Posted on 10/03/2005 4:51:30 AM PDT by Former Military Chick
WASHINGTON - A U.S. soldier convicted of humiliating and abusing Iraqi prisoners said, in remarks made public late Sunday, she knew of "worse things" happening at Abu Ghraib and insisted military commanders were fully aware of what was going on in Iraq's infamous jail.
The comments, made by Private First Class Lynndie England in her first post-court marshal interview, contradicted assertions by top Pentagon officials that a small group of out-of-control soldiers were responsible for abuse at Abu Ghraib, and that however repulsive that mistreatment was, it did not amount to torture.
England, who became the face of the scandal because of a photograph of her holding a naked prisoner by a leash, was sentenced last Tuesday to three years in prison and dishonorably discharged from the Army after a military jury found her guilty of maltreating prisoners and committing an indecent act.
The trial capped a damaging scandal that erupted in 2004, following publication of pictures that showed Abu Ghraib inmates piled up naked on the floor in front of U.S. soldiers, cowering in front of snarling military dogs, chained to beds in stress positions and forced to stand naked in front of female guards.
But England, appearing on NBC's "Dateline" program, said the pictures did not convey the full extent of the abuse that took place in the cell block.
"I know worse things were happening over there," admitted the 22-year-old convict.
She said one night she heard blood-curdling screams coming from the block's shower room, where non-military interrogators had taken an Arab detainee.
"They had the shower on to muffle it, but it wasnt helping," she recalled. "They never screamed like that when we were humiliating. But this guy was like screaming bloody murder. I mean it still haunts me I can still hear it just like it happened yesterday."
The interrogators were not identified, but several investigations into the abuse have disclosed that Central Intelligence Agency operatives worked at Abu Ghraib alongside U.S. military intelligence, trying to glean useful information.
I also notice the source of the article as well.
Different spanks for different ranks &
Scapegoats of the empire
she looks like ET, and i hope she phones home so her spaceship can come pick her up and get her the heck out of here.
Just MAYBE Ms England has done enough damage to our country. I wish she would SHUT UP!
No matter how her conviction is spun, there is no way I can believe that a few Jr. Non-comm's and PFC's took it upon themselves to torture prisoners. Someone had to give the order, and that someone has crawled back under his/her rock and let the little people take the fall...disgusting and dishonorable.
she'll probably get involved with a jailer and have his child to add to her collection. then she'll blame him and his superiors.
not that I can think of why anybody would want to get close to that...
KARPINSKI WAS A “SHOPLIFTER”
GENERAL BUSTED TO COLONEL
BY BUSH IN WAKE OF ABU GHRAIB
SCANDAL REVEALED TO HAVE BEEN
HIDING PAST ARREST – WE REPORTED
BRASS HAT’S ALLEGED PRESENCE
DURING TORTURE SESSIONS AT IRAQI
PRISON MONTHS AGO – REVELATIONS
MAY HAVE LED TO RANK REDUCTION
MILITARYCORRUPTION.COM IS READ
AND MONITORED BY PENTAGON
ON A DAILY BASIS
© 2005 MilitaryCorruption.com
We are not taking credit for ex-Brig. Gen. Janis Karpinski’s well-deserved reduction in rank to colonel by President George Bush. But our revelations months ago on this web site, that the former military police commander is alleged to have been present during torture sessions at the infamous Abu Ghraib prison – casting doubt on the veracity of her many television appearances purporting ignorance of what had gone on there – seems to have been enough to force “the powers that be” at the Pentagon and the President himself to take such drastic action.
The public humiliation of Karpinski is all the more striking because it reveals she was promoted to flag rank without a proper investigation of her background. A case of “political correctness?” Perhaps. Not reporting an arrest for allegedly shoplifting a small item at the base exchange at a Florida air force installation is enough grounds for her security clearance to be pulled. Thus, she never would have reached flag rank in the first place. Consequently, Karpinski wouldn’t have been in a position to be “in charge” of the Iraqi prison system at the time of the Abu Ghraib abuses.
MilitaryCorruption.com reported earlier this year that Irish human rights attorney Michael Hourigan is representing Saddam “Sam” Saleh Aboud, who claims the female general was present during one of his torture sessions.
A STORY YOU SAW HERE FIRST
In a devastating deposition, made on video and under oath, “Sam” said Karpinski was there during beatings he endured at the American-run lockup.
During one of the assaults, he said, his hood came off and he saw a female officer standing there.
The Iraqi, who was naked, said the woman was “watching and laughing” as he was being roughed up.
“He knew she was a supervisor because she had a star on her hat and she was in an American uniform,” Hourigan said. “Sam told me the other soldiers would defer to her.” The attorney said his client identified Karpinski after he was shown a picture of the general in an American news magazine.
“SHOPLIFTING” ARREST REVEALED
Probably the chastened former general will continue to protest she’s a “scapegoat” for others in the prison scandal. Now she acknowledges the “shoplifting” (Pentagon’s term for it) arrest, but says she wasn’t guilty of anything because it only “appeared” on a surveillance photo that she placed a BX item in her purse. Karpinski says she already owned the cosmetic in question.
Let’s say, for argument’s sake, she is right. Why then did she not report as serious a matter as an arrest for “shoplifting?” As a longtime military police officer she had to know the rules and regulations on that.
