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Montana's governor eyes coal to solve U.S. fuel costs
Reuters on Yahoo ^ | 8/26/05 | Adam Tanner - Reuters

Posted on 08/26/2005 2:59:00 PM PDT by NormsRevenge

HELENA, Montana (Reuters) - Montana's governor wants to solve America's rising energy costs using a technology discovered in Germany 80 years ago that converts coal into gasoline, diesel and aviation fuel.

The Fischer-Tropsch technology, discovered by German researchers in 1923 and later used by the Nazis to convert coal into wartime fuels, was not economical as long as oil cost less than $30 a barrel.

But with U.S. crude oil now hitting more than double that price, Gov. Brian Schweitzer's plan is getting more attention across the country and some analysts are taking him very seriously.

Montana is "sitting on more energy than they have in the Middle East," Schweitzer told Reuters in an interview this week.

"I am leading this country in this desire and demand to convert coal into gasoline, diesel and aviation fuel. We can do it in Montana for $1 per gallon," he said.

"We can do it cheaper than importing oil from the sheiks, dictators, rats and crooks that we're bringing it from right now."

The governor estimated the cost of producing a barrel of oil through the Fischer-Tropsch method at $32, and said that with its 120 billion tons of coal -- a little less than a third of the U.S total -- Montana could supply the entire United States with its aviation, gas and diesel fuel for 40 years without creating environmental damage.

An entry level Fischer-Tropsch plant producing 22,000 barrels a day would cost about $1.5 billion, he said.

The Democratic governor of this Republican state said he had met with Shell president John Hofmeister, General Electric's CEO Jeff Immelt, as well as officials from the Department of Defense, and the Burlington Northern Santa Fe Railroad to discuss his proposals.

Schweitzer added that the recently passed federal energy bill includes an 80 percent loan guarantee for a Fischer- Tropsch plant.

A former cattle rancher who lived for seven years in Saudi Arabia working on irrigation projects, Schweitzer is also seeking energy deals with other states, especially California.

California "says they need 25,000 megawatts of electricity during the next ten years," he said. "We'll give you a delivered price and we'll forward contract that for the next 20 years.

"Transmission companies from England, from Canada, from all over America are coming to my office and saying 'we'll build these transmission lines as soon as you have the contracts to build the generation."'


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; Politics/Elections; US: Montana
KEYWORDS: coal; energy; eyes; fischer; fuelcosts; governor; johnhofmeister; montana; schweitzer; tropsch
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To: NormsRevenge
I like the synthetic oil from coal idea, but sending electricity from Montana to California is wasteful. Let California build nukes, or start unplugging all the hot tubs in Marin County.
41 posted on 08/26/2005 5:55:39 PM PDT by fallujah-nuker (Atque ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appelant)
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To: rellimpank; neutronsgalore
On History Channel last hight "Modern Marvels" was about about rubber, and how a synthetic rubber industry was built from scratch in a couple years.
42 posted on 08/26/2005 5:57:29 PM PDT by fallujah-nuker (Atque ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appelant)
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To: NormsRevenge
"We can do it cheaper than importing oil from the sheiks, dictators, rats and crooks that we're bringing it from right now."

I'm all for that....

43 posted on 08/26/2005 5:58:51 PM PDT by operation clinton cleanup
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To: sgtbono2002
"Of course right when this plant starts to open the Saudi's will lower their price to try to put them out of business"

Right, they will strangle the baby in the crib. We cannot have both energy independence and free trade.
44 posted on 08/26/2005 6:00:03 PM PDT by fallujah-nuker (Atque ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appelant)
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To: 76834
"Big and I mean BIG trains hauling coal from Wyoming and ALASKA, on new rails."

We could electrify the railway mainlines too, that would reduce our use of diesel fuel.
45 posted on 08/26/2005 6:07:46 PM PDT by fallujah-nuker (Atque ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appelant)
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To: 76834
Only thing we need to do is get off our asses, ...

Our Presidente will hire Mexicans to build the nukes that Americans aren't willing to......

46 posted on 08/26/2005 6:07:53 PM PDT by stboz
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To: Argus
Not necessarily, when they can keep selling their crude to China, India and elsewhere for $60-plus a barrel.

Sounds like a win-win to me. No problem then, unless China and India have coal deposits.

47 posted on 08/26/2005 6:10:18 PM PDT by Publius6961 (Liberal level playing field: If the Islamics win we are their slaves..if we win they are our equals.)
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To: sgtbono2002
Gee : and here I thought OPEC was organised to set oil prices. I guess they dont have any reason for their existence.

OK, I guess I deserved that.

You are of course correct. The point that I was making was that they set prices by controlling supply. They can't just arbitrarily set a price. Consumers have to be willing to pay based on how easy or difficult it is to get what they need.

48 posted on 08/26/2005 6:34:59 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s......you weren't really there.)
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To: fallujah-nuker

That is thinking "Out of the Box"
What is needed, nukes powering electrified rails from Alaska to the lower 48.
If Canada has a problem, just digest Canada...


49 posted on 08/26/2005 6:36:39 PM PDT by 76834 (There's nothing wrong with sobriety in moderation.)
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To: 76834

"The technology is here and has been for decades.
Folks in South Africa do it every day.
The main thing is to make it economically feasable.

