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Challenged by Creationists, Museums Answer Back
The New York Times ^ | 9/20/2005 | CORNELIA DEAN

Posted on 09/20/2005 7:02:45 AM PDT by Right Wing Professor

ITHACA, N.Y. - Lenore Durkee, a retired biology professor, was volunteering as a docent at the Museum of the Earth here when she was confronted by a group of seven or eight people, creationists eager to challenge the museum exhibitions on evolution.

They peppered Dr. Durkee with questions about everything from techniques for dating fossils to the second law of thermodynamics, their queries coming so thick and fast that she found it hard to reply.

After about 45 minutes, "I told them I needed to take a break," she recalled. "My mouth was dry."

That encounter and others like it provided the impetus for a training session here in August. Dr. Durkee and scores of other volunteers and staff members from the museum and elsewhere crowded into a meeting room to hear advice from the museum director, Warren D. Allmon, on ways to deal with visitors who reject settled precepts of science on religious grounds.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; US: Colorado; US: Nebraska; US: New York; US: North Carolina
KEYWORDS: creationuts; crevolist; crevorepublic; enoughalready; evobots; evonuts; museum
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To: VadeRetro
I passed a rack of those supermarket newspapers today and noticed that Einstein's brain has come alive and gone on a rampage. A real news story.

Perhaps it will meet up with Haydn's head.

581 posted on 09/20/2005 4:09:09 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch ist der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
And of course, "libertarians with anarchist leanings" have never been known to engage in rude behavior, have they?
582 posted on 09/20/2005 4:10:22 PM PDT by inquest (FTAA delenda est)
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To: Question_Assumptions

"Are you claiming that so long as it's possible to imagine a natural explanation for something, that no amount of evidence could ever make you believe that it wasn't natural but was, instead, designed?"

No, I'm saying that ID makes an extraordinary claim and provides zero backup for it beyond the ID proponents' personal opinion. Whatever ID is, it's not science.

"And what would this obervational data look like?"

I don't know--but far more importantly, neither does anyone in the ID community. If the ID community would engage in less arm-waving and more observation, then they'd get that evidence.

"Nice non-sequitur there. I suppose we should just purge Mendel, Keppler, Newton, and perhaps even Darwin himself because, gasp!, they believed in a divine being and we all know that religion is worthless and entirely incompatible with science, right?"

In the paragraph quoted above, you made a huge non-sequitir...and you accuse me of making one.

Physician, heal thyself...

Bottom line, if there's anything to ID, then it will result in useful applied science. Evolution, for all its flaws, leads to real-world useful applied science (such as the development of new medicines, more reliable methods for locating petroleum deposits, et cetera). All ID need do is generate those real-world applied science results. Of course, in order to do that, the ID crowd would have to quit lobbying for "equal time" and actually do some real science.

"Advocates of Intelligent Design are not necessarily Biblical literalists"

Another non-sequitir--I made no such claim.

For someone who bitches and moans about imagined non-sequitirs of others, you sure as hell love using your own.


583 posted on 09/20/2005 4:10:31 PM PDT by BeHoldAPaleHorse
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To: Doctor Stochastic
Again, gravity is what hurls the Moon away from the Earth.

That would be momentum.

584 posted on 09/20/2005 4:11:16 PM PDT by inquest (FTAA delenda est)
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To: general_re

Strangely enough, I had just moved out of that building a few weeks before.


585 posted on 09/20/2005 4:11:48 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch ist der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
Dad?

Small world, I guess ;)

586 posted on 09/20/2005 4:12:58 PM PDT by general_re ("Frantic orthodoxy is never rooted in faith, but in doubt." - Reinhold Niebuhr)
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To: inquest

Not in any classes I either took or taught. The only disrupters were either anti-war activists or religious activists or both.


587 posted on 09/20/2005 4:13:14 PM PDT by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch ist der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: RunningWolf

588 posted on 09/20/2005 4:19:20 PM PDT by js1138 (Great is the power of steady misrepresentation.)
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To: Doctor Stochastic
Perhaps it will meet up with Haydn's head.

