How to Be a Beekeeper (ESPN.com takes swipe at homeschooled Spelling Bee contestants)

ESPN.com ^ | 6/2/2005 | Darren Rovell

[baseballfanjm]

ESPN.com ran this article, intending for it to be an amusing take on how to predict the winner of the National Spelling Bee. However, the last "formula" irked me.

Here's what it says:

"Stay away from home-schooled kids.

It goes without saying that these kids don't get out of the house much. There are 34 home-schooled competitors in this year's bee, including speller No. 142 Jack Ausick and speller No. 217 Benjamin Zachary Walter. The first home schooler won in 1997 and others followed, including Lala in '99 and Thampy in 2000. But kids that actually interact with other children at school have won three out of the last four bees."

While he has other "stay away from" picks that fit the joking manner of the article, that one struck me as just lame and as a swipe more than a joke.

[Modernman]

You're only assuming or guessing. You really have no way of knowing what the 'vast majority' of them are, or aren't.

All we have in this discussion are our own subjective opinions. I look around and see that the vast majority of Americans (the majority of whom went to public school) are decent, fairly religious, productive members of society. They have, for example, one of the highest per capita charitable donation rates in the world.

You, on the other hand, have a few sensational stories about what goes on in public schools that serve to reinforce your predjudices against public education.

[FierceKulak]

I don't know or really care where you went to school, but you should have paid more attention to your English teacher.

[familyop]

"Here's why it's easy to take a swipe at the homeschooled kids..."

...as contrasted with so many of the public-schooled kids who have already been behind bars?

[baseballfanjm]

Modernman, I wasn't accusing you of attacking homeschooling. :)

I appreciate your points of view on the subject, anyhow. It shows that things aren't always cut and dry.

Gabz, I totally understand. I was actually aiming my post more to keep the thread from being a fight about public schools, sine that wasn't why it was posted.

[Gabz]

I realize that...I just wish more folks, on both sides, would also realize that.

I agree with your reasons for posting this article, the supposed "humor" of the comment fell flat, and thus came across as a needless, gratuitous, smart-aleck crack.

[montag813]

The moron who wrote that didn't bother to think about how vastly outnumbered homeschooled kids are in the United States.

Do you know the percentage? Curious for use in arguments.

[familyop]

"All we have in this discussion are our own subjective opinions."

The facts from research reports being common knowledge, you're recycling a subjective myth. Follow the link for some objective reports and be educated before you try to project more misinformation against the general success of homeschooling.

Homeschooling Research
...homeschooling statistics, studies, and information!

[Modernman]

Follow the link for some objective reports and be educated before you try to project more misinformation against the general success of homeschooling.

Please look at my posts in this thread and tell me where I have said anything against the general success of homeschooling. I have not. I fully acknowledge that homeschooling can be quite successful.

[familyop]

I made the point that homeschooling is, on average, superior in practice to public schooling, and I posted a link to research reports. The evidence from those reports is not "subjective." And yes, with that evidence, I am criticizing public schooling and saying that it is generally inferior.

[baseballfanjm]

I spent the 4th grade I was in an advanced Seminar class in a public school in San Diego.

I was blessed to have a wonderful and kind teacher named Mrs. Hester who knew what she was doing and had firm control over the classroom. I have some great memories from that class.

Homeschooling worked for me, but that doesn't mean there aren't people like Mrs. Hester out there who know how to run a classroom and give kids a great school experience.

I also understand the dislike of public schooling. Really, it depends on the area, as I learned from experience.

What doesn't help are people like Mikey who just toss out insults and who don't answer to people who, from experience, rebut what he says.

[baseballfanjm]

I spent the 4th grade I was in an advanced Seminar class in a public school in San Diego

LOL, please excuse this grammatical error. It's what I get for not double checking while editing a reply before posting.

[Modernman]

I made the point that homeschooling is, on average, superior in practice to public schooling

Sure. Homeschooling is basically tutoring. It allows each student to receive personalized attention. If we paid to have each student in public schools taught by their own individual teacher, you'd get similar results.

It's apples and oranges. The public school system is like a factory, homeschooling is an artisanal workshop. Homeschooling is a good way to educate a few kids, but it will never be able to be applied to the population at large.

