than his father, but his credibility is starting to look a bit weak at this point.

SFS

[concretebob]

PING to the 10th Mountain
We are not pretty, we will never be tapped for the diplomatic corps, or protocol officer.
But we are dependable and trustworthy, and there is no expiration date on an oath to protect our Nation from all enemies, foreign and domestic, and defend the Constitution.
I would go in a heartbeat..just to see the look on the faces of some of those young Marines I was working with this past summer.
Those kids were awesome..they were in-between assignment and deployment, and took summer jobs with a site contractor, until their orders came through. Everyone of them couldn't wait to get to Iraq. 19, 20 years old..my hope index pegged just being around them.
Most of them are now in-country
My profile page will explain the connection.