Let's Have No More Monkey Trials - To teach faith as science is to undermine both

Time Magazine ^ | Monday, Aug. 01, 2005 | CHARLES KRAUTHAMMER

[durasell]

It's from Jude the Obscure, by Thomas Hardy. Darwin and social Darwinism as proposed by Spencer was an intellectual shock to many in the 19th century. It challenged their vision of the world -- or that part of the world they wanted to partition off.

He saw God's foot upon the treadle of the loom, and spoke it; and therefore his shipmates called him mad. -- from Moby Dick.

[eleni121]

"I myself am convinced that the theory of evolution, especially the extent to which it's been applied, will be one of the great jokes in the history books of the future. Posterity will marvel that so very flimsy and dubious an hypothesis could be accepted with the incredible credulity that it has."

Malcolm Muggeridge (world famous journalist and philosopher), Pascal Lectures, University of Waterloo, Ontario, Canada.

[SerpentDove]

Fair enough.

Take care.

:-)

[b_sharp]

I'm truly sorry you do not have the capacity to understand what I am saying.

[eleni121]

Nobel prize winner George Wald has said, 'Time is the hero of the plot. Given enough time anything can happen- the impossible becomes probable, the improbable becomes certain.'

Try and think.

[WildTurkey]

I wonder what he would say if he looked at all the evidence uncovered in the last 50 years ...

[Doctor Stochastic]

Martin Luther and the reformers made the delineation for us several hundred years ago.

You mean the Martin Luther referenced in Post 922?

[Doctor Stochastic]

Given the reaction of those who have previously stood in the presence of the Almighty...I believe that we will be face down on the ground and not requiring that any of our questions be responded to.

[b_sharp]

"How many ways do I need to say it? Teach darwinism as a theory not fact. And allow other beliefs into the classroom. We do not need the dictatorship of the Darwinians in our society."

The theory of evolution is taught as theory. What you really want is for it to be taught as supposition, which it is not. Why do you not also want geology, geophysics, astronomy, physics, cosmology and other sciences that say the universe is >15 billion years old and undirected taught as supposition?

The observation the ToE explains is considered fact. It is called evolution. That observation is the variance in allele frequencies within a population over time due to differential replication/reproduction. Why should other beliefs be taught in a science class? Theories are taught in science class.

[b_sharp]

I thought dictators were potatoes shaped like...a male appendage

[WildTurkey]

You mean the Martin Luther referenced in Post 922?

Sounds like he was the missing link between Christianity and Hitler.

[b_sharp]

"Dr. T.N. Tahmisian (Atomic Energy Commission, USA) in 'The Fresno Bee', August 10, 1959. As quoted by N.J. Mitchell, Evolution and the Emperor's New Clothes, Roydon publications, UK, 1983, title page.

That is probably a quote mine, but it is definitely an 'appeal to authority'.

[b_sharp]

The green one. Down the hall, second left.

[Dimensio]

Neither the IDers nor the atheists

False dichotomy. Not everyone opposing ID is an atheist.

The opposition to ID is based on the fact that ID is not science.

[pby]

No.

My evidence would be found here:

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no one can boast." Ephesians 2:8,9

"For God so loved the world that he gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish, but have eternal life." John 3:16

"Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise"." Luke 23:43

"I am the way, and the truth and the life. No one comes to the father except through me." John 14:6

And several other passages throughout the New Testament.

[Dimensio]

What, exactly, are Malcolm Muggeridge's credentials in the field of biology?

[pby]

Not even close.

[xzins]

Generally, I like to agree with Krauthammer, but I don't on this one.

Intelligent design does not undermine science.

Science means knowledge, and at it's root is about acquiring factual, actual knowledge.

Intelligent design is a mathematical model that demonstrates how improbable it is for inanimate objects to combine into animate ones. Its math says that it very nearly approaches zero, and that, in fact, you have a far better chance of winning the next 280,000,000 dollar Lotto. (And you know how good that chance is for YOU. :>)

One verification of this rarity would seem to be the lack of oodles of alien life forms from the billions upon billions of planets that must exist among the unimaginable number of stars. About the only place you see them are in George Lucas movies with Luke Skywalker & crew.

So...it's awesomely rare....zero for all practical purposes.

Fact. Adds to the body of KNOWLEDGE. Science.

[pby]

Yes...I mean that Martin Luther.

[Dimensio]

So...it's awesomely rare....zero for all practical purposes.

What a lovely calculation based upon unreality. The extent of our knowledge regarding extraterrestrial life goes as far as the solar system. Beyond that, we can't say anything. For you to use a completely unknown variable, assume a value and then use that assumption as solid evidence for ID only underscores the sheer dishonesty of the ID movement.