I'm looking at the results. The vast majority of students in this country go to public schools and yet, Americans are generally decent, religious and productive. I think the public school system, despite its faults, is generally succesful in this country.

[Thinkin' Gal]

Folks always say, "Well, they have to learn to get along with others because they'll have to work with different types of folks someday". The difference is that, at school, you're forced to be with others who are all the same age and have the same teenage hormonal angst going on. In the world of work, people can CHOOSE where they want to work, and if they don't like the folks, can just ignore them or change jobs. They are not FORCED by law to be there.

Yeah, "have to"... in the freako slave society of human resources. Note that their worldview IS predicated on forced labor. To think outside their robotosphere utopia is blasphemy to these plantation-dwellers. Homeschoolers are the equivalent of runaway slaves.

[Gabz]

I don't believe the poster Mikey has any clue what he was talking about.

I have yet to meet a homeschooled child who is not sociable and well-mannered and perfectly at ease with peers or conversing with adults. I'm sure they exist, but I haven't met any.

And just like your experience with public schools, I agree with you that it depends on the area. And in many cases it has nothing to do with the "wealth" of the particular district. We live in one of the poorest counties in Virginia - but I would put the schools, and the teachers in this district up against many I know in some of the wealthier school districts in Delaware.

The education of our children is ultimately our responsibility and I would venture to say most parents take that responsibility very seriously when it comes to making choices in regard to that education. And no one should be castigated, regardless of the choice.

[Paige]

It does not surprise me and thanks for the information. I knew there were stats to prove every point we make about the public school system. I am a firm believer in choice; so, it would be extremely nice if the NEA and public school supporters would stop making lurid statements they cannot back up about children being home schooled.

[familyop]

Modernman, in your comment #192, I won't (and couldn't effectively) argue with your first two paragraphs. Those were well considered and written. The third has much to do with our various standards and expectations. ...looking in on the thread from time to time between code development/math problems here.

One can look at the methodologies and data beyond subjective research reports to find some truths. I admit, though, that my personal outlook on homeschooling is subjective, as are the mindsets of most on every side of the issue.

The further I have gone into homeschooling the children, the more my own perspective resembles that of Thinkin' Gal in comment #193. I recently worked in a public school (K-12) for a year. Yes, the classes contain more children than two or three, each. And yes, there are disruptive students (many who are products of fatherlessness). But most of the material taught is social trash--virtually worthless toward higher education and good citizenship. That part of public education is intentionally delivered.

The kids (teens) and I are escaping the "plantation" together. From apparent progress, moral development and several years of decidedness on their part so far, it's likely that many will depend on them for security in the near future. So the "human resources" (phrase reminiscent of "soylent green") witches (not all but too many) really won't have any say about their contracts.

[condi2008]

Oh. "Never mind."

[Paulus Invictus]

Many of our neighbor kids are home schooled and are anything but social misfits. They have all kinds of friends in public schools, are very popular and they all get along very well. Characterizing all home schooled kids as social misfits is asinine. As far as UT public schools are concerned, I can't imagine why I would be so misguided as to send my kids to schools with such a proven poor record vs. kids in other states.

[SuziQ]

Pretty much everyone I know went to public school and the vast majority are productive members of society.

Everyone who says that seems to have graduated from school more than 10 yrs. ago. High Schools are a different place these days, from what I've seen.

[cantfindagoodscreenname]

Having worked with and had roommates with home schoolers, I would never home school my son.

My son (who was homeschooled his whole life) met a kid (public schooled) during his first year of college this past year who has absolutely no social skills. My son says that this kid is always giving my son a hard time for being homeschooled but he thinks it's because it's the *other* kids who's the misfit. It makes him feel good to tease my son. When I asked my son why he's going to room with this kid next year, he said, "I'm the only one of my friends who can deal with his personality." I find that hysterical and a credit to his being homeschooled! Imagine that! The publicly schooled and privately schooled kids can't deal with him, but the homeschooled kid can!

You need to meet more homeschooled kids. You're sadly mistaken about their being misfits and abused. But, you're free to have your opinion. It doesn't affect me (or my perfectly normal homeschooled kids). As a matter of fact, my kids are so "normal" that I sometimes think I've failed as a homeschooler.