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To: DannyTN

I didn't say that. An omnipotent, omniscient god could very well create free will - although that would require that he limit himself, which would then make him a limited god. However, what I said was that an omnipotent, omniscient god would not rationally create anything that he considers evil, in which case nothing evil would exist to be chosen by free will. If nothing evil exists in the judgment of a god, then there can be no transgression in judgment of such a god, in which case the god is irrelevant from a practical standpoint, because anything that would upset the god doesn't exist to be done.

If a god creates anything that he considers evil then he is a dualist god. Creating the option of engaging in evil is creating evil.


34 posted on 04/11/2005 11:02:56 AM PDT by AntiGuv (™)
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To: AntiGuv

"An omnipotent, omniscient god could very well create free will - although that would require that he limit himself, which would then make him a limited god."

I beg to differ. Limiting oneself, by choice, does not contradict omnipotence. On a merely human level, the fact that I have the ability to do something does not change simply because I choose not to do it.


46 posted on 04/11/2005 11:12:47 AM PDT by newheart (The Truth? You can't handle the Truth. But He can handle you.)
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To: AntiGuv
"Creating the option of engaging in evil is creating evil."

No. That is not the same.

"An omnipotent, omniscient god could very well create free will - although that would require that he limit himself, which would then make him a limited god."

Yes, to the extent that God gives us free will, He has limited Himself. But for all practical purposes, He's unlimited. He can do anything He wants, including destroy us. That He doesn't destroy us immediately, but gives us time to repent, is His perogative. I'm certainly not in the position to call Him evil for having given me time.

I think perhaps the confusion is between an Omnipotent God (one who can do anything) and an Omnicontrolling God. Not everything that happens is God's will. It's never God's will that man sins. However, it is God's will that we have free will.

To use a simple analogy. It's never my will that my child falls and hurts himself. However, it is my will that my child leans to walk on his own, and that means taking risks and suffering bumps and bruises. God is very much a risk taker.

60 posted on 04/11/2005 11:22:13 AM PDT by DannyTN
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To: AntiGuv
If a god creates anything that he considers evil then he is a dualist god. Creating the option of engaging in evil is creating evil.

God is the "alpha and omega, the beginning and the end." He knows all things, for all time. He created Lucifer, and since he knows all things, he knew that Lucifer would rebel. He knew that Lucifer would convince Eve to take a bite out of the forbidden fruit, and yet he put the tree of knowledge there anyways. He knew that he was creating evil, and yet he did it anyways.

139 posted on 04/11/2005 12:33:33 PM PDT by wyattearp (The best weapon to have in a gunfight is a shotgun - preferably from ambush.)
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To: AntiGuv
An omnipotent, omniscient god could very well create free will - although that would require that he limit himself, which would then make him a limited god.

 

Uh... just WHY is this a requirement?

limited...  if I choose NOT to stop my 2 year old grandchild from playing with matches, does this make ME limited?

 

 

Just because a great many people believe in something
is no guarantee of its truth.
 
~Gandhi

270 posted on 04/11/2005 2:40:18 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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