Posted on 06/15/2005 4:48:00 PM PDT by Capt. Canuck
Excerpts from conversations between Pinnacle Airlines Capt. Jesse Rhodes and First Officer Peter Cesarz just before they died in the crash of a Bombardier regional jet on Oct. 14, 2004. Investigators say the crash occurred after the pilots took the plane to 41,000 feet, an altitude where engine problems can develop.
9:48:44 p.m.
Cesarz: "Man we can do it. Forty-one it."
9:48:46
Rhodes: "(Unintelligible) baby."
9:48:57
Cesarz: "Hundred and eighty knots, still cruising at Mach point six four."
9:51:51
Cesarz: "There's four-one-oh, my man."
9:51:53
Cesarz: "Made it, man."
9:54:19
Rhodes: "Yeah, that's funny, we got up here, it won't stay up here."
9:54:22
Cesarz: "Dude, it's (expletive) losing it." (Sound of laughing)
10:14:36
Cesarz: "We're not gonna make it, man, we're not gonna make it."
10:14:38
Rhodes: "Is there a road? Tell her we're not gonna make this runway."
10:14:46
Rhodes: "Let's keep the gear up. (Expletive) I don't want to go into houses here."
10:14:51
Cesarz: (Expletive) "road right there."
10:14:52
Rhodes: "Where?"
10:14:52
Cesarz: "Turn, turn..."
10:14:53
Rhodes: "Turn where?"
10:14:53
Cesarz: "Turn to your left, turn to your left."
10:14:56
Rhodes: Either: "I see it" or "I can't."
10:14:58
Warning signal in cockpit: "Too low, terrain, terrain."
10:14:59
Rhodes: "Can't make it."
10:15:03
Rhodes: "Aw (expletive). We're gonna hit houses, dude."
Source: National Transportation Safety Board
Everything above 18000 ft is controlled airspace all of the time. They'd be cleared for a certain altitude, but could then request another once enroute from ATC. They wouldn't be breaking any rules unless they deviated without requesting permission from ATC (at which point they'd hear from them).
"Rhodes: "Aw (expletive). We're gonna hit houses, dude."
and they did, too .. The plane crashed into a residential neighborhood of Jefferson City, Mo. Through the Grace of God, in this instance, no one on the ground was injured but it doesn't take much to imagine how easily the result could have been devastatingly different.
I understand how tedious flying can be at times, but this sort of 'fooling around' over populated areas is beyond reckless ~ it is downright irresponsible.
They'd have been cleared to FL410 (41,000 feet) by ATC before they left their previously assigned altitude. Asking for, and receiving, a different altitude, is very routine; pilots do it on many if not most flights to find turbulence-free altitudes, favorable tailwinds, etc.
I totally agree with you, The pilots took it up to FL410 which is max altitude with passengers. No reason to fault the pilots who really did nothing wrong except fail to restart for whatever reason.
Thankfully there were no passengers.
Yes.
These two idiots decided to have a little fun since they were ferrying the jet to another location and had no passengers. Since they crashed in a residential area, it's just lucky these two JERKS didn't kill some innocent people.
Get off your high horse.
No one locked them into a room. They were flying because that was their chosen profession. If they didn't like the conditions they could've walked away at any time.
If you have any sort of evidence for that, I'd like to see it - that's not sarcastic; I just haven't heard that anywhere and it seems like something that'd be heavily reported. Likewise for any other violations. Also, I'm not even sure that swapping seats violates regs. I've got my FAR/AIM right here, perhaps you could quote me chapter and verse?
According to FAA transcripts of air-to-ground conversations, an air traffic controller in Kansas City told the two pilots it was rare to see the plane flying that high.
"Yeah, we're actually ... we don't have any passengers on board, so we decided to have a little fun and come up here," one of the pilots said. The transcripts don't identify whether Jesse Rhodes or Cesarz made the statement.
It's rare because the aircraft usually doesn't fly that high; in fact, it may require a light load (like they had, with no passengers) to get that high while maintaining safety. They still had to get permission to get up there, probably from a different controller; when they got handed off to the controller in Kansas City he commented on the fact that he rarely saw commercial jets at FL410. Trust me, if he didn't have permission to be at that altitude, the controller's comments would have been far sterner.
Here is an excerpt:
"... There were no passengers on the jet and no one on the ground was injured by the Oct. 14 crash in a residential neighborhood of Jefferson City, Mo.
According to FAA transcripts of air-to-ground conversations, an air traffic controller in Kansas City told the pilots it was rare to see the plane flying that high.
"Yeah, we're actually ... we don't have any passengers on board, so we decided to have a little fun and come up here," one of the pilots said. The transcripts don't identify whether Capt. Jesse Rhodes or First Officer Richard Peter Cesarz made the statement.
~snip~
David Stempler, president of the Air Travelers Association, said the issue may be reckless pilots rather than inadequate training or improper recovery procedures.
"This is more a story of pilots having time on their hands and playing with things in the cockpit that they shouldn't," he said.
Flying, he said, is as boring as truck driving most of the time.
"This was boredom and experimentation, these guys experimenting with things they had no business doing," Stempler said.
I don't know. It sure looked like they were on their own until questioned by KC controllers.
You need to read the NTSB report. It includes the full CVR transcript. It will turn your stomach. If you read it and don't think these guys did anything wrong, you really need to question your aviation skills. I'm not trying to be rude here, but do you have an ATP?
Well, either take my word for it or find someone you trust who's a pilot. They were not at any altitude that they didn't previously get permission to be at. But as they flew they'd get transferred from controller to controller as they enter airspace controlled by different controllers, and one of them commented on the rarity of seeing commercial traffic of that altitude. He'd already gotten a "strip" with all the flight's information, including their cleared altitude, on it. If the plane hadn't been at the altitude it had been previously assigned, the controller would have been much more concerned, as that would have been against regulations and potentially dangerous.
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