Posted on 08/27/2005 10:23:56 AM PDT by GOPGuide
PHOENIX - Struggling to pacify his party's warring wings, President Bush is moving toward allowing illegal immigrants who came to the U.S. before February 2004 to qualify for guest-worker visas. People smuggled in after then would be deported.
State leaders in Arizona and New Mexico have stepped up pressure on the Bush administration and the Republican-led Congress to better police U.S. borders and deal with an estimated 10 million people who are living illegally in this country.
"They're trying to split the baby," Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., said of the White House plan, "and I don't think they can do that."
Bush and his advisers are caught between their supporters in the business sector, who believe the economy needs those workers, and conservatives whose priority is to clamp down on illegal immigration. The White House hopes to have a detailed proposal to Congress in late September or early October.
McCain, who ran against Bush for the 2000 GOP nomination and may seek the White House in 2008, is sponsoring a bill with Sen. Edward M. Kennedy, D-Mass., that would create 400,000 three-year visas for guest workers. The legislation has the flexibility to add more in the future and would let undocumented workers stay in the U.S. while they apply.
A competing plan by Sen. Jon Kyl, R-Ariz., would create two-year visas and require that guest workers and illegal immigrants leave the U.S. before they can apply for the chance to work legally in the country.
Conservative House Republicans tend to favor Kyl's tougher approach. McCain mocks it.
"Turn yourself in so we can send you back to Mexico," said McCain, throwing his head back in laughter during an interview at his Arizona office last week. "It's not going to happen."
The White House seems to agree with McCain.
According to administration and congressional officials who took part in a series of White House meetings this summer, Bush does not favor requiring illegal immigrants to be sent home to apply for the visas.
In a nod to his conservative base, however, the president has rejected a part of the McCain-Kennedy bill that the White House believes would put illegal immigrants on an automatic track to citizenship, the officials said.
The officials said it was unclear how many illegal immigrants came after February 2004 or how many later had children in the U.S., conferring U.S. citizenship on those babies. The White House wants to avoid a surge of illegal immigrants who would try to beat a prospective deadline, they said.
The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because the White House has not authorized them to discuss the policy, which is subject to change.
All sides agree that illegal immigration has become a national security, humanitarian and economic crisis:
_Intelligence agencies fear terrorists could slip into the U.S. through Mexico.
_Hundreds of illegal immigrants die each year while trying to enter the U.S. Those who make it often fall prey to criminals and opportunists.
_From construction companies in Arizona to farmers in the Midwest and California, many industries need those cheap and available workers.
"Just stop at one of these construction sites and look and see who those workers are. They're all Hispanic," McCain said. "And I bet you they're illegal."
Depending on how Hispanics react, this fall's immigration debate could help determine whether Democrats or Republicans dominate the fastest-growing voting bloc in years to come.
The issue threatens to divide Democrats. Affluent, well-educated liberals are embracing immigration as part of cultural diversity. But poor Democrats, including blacks, are wary of Hispanics' growing economic and political clout.
Democratic Gov. Janet Napolitano of Arizona, who supports the McCain-Kennedy bill, joined Gov. Bill Richardson, D-N.M., this month in declaring immigration emergencies in their states. "We just kept waiting and waiting and waiting but never did see a sense of urgency from Washington," she said.
Voters are frustrated, too, especially in the Southwest, where illegal immigration is an unsettling fact of life.
"It's sad to see Democrats doing what Republicans ought to be doing," Danielle Taylor, 24, a Republican voter in Scottsdale, said during a break from her bank job. "Napolitano may have just earned my vote."
McCain faced tough questions at a town hall meeting Thursday night in Mesa, where conservatives accused him of going soft on illegal immigrants. "No amnesty!" some shouted.
McCain says his bill does not provide amnesty. Conservatives say no better word describes allowing illegal immigrants to remain in the U.S.
Bush may face similar criticism. McCain, Napolitano and other supporters of guest workers argue that it is unrealistic to deport 11 million people.
McCain's bill would require the undocumented workers to register with the government, pay all back taxes and a $2,000 fine, then go through a series of background checks and work at least six years before applying for a green card.
The senator said he is willing to stiffen those requirements. The White House plan probably will have its own.
The White House may take the unusual step of writing the legislation or submitting specific language to Congress.
McCain I see had a hard time the other day selling his amnesty scheme to Republicans in Arizona. It's not a popular idea and they all know it. I think if they try to pass anything resembling amnesty many of them are in for a rough road in 2006, including even Flake.
It's time to send a DIRECT message to the Republican Party...
YOU'RE NOT SHOWING UP FOR US, SO WE'RE NOT SHOWING UP FOR YOU!
I will not go to the polls until the Republicans act to INFORCE OUR LAWS. It begins this November 2005 with the elections here in California. Even if we passed Arnold's Props, the liberal courts would block the voter's will. It really doesn't make any difference anyway, so why not send a clear message to the Republican Party. If turnout was in the single digits, I think they might just get it this time.
I've been doing that. I get at least one fund-raising letter a week, and I send it back with a note saying "Secure the border..."
somebody oughta tell him that a majority of LEGAL IMMIGRANTS also greatly resent ILLEGALS.