USA is the like 50 Arabias as far is coal is concerned.

For further reading I would refer you to:
http://www.sasol.com"

All built by American company: Fluor Corporation


50 posted on 08/26/2005 6:56:28 PM PDT by truth_seeker
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To: truth_seeker

Have a lot of respect for Fluor, for Bechtel and all of the truly great American construction and engineering firms.

Worked for Fish Engineering and Brown and Root for most of my career.
Worked side by side with hands from Fluor and Bechtel on jobs and can truly state that they were totally professional.

Hats off to American Engineering,,,,,
Now lets put it to work in America


51 posted on 08/26/2005 7:56:02 PM PDT by 76834 (There's nothing wrong with sobriety in moderation.)
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To: 76834
"If Canada has a problem, just digest Canada..."

I gather that the western provinces, Alberta in particular have about had enough of being the cash cow for socialism in Ontario and Quebec. They have been milked out of a fortune. they are somewhat like Texas, would make a nice addition. Manifest destiny!
52 posted on 08/26/2005 9:18:44 PM PDT by fallujah-nuker (Atque ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appelant)
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To: NormsRevenge

"An entry level Fischer-Tropsch plant producing 22,000 barrels a day would cost about $1.5 billion, he said."

To get 5 million barrels per day would be (5,000,000/22,000) x $1.5 billion = $341 billion.

Ramp that up, and we would not be totally free of imported crude, but far on such a path.

I dare say it is highly doable. And the money is simply investment, returned through product sales.

And this is just transport fuels from coal. We also have vast reserves of oil shale (Utah, Colorado and Wyoming).

I've read that Alberta province has GREATER hydrocarbon reserves, than Saudi Arabia (oil shale and tar sands).

And Canada is already producing same, albeit relatively small scale.

Resulting from the 1979 Khomeini oil scare, the US government kicked off building "demonstration" plants for oil from shale.

One such plant by Union Oil was at Parachute Creek, Colorado. The Navy guaranteed to buy the oil produced for about $40 per barrel.

I think this project was eventually mothballed, as we enjoyed years of relatively cheap imported crude.


53 posted on 08/26/2005 10:43:54 PM PDT by truth_seeker
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To: NormsRevenge

Head Waters (HW) was just mentioned on Mad Money (Cramer) today. It is an alternative fuel company and converts coal and heavy oil into liquid fuel.


54 posted on 08/26/2005 10:59:32 PM PDT by Kay
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To: backhoe; All

Ya know, if we could harness the energy of the spin machine that continues to wrk full-time to perpetuate Clinton's legacy, we'd be energy independent in no time.

Thanks for the links.


55 posted on 08/26/2005 11:05:33 PM PDT by NormsRevenge (Semper Fi ... "To remain silent when they should protest makes cowards of men." -- THOMAS JEFFERSON)
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To: NormsRevenge

56 posted on 08/26/2005 11:16:21 PM PDT by backhoe (Just an old Keyboard Cowboy, ridin' the trackball into the Sunset...)
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To: fallujah-nuker

"We could electrify the railway mainlines too, that would reduce our use of diesel fuel."

And we could increase the demand for high tech production in the US by making it high-speed maglev with requirements that it be 100% US-made. We would need to expand our nuclear-power network to provide the necessary electricity of course.


57 posted on 08/27/2005 8:44:55 PM PDT by neutronsgalore (Free Trade = Economic Treason)
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To: NormsRevenge
I'm a legislator in Montana. Governor "Hollywood" as we like to call him-- because he's more interested in getting on TV than he is in actually solving much- but we're still giving him the benefit of the doubt, is a little loony for the most part.
If he's serious, he'll have the backing of the Republican legislators and a vast majority of the people in Montana, but if he's trying to pull another "I am for natural resource use" and then appoint a bunch of whacko greenies from the extreme anti-people "Montana Environmental Information Center" to run anything short of a single compost toilet, you can take the fellow as seriously as you take Cindy Sheehan calling the President the most trustworthy person on the face of the earth.

We'll see. I know Brian personally, and I have been pleasantly surprised at how rational and reasonable he has become once becoming Guv, but I still can't forget his campaign of absolute lying and bull... as I say, we'll see if he's actually serious. If he is, I'll back "Governor Hollywood" 100%.
58 posted on 08/30/2005 10:51:37 PM PDT by GotDangGenius
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To: GotDangGenius

I think he may be serious. Domestic FT fuels from coal, coupled with chemicals and power manufacture, (a combination known as polygeneration) are for real. There are a couple of companies pioneering the first wave of projects. Look here: http://www.cleancoalfuels.com/ for instance.

There is no need to use South African technology, when we have better FT technology available right here at home. A company called Rentech, out of Denver Colorado. I should hope that preference for federal and state development dollars will be given to companies that are using home-grown technology.

There are at least 7 domestic CTL projects in various stages of development.

This IS an emerging industry in this country, and it will move faster as the financial community becomes aware of it, the taps to development monies are opened, and more people like that American clean coal fuels group stop talking, and start building.

There are two types of people in this world: Those who do the work, and those who try to take the credit for it. Try to be in the first group, there is less competition there. - Ghandi


59 posted on 09/14/2005 9:13:00 PM PDT by Coal-to-Fuels
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