This (the Einstein's brain story) is where a nimble creationist if there were one could accuse me of ... Morton's Demon. I saw a huge banner page trumpeting the return to life and rampaging activity of Einstein's brain, and decided to act as if it didn't exist.

Just preserving my rationalist, materialist, non-magical worldview.

589 posted on 09/20/2005 4:19:48 PM PDT by VadeRetro (Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
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To: general_re
My father once related how he accidentally thwarted a plot to end the Vietnam War by blowing up the library at Stony Brook.

Was he ever caught?

590 posted on 09/20/2005 4:21:19 PM PDT by js1138 (Great is the power of steady misrepresentation.)
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To: general_re
" Your questions thus far are answered by basic freshman chemistry."

nonsense. You're not even in the same arena. You do not comprehend the nature of the question. Without understanding the origin of life you cannot possibly truly understand the continuance and advancement of life for those same forces must still be with us and having an effect which is not even considered by your freshman biology teacher.

It is rather like having a formula for life that includes a fudge factor and a constant, and all we understand is the constant. We have not yet begun to understand in mathematical/scientific terms driving forumlas of life.

"..do you imagine that that statement you quote was intended as a denial of evolution?"

Certainly not. I agree with much of the principles of evolution. The Bible does not disagree either. It makes no comment on the evolution of natural man.

591 posted on 09/20/2005 4:22:28 PM PDT by Mark Felton (Those who despise instruction despise their own soul...)
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To: js1138

"The Civil War: a theory in crisis?"


592 posted on 09/20/2005 4:24:34 PM PDT by longshadow
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To: Doctor Stochastic
gravity is what hurls the Moon away from the Earth

And here all this time I thought that gravity was defined as the force that attracts objects together.

Now angular momentum and conservation of same is a horse of a different color.

593 posted on 09/20/2005 4:29:16 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: kpp_kpp
why did the hominids die?

Old age? Sabre-tooth cats? Infections and other forms of bad luck?

(If I'da knowed there was gonna be a test I'da studied some.)

594 posted on 09/20/2005 4:29:52 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Is this a good tagline?)
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To: Doctor Stochastic; general_re
Small world. My college poetry teacher was Trim Bissell. Note the reference to being betrayed by friends. If students had fragged teachers during the Vietnam war, he would have been among the first to go,
595 posted on 09/20/2005 4:29:55 PM PDT by js1138 (Great is the power of steady misrepresentation.)
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To: js1138

Pretty good, no sense in half measures.


596 posted on 09/20/2005 4:29:55 PM PDT by RunningWolf (U.S. Army Veteran.....75-78)
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To: general_re
****"nonsense. You're not even in the same arena. You do not comprehend the nature of the question. Without understanding the origin of life WATER you cannot possibly truly understand the continuance and advancement of life MOISTURE for those same forces must still be with us and having an effect which is not even considered by your freshman biology HYDROLOGY teacher."*****

Hydrology: a Theory in crisis!

< /anti-evo mode>

597 posted on 09/20/2005 4:32:43 PM PDT by longshadow
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To: longshadow
Hydrology: a Theory in crisis!

Yeah. Its all wet. Some folks think its the solution to all their problems though.

598 posted on 09/20/2005 4:35:22 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Is this a good tagline?)
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To: js1138
Event the advocates of ID -- Behe, Dembski and Denton -- accept the fact that evolution happened.

FYI, some of them don't. Phillip Johnson, for instance, does not. Not sure about Denton and Dembski. They seem to vacilate between accepting it and rejecting it.

Behe for sure accepts its.

599 posted on 09/20/2005 4:39:00 PM PDT by curiosity
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To: longshadow
The Civil War: a theory in crisis?"

More and more historians are turning away from the false religion of civilwarism.

600 posted on 09/20/2005 4:41:06 PM PDT by js1138 (Great is the power of steady misrepresentation.)
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