We are the greatest nation on the face of the earth. We kicked Saddam's butt from here to kingdom come. We have put down the Taliban. We haven't been attacked by terrorist in 47 months and we are now asked to embrace that our country will not survive economicially, socially and globally without the assistances of illegal alien workers. It cannot be. Someone is telling us a lie.
"Rove is gunning to push Bush's approval ratings into the low 30's."
Yeah, but he's got to come through for his post-2008 golden handshake job. With the failure of the Social Security scheme he isn't going to get rewarded by the brokerages.
Maybe he's aiming for a job with a cheap labor industry.
"Rove is gunning to push Bush's approval ratings into the low 30's."
Yeah, but he's got to come through for his post-2008 golden handshake job. With the failure of the Social Security scheme he isn't going to get rewarded by the brokerages.
Maybe he's aiming for a job with a cheap labor industry.
It is sad really. It's like you can see the train coming, and no matter how much you yell at your friends, they will just not get off the tracks.
This party is DETERMINED to be a minority party. They are practically DEMANDING to be trounced in the next two elections.
Someone pass the popcorn. Baby! Get me a beer, I don' wanna be sober for this.
"somebody oughta tell him that a majority of LEGAL IMMIGRANTS also greatly resent ILLEGALS."
He knows. Doesn't matter. The old "we need to support illiegal immigration to get the Hispanic vote" was not firmly believed, but a distraction for the dittoheads and Bushbots.
Disproving the argument hasn't and won't do a thing because it wasn't the reason Bush supports illegals. He supports them because they depress lower to middle class wasge bargaining power. Supply and demand. For the jobs that can't be physically outsourced overseas illegals will be insourced to depress wages.
"Huh? What wing of the party is pro-illegal immigration?"
That would be the Pro-business profits over all else including the security of our nation.
Sorry but that dog won't hunt... the illegal flow in some ways reminds me of an electrical current...to stop it you have to first cutoff the job source in the US
The reality is that illegals as labor are so attractive is the lower cost but the lower cost mean that it's not self supporting but in effect tax payer's subsidized labor...cut off the illegals as labor and that job will be filled at marker rate/cost...
The guest worker program is a miss direct... because either the labor would need to be payed at a higher rate or be subsidized
Bottom line like any other commodity labor has a cost ...to think that what the employer is paying up front for that cheap labor is the total cost is an illusion... there are no "free" lunches..there are no "below cost" lunches.. and there are no perpetual "at cost" lunches (just like there are no perpetual motion machines) there is the total cost to support the effort + profit to keep it going...
Below cost illegal labor is an tax payer funded performance art illusion to entertain a few....
(To go back to my electrical current analogy there a hidden ground loop tax payer funded cash flow thats keeps this perpetual motion machine below cost labor illusion going)
Darn right! Card-carrying NRA member here!
When others have mentioned this in the past, I've stayed away from the discussion. But with the illegal imm. situation and now all the stuff coming out over Able Danger and how far it reaches into both pol. parties...I'm starting to change my leaning. Was never a fan of career politicians but believed we would be able to plod along. Now, things seem to be spinning out of control and I'm getting angrier by the day. I just wish there was some way to wake up these idiots in Washington, both Dem. and Rep. before this becomes our only option.
This government cannot be trusted to follow through on whatever it promises involving the invasion of illegal aliens across our southern border.
Neither Bush, Homeland Security, nor the Hispandering GOP Big Tent of RINOs, liberals and moderates can ever be trusted on this issue.
And if what you can see were to come to pass, it would be GW and the Republican leadership's fault.
"He knows. Doesn't matter. The old "we need to support illiegal immigration to get the Hispanic vote" was not firmly believed, but a distraction for the dittoheads and Bushbots."
I disagree, I believe it is the Hispanic vote that is making Bush drive the country over the cliff.
If the illegals are legalized, then the "Guest workers" become just as expensive to hire as a normal legal citizen.
Rove you see, thinks he's a genius, but the truth is he's the Donovan McNabb of political consultants ie he's over rated.
I doubt this will fly in the House because this plan is basically the same plan he proposed in January 2004 that went down in flames.
The only way to wake up these idiots in Washington is to vote their sorry power-grabbing butts out.
And who are we going to put in? Folks will say things like, "Joe Blow is the man" or "Joe Shmoe will sraighten it out." The fact is that they are all members of the ruling elite and protect each other. Even Rush said this recently. He says he doesn't want to get out ahead of this (Abel Danger) but the deal is that he knows that this is never going to amount to what is truely needed. He said this just the other day. Aside from the 2nd ammendment, I just don't see a solution.
It's not about whether a party wins - it's about whether the voters are able to influence government. Having a candidate win is just a means to that end, not an end in itself. Another means to the same end would be to make incumbent politicians face consequences for failing to do their jobs properly. Voting Constitution Party can serve that end, even if they don't win the election.
_Intelligence agencies fear terrorists could slip into the U.S. through Mexico.
_Hundreds of illegal immigrants die each year while trying to enter the U.S. Those who make it often fall prey to criminals and opportunists.
Two convincingly good reasons for constructing a linear border structure - immediately.
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