Mark Steyn: The death of Mother Russia

The Spectator (U.K.) ^ | 10/22/05 | Mark Steyn

[Lukasz]

Many people and peoples tried to destroy Russia. But nobody could. Seems that Steyn is too pessimistic. Russia will win. Or lose. But then win anyway. As always...

and stay poor as always? This is not real victory then…

[TopQuark]

Mortality rate should be average life span.

It's like saying "the average must but the maximum." These are two different measures, used for different purposes. Average life span is appropriate for assessment of the quality and safety of biological life over long-term. The infant mortality rate is appropriate for assessment of the health of the reproductive function and safety of childbirth.

[jb6]

The affect of infant mortality gets totalled into the average life span. It's a direct coefficient, the higher your infant mortality rate, the lower your average life span.

[jb6]

Coming from someone who's nation has a 19% unemployment rate and lives off of EU hand outs to keep the proliteriate from rebelling....nothing like massive deficit spending on someone else's dime.

[mym]

In 1913 (by WWI) Russian GDP was the 2nd. In 1985 (by perestroika) Soviet GDP was also the 2nd. The problem is that wars and other catastrophic events prevent Russia to become normal rich country.

[SuzyQue]

Gary - I was hoping you were right, but I'm not convinced. I looked for articles dated in 2005, and these are three that I immediately came up with:

"The average life expectancy of Russian men makes up 58-59 years today, which is 14-15 years less than the life expectancy of Russian women or men from developed countries." http://english.pravda.ru/main/18/90/360/15093_men.html

"Government statistics show that the average Russian man lives 58.6 years, compared with 73 years for the average Russian woman. In 1990, just before the Soviet Union broke apart, life expectancy for men was 63.4 years."
http://www.freep.com/news/nw/russia12e_20050212.htm

"IN THE two days since Lisa Petrachkova was born, Russia’s population has dropped by an estimated 2,000 people.  By the time she is one, more than 200,000 Russians will have died of unnatural causes; almost seven times the estimated civilian deaths in Iraq since the war began...last year, there were 1.6 million registered abortions in Russia and 1.5 million births....We have reached a point of no return. In terms of numbers there will never be more of us than before. But this is not the worst of it. The danger is that we are reaching another point of no return, in terms of the quality of the population.” http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,13509-1794617,00.html

 

[TopQuark]

Your post neither explains the previous, "Mortality rate should be average life span," nor justifies it.

The affect of infant mortality gets totalled into the average life span. It's a direct coefficient, the higher your infant mortality rate, the lower your average life span.

It is not true to say that mortality rates a coefficient in life expectancy. But, more importantly, so what? All sciences employ measures --- for different purposes -- that are not necessarily independent of each other. You are pointing out that the mortality rate and the life expectancy lack independence. So what? They are used to assess different characteristics of the population. What exactly is the problem here?

[Hardastarboard]

Is there any chance that Mr. Steyn will EVER be our President? Or at least Secretary of State? God, he is a great one, isn't he?

[GarySpFc]

You need to look at my post #82, which is from the 2004 CIA World Fact Book. The figures you quote are old. That said, the life expectancy of Russians and especially men dropped due to several factors including, the stress caused by the transition from a communist to a capitalistic society. My Russian friends are not going to like my saying this, but the men do not lead a healthy lifestyle.

[iva]

i bealive guys that you like Mark Stein, but i also want to bealive that you know who was Mark Twein which told once: rumours about my death a little overstated.

[REactor]

Russia is a strange and complex culture which is not much focused on material success as the Western countries are.

Maybe so. But the problem is that in Russia politics has always been more important than culture. And it was the politics of power, conquest and subjugation. Isn't it a paradox than even in Poland (which country Russians think to be most Russophobic) Russian literature was always extremely popular? Bulghakov was elected as the most important writer of the XXth century in Poland in a plebiscite by Polityka weekly. Russian literature (Tolstoy, Chekhov and even Dostoyevsky who hated Poles like dogs) has a more prominent position in Poland than English or American. Yet you couldn't find a nation that hates Russian politics more than Poles.
The answer to this is that we Poles know Russian culture and Russian politics firsthand.

[Lurker]

For later.

L

[REactor]

Russians were pigs long before Communism and would remain pigs long after Communism vanished.

Good point. I can only agree with your Latvian friend. The thing that Westerners never remembre is that Russia was the Empire of Evil long before Lenin. But I am a Pole so I'm Russophobic, ignore me please.

[REactor]

Guys, listen: Mr Steyn, one of the most influential columnists of the English-speaking world is a Russophobe, WE ARE NOT ALONE ;)))). Read the comments on this thread and save for the usual propaganda from jb6 and Garyspfc you will find only reasonable, sober and clear-sighted comments. How very refreshing!!

[irv]

Russia is a vacuum wrapped in a nullity inside an abyss.

with nukes

[REactor]

Mark Twain is dead.

[kaiser80]

Gary "discredited" himself some a couple of days ago but he had some courage to admit his mistakes per FR-mail, not publicly though. jb6, I belive nobody belives his propaganda. So no point in mentioning them. greetings.

[lizol]

Russian Abortion Killing and Sterilizing Millions; Demographic Collapse Likely to be Worse than Previously Predicted

[lizol]

Russian population shrinks to 143 million

[GarySpFc]

---I hope your Latvian friend feels the same way about the Latvian Communists who were part of the Soviet Empire and war machine. ---
His atitude was that the Russians were pigs long before Communism and would remain pigs long after Communism vanished.

I would not admit to having such a sorry bigot for a friend. To condemn a nationality of people for the sins of a few is evil itself. Your friend sounds as if he has a very black heart.