We can only conclude she realized that would finish off her chances to make general. Now the obvious question comes. If she reached flag rank by deception, should she give back the difference in pay from one-star general to bird colonel – the last rank she supposedly served in “satisfactorily?”
FIGHTING FOR WOMEN’S RIGHTS IN THE MILITARY
There is no question that women have been unfairly discriminated against in promotions and other opportunities in the armed forces over the years.
MilitaryCorruption.com is on record as supporting equal opportunity for the many fine female enlisted members and officers who serve our country around the world.
A large majority of them deserve our respect and support. That is why it is so troubling when something like the Karpinski case comes up.
Here, in our editorial opinion, is a case of a woman who was promoted based on gender and her own apparent failure to report an incident which would have most certainly impacted her ascension to the rank of general officer.
Those who still seek to hold women back and continue the “good old boy” system, will get comfort from the Karpinski fiasco.
It is other females in uniform that Karpinski has let down. It makes it all the harder for them to achieve the highest ranks in the military and break through the “glass ceiling” when critics can point to someone who clearly did not deserve to be a general, like the whining former MP boss.
There will probably always be a small segment of the population who will think Karpinski’s merely a “victim” here. But it is significant no groundswell of support for the challenged brass hat has formed, even among the most fierce feminists. They know already this case is a lost cause.
Related Stories
THE UNTOLD STORY OF ABU GHRAIB
FEMALE GENERAL ACCUSED
IN FEDERAL LAWSUIT OF BEING AT
PRISON “WATCHING AND LAUGHING”
AS INMATES TORTURED – ONLY
ENLISTED PERSONNEL HAVE BEEN
COURT-MARTIALED THUS FAR – IS
THIS ANOTHER CASE OF “DIFFERENT
SPANKS FOR DIFFERENT RANKS?”
Maybe some of her brass deserve this. Maybe not. But she may feel like she was a scapegoat.
Carolyn
That's standard procedure. I know it sucks, but that is the way it works.
Second, you are DEAD wrong about these orders "coming" from the top. Ever seen the manual? Ever seen the INTENSE training "interrogators" go through? No?
They was NOT sanctioned from "above."
I've spoken with some who knew Lyndie England BEFORE -- she was a flake BEFORE ABU GHRAIB. All she's trying to do with her comments is to make her own behavior look "more acceptable".
THERE IS NO MILITARY CODE WHATSOEVER WHICH CONDONES, ENCOURAGES, ABUSING PRISONERS. THOSE WHO BREAK THOSE RULES ARE HARSHLY, I REPEAT, HARSHLY PUNISHED BY MILITARY.
Given your "logic", all military men should be banned from military service and because a few harass and torment fellow female military members? The military is deathly on sexual harassment. So, do you think there's a secret "code" wherein individual military members are "encouraged" to sexually harass female military members?
It's what the liberals seem to suggest.. and only because it fits with their usual litany of tinfoil hat conspiracies.
Now, so you don't think I'm entirely dumping on you: Statistically, the same men who abuse men are also prone to abusing other men. Meaning? The same types of people who make life hell in the military might also be the same people who make life "hell" for prisoners. Makes sense, eh?
Yours: No matter how her conviction is spun, there is no way I can believe that a few Jr. Non-comm's and PFC's took it upon themselves to torture prisoners
Some military personnel were recently found guilty in the US somewhere of running a drug ring. Do you think they had orders "from on high" to do this?
She makes these claims in recent "public" comments, yet under oath and in cross examination, during the investigation and trial she did not make them? Why should anyone believe her?
Well, many will believe her because they want to. Whenever Ms England finishes whatever jail time she gets, she'll probably join the then latest incarnation of the Sheehan brigades.
It doesn't work that way. Every military person in WAR gets training. If a superior officers "orders" an underling to do something which is WRONG, that soldier is TO STAND THEIR GROUND. PERIOD, no exceptions.
That's military code, for those who don't know it. A superior CANNOT MAKE YOU DO wrong. A superior can order it; but it's the soldiers responsibility to stand against it. England and others failed, IF (big IF) they were ordered to do this conduct. They deserve to be punished.
And who are you working for?
Good point. I wager, at this point, Lynndie will be joining the ret Lt. General Claudia Kennedy wing of politics, and write a book about her "suffrage" under and amid "brutal males". Blah. Blah. Blah. The posted article is the lede to it.
If she feels that way, it's her own damned fault. She has been trained. She had to know this was wrong. And instead of standing against it; she "flowed" with it. She brought dishonor upon herself. Whether ordered or not. She, of her own volition, disobeyed military rules of conduct in a war.
Lyndie England has no honor. Bad enough to be convicted for what she did; worse by far is to implicate our soldiers over there -- 'everybody does it.' It is a spineless, characterless defense. (Why am I surprised?)
Oh, I wasn't defending her. Just saying that it's not surprising that she would throw mud at her superiors in the wake of her conviction.
ABSOLUTELY correct. You might appreciate the education about the Ret Lt Gen Claudia Kennedy school of leftwing politics in the military: Ret. Lt Gen Claudia Kennedy
Lynndie England comprises the perfect student for this type of "career path" via lefty/feminist social education. Witness, also, Cindy Sheehan -- a branch of the left feminist school of "how to make lots of money playing the victim game" -- never being responsible, but only a very "smart" victim, at all times. Victims always of evil males.
No wonder it took 4,000 years for the "smarter sex" to gain so-called "equality". Not very smart, are they.
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