Posted on 04/15/2005 7:11:19 PM PDT by CHARLITE
btt
Scholars Scrutinize the Koran's Origin: (snip)
http://www.corkscrew-balloon.com/02/03/1bkk/04b.html
"For example, the famous passage about the virgins is based on the word hur, which is an adjective in the feminine plural meaning simply "white." Islamic tradition insists the term hur stands for "houri," which means virgin, but Mr. Luxenberg insists that this is a forced misreading of the text. In both ancient Aramaic and in at least one respected dictionary of early Arabic, hur means "white raisin."
Mr. Luxenberg has traced the passages dealing with paradise to a Christian text called Hymns of Paradise by a fourth-century author. Mr. Luxenberg said the word paradise was derived from the Aramaic word for garden and all the descriptions of paradise described it as a garden of flowing waters, abundant fruits and white raisins, a prized delicacy in the ancient Near East. In this context, white raisins, mentioned often as hur, Mr. Luxenberg said, makes more sense than a reward of sexual favors..."
Did I ever tell you the joke about the three arabs and a camel?
Sure, Mohammed rejected Jesus as the Son of God, but so did the Jews. At Jamnia, in 90 AD, the rabbis ordered Jews to curse the name of Jesus of Narazreth for all generations. That is conveniently "forgotten" nowadays.
Chirstianity was not united when it came to resisting Islam. Most of the Crusades ended up plundering and killing other Christians. When the Orthodox Christians resisted the Ottomans, the Catholics sat and did nothing -- until the Turks showed up before Vienna.
Grammatically and historically incorrect. Welcome aboard.
bump for later read
No doubt. Spot-on indeed. But there is a difference between what Judaism teaches and what Christianity teaches, too. Almost as big a difference as between Islam and Christianity. The God of Judaism is not everyone's God, but theirs, and he is not full of kindness and love for all. Their God kills -- in drones. It's night and day, whether it's Islam or Judaism.
There are many differences between Judaism and Islam...but I'll just mention a few obvious ones.
Judaism is practiced by "choice" and they have the freedom to walk away or reject it without their heads being chopped off.
Jews aren't threatening to take over the world and force ALL to practice their religion and they aren't flying airplanes into buildings to kill off all the infidels.
Judaism is NOT a threat to the safety and security of this Country! Can you say THAT about Islam?
I agree with appalachian_dweller that satan is the author of the koran.
As for your observations, (1) Islam is also practiced by choice, as all religions are. In fact, "becoming" a Muslim simply requires affirming that Allah is the (only) God and that Mohamed is his prophet, three times, and believe it.
(2) Judaism is practiced by less than 25 million people on earth. It is really a very small religion numbers-wise. American Jewish community is 2 or 3 % of the total population -- maybe 5 million. In Israel's 6.8 million people, about 5.2 million (77%) are Jewish by religion. All in all, in a world of almost 2 billion Christians and over 1 billion Muslims, Judaism is prominent only because it is at the root of both of these religions.
(3) Jews used terrorist tactics against the British, killing both the military and civilians in the process. So, it's not that they are "above" that; it simply means they have no need for it.
(4) Islam is a threat because of its numbers. Let's not forget that we as a country supported Bosnian and Kosovo Muslims and have made it possible for the extreme Islamic operatives to gain a foothold in that part of Europe. Apparently, our attitude towards Islamic threat is mixed: we maintain cordial relationships with all sorts of undemocratic Islamic regimes, one of which -- Saudi Arabia -- is a cesspool of Islamic radicalism.
Man, I hope and pray you're right.
Islam is a threat because of its numbers.
Islam is a threat because it is a murderous cult that wants to dominate the world. The fact that it is growing so rapidly just makes it an imminent threat that must be taken seriously, exposed and destroyed. (IMHO)
We will in fact find that our political correctness and our tolerance will become our undoing.
I posted a similar thought on a thread yesterday!
I will repeat again...the ACLU and the leftist liberals are as much an enemy of this Country as Islam is.
The Muslims claim that the Christians distorted the New Testament and likewise that the Jews distorted the Torah.
So they feel free to discount any inconvenient citations.
And just how do you propose this should be done?
Yes, that's the same technique that everyone uses when there is a verse/command they don't like.
First off - let me say I have known and worked with and liked personally many Muslims and that while I haven't read the Quran, I have done some reading on Islam written by Muslims. Those writings were positive toward Islam, I read with an open mind thinking Islam wasn't necesarily bad, just that it had some bad followers. After reading that,I subsequently changed my mind - and although there are some aspects which are OK, I think the basic tenets of the religion are deeply flawed and potentially dangerous. Unfortunately, we've only seen some of this potential danger realised - there's a lot more scary potential left untapped. So in summation, I don't like Islam, at all.
On the other hand... I don't agree that "our tolerance" will be our undoing. Rather than taking a religious stance, I rather support the freedoms and liberties that Western society has - some of this the result of Enlightenment thinking, some of this the result of the Protestant struggle.
When we deny liberties to others, we deny them to ourselves. If we support the extension of fundamentalist Christian views onto society at large (e.g. denying others choices based on someone else's doctrine), then we are giving aid and succor to fundamentalist Islam.
I see two distinct, but entangled threats to my liberties and freedoms. 1. The growing tide of fundamentalist Islam. 2. The reactionary elements of the Christian right who seek to deny me many of the same liberties that fundamentalist Islam would, e.g. free speech, freedom to live my life largely by my own moral code (within the law), freedom to NOT worship and freedom to seek the truth as I see it based on science and empirical, rational objectivity.
I was hoping you had the answer to that one!
It's late...how about we pick this up tomorrow...unless someone else solves it tonight!
I have had this debate with a FRiend here and I do understand your position. I agree with you more than you think.
In what ways are Christians attempting to deny you free speech,freedom Not to worship etc?
As a Christian I have NO problem with any of the things you mentioned in point #2 of your post.
As for Islam you said; we've only seen some of this potential danger realized - there's a lot more scary potential left untapped.
So I'm trying to understand your position? If we have a known enemy of this Country, we are to "tolerate" it, because its citizens don't want to lose their own civil liberties? I may have completely misunderstood what you were saying, and if so I apologize.
One thing I do know...if Islam accomplishes what it has set out to do, this Country will become a dhimmi Nation, or worse, and we won't have to worry about civil liberties... we won't have any liberties. That, is what I want to prevent.
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