Posted on 04/11/2005 5:25:04 PM PDT by fight_truth_decay
I offer this example not to be inflammatory, but to emphasize the point of human rights - would you have favored returning a young black boy of 1850 to the Southern plantation from which he fled -- or to shipping a young Jewish boy back to his father in 1940's Nazi Germany?
I sorely wish this would become more of the focus of these threads. On one hand we have the ant-illegals, which, while they are correct in principle, are way off base in terms of the current reality. On the other hand, we have people willing cheering on illegal immigration, who for no other reason probably hate the US and everything it stands for and would love to hasten its demise.
The bottom line regarding illegal immigration is no different of how we financed and supported various regimes during the Cold War - the bigger picture was to defeat the USSR. Likewise, the bet here is that we can withstand changing demographics in order to focus on the WOT and not allow it to open a 2nd front in Latin America.
Yes but things went badly for those already here (Indians). Do you want a repeat of that? There is only one sure way to kill a civilization, mass immigration. Numerous examples in history. For a recent example see Kosovo or Lebanon. Allowing mass immigration from Central/South America will result in a USA that looks more like modern day Mexico then the western constitutional republic. The immigrates from Mexico are not coming here to join our civilization, they are coming here to retake what they lost 150 years ago.
I'm sure they don't mind the fact that they now have running water, piped in heating, cars to drive, stores where they don't have to hunt their food, schools for their kids and hospitals for their sick. Sure, I, and they, would be happy to see that repeated.
No, but then those of the cited aren't exactly equitable circumstances to the Gonzales case.
Sentencing one to a life in Cuba is not the equivalent to sending someone back to slavery or a concentration camp? I suspect Alexander Solzhenitsyn, and many others would disagree with you - strongly.
"if you live in Texas and apply to a Texas university, you pay in state tuition and your residency status IN THE USA, is irrelevant."
That's the problem, if you're an illegal alien you should have to pay out of state tuition, since you wouldn't be a legal resident of the State. Our RINO legislature and Rick Perry passed a law allowing in state tuition for illegals, and deserve to be voted out of office for it.
Hilarious. Absolutely hilarious. What's the matter CBG? You can't bait me into your traps like you have so many others, so now you are trying the sanctimonious route?
I am laughing too hard to type.
The legal definition of state residency is entirely separated from your immigration status, and the state cant inquire about the later.
Yes but things went badly for those already here (Indians). Do you want a repeat of that?
I'm sure they don't mind the fact that they now have running water, piped in heating, cars to drive, stores where they don't have to hunt their food, schools for their kids and hospitals for their sick. Sure, I, and they, would be happy to see that repeated.
So when all 6 billion people on the planet are living as illegal aliens in 1100 sq. ft. homes in an area the size of Texas*, we will all be one big big happy family because we have running water?
As to your assertion that "yea, sure the Native Americans were all displaced by an unstoppable influx of outsiders into their lands, but they are better off now because they have cars", I doubt they would agree now, and I am certain they would not have agreed 300 years ago.
Besides that, we are now more aware as people the tremendous upheavals that massive immigration brings. Examples abound in history.
But comparing the current illegal alien invasion into this country to the expansion and exploration of 300 years ago is a useless exercise ... it is not an appropriate analogy.
We are not talking about unexplored frontiers and vast wilderness areas with scattered tribes of people.
We are talking about a nation, defined by its laws and its borders, being systematically and illegally invaded with the complicity of a foreign government.
We are talking about the illegal industries of people smuggling and document forgery and identity theft that support that lawless invasion of illegal aliens.
We are talking about the National Security implications of those illegal industries and their being tailor made to terrorists intent on following those same well worn paths into this country.
We are talking about the fundamentally unprincipled actions of our Federal Government in forcing law-abiding citizens to support this illegal invasion, first by not enforcing laws, and then by redistributing taxpayer monies to pay for the consequences of not enforcing laws.
You, on the other hand, are talking about pie in the sky notions of 6 billion illegals living happily ever after 1100 sq. ft. homes in Texas, and Elian Gonzales, and overarching Federal control of State governments, and courts overruling the will of the people, and displaced populations being better off because they have tap water.
Maybe thats why your only allies on this site are ACLU Democrats and brain dead thread baiters ... Everyone else on this site has legitimate concerns about illegal immigration and its related problems, and is searching for a solution to the problem. You use every manner of cliche or tortured analogies to deny that there even is a problem.
*See previous post by CBG.
The US has citizens that do all those bad things too. You need to be more open minded. Immigrants have been historically a very good thing for America.
And P.S. I do believe I was the one that brought the indians into this.
The US has citizens that do all those bad things too. You need to be more open minded. Immigrants have been historically a very good thing for America.
And P.S. I do NOT believe I was the one that brought the indians into this.
Did you even read his post? It says that any state offering in-state tuition for illegal aliens must also offer in-state tuition to any US citizen even if they do not live in said state. So this totally contradicts your point as this law is in fact meant to deter giving illegal aliens in-state.
How in the world will the state know someone's status if they are prohibited by law from asking? This law was simply put in place to give people like you something to feel good about.
The fact is ,that in the vast majority of states, illegal aliens are not eligible to pay in-state tuiton. Not even Mass allows illegals in-state tuition. Youre either being consciously deceptive or youre ignorant of the facts. Just google any state and in-state tuition for illegals and youll find article after article featuring your compatriots from various "immigrants rights" groups lamenting the denial of in-state tuition to illegals.
"The bottom line regarding illegal immigration is no different of how we financed and supported various regimes during the Cold War - the bigger picture was to defeat the USSR."
Not quite sure what you mean by this.
I believe that illegal immigration is devastating to our country. We have propped up a corrupt administration in mexico for years and they have flooded our country with illegals, criminals and government sponsored dope now backed up with the threat that they'll sell their oil to china.
My grandafther came from Ireland, another great grandfather came from Italy, others came from Scotland and Germany. They came here legally with one desire. To become an American.
This is not what a majority of illegals coming from mexico or china are here for.
How many times can I say it, if the state doesn't know your immigration status, and you apply from within that state, have graduated from a state k-12 school, you're going to be paying in state tuition.
Talk about dishonest. Nothing is for free. Roads don't build themselves and they are not built unless they are needed.
Does anyone really believe, say in the Washington DC area where 1/3 are foreign born, that all the sewage, roads and other infrastructure would even be there if not for the additional people? And what about the cost of usage?
One other point, look at the cost of education. Native population growth is almost zero. Almost every school built is due to the influx of foreign children.
What is the cost to buy the land, build the school, furnish it, staff it, higher-level admin, transportation and supplies? No way, do illegals pay into our system what is extracted. Most legals do not either.
I suspect your "ClintonBeGone" moniker is a front for a liberal trolling FR. But if you are honestly conservative will you answer these questions:
Is illegal immigration good for America? If so, how many people do you think is enough for America to have before our quality of life deteriorates to an unacceptable level - 400 million, 500 million? Please be specific on when you think the flood should be stopped.
If illegal immigration is not good for America, in your opinion, how should we go about halting those who are flaunting our laws when they enter our country? And please tell me which other laws I may ignore that will be to my benefit without fear of prosecution.
If you are for allowing illegal immigration, what should be done for those Americans on the border who's lands are being trashing and destroyed?
If you are for doing nothing about illegal immigration, how do you propose to protect this country from those who would enter it to do us harm, such as Muslim extremists?
The list of questions that I predict you will not fully answer goes on and on.
Yes. Immigration is good for America.
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