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The Evangelical Pope?
Boston Globe ^ | April 10, 2005 | Mark Noll

Posted on 04/10/2005 2:55:51 PM PDT by RWR8189

Pope John Paul II and President Bush during their first meeting at the Pontiff's summer residence in Castel Gandolfo, near Rome, in July 2001.
Pope John Paul II and President Bush during their first meeting at the Pontiff's summer residence in Castel Gandolfo, near Rome, in July 2001. (AP Photo / Arturo Mari)

No one would mistake John Paul II for an evangelical Protestant. But he contributed to a dramatic warming of relations between evangelicals and Catholics that may mark a turning point not only in American politics but in the history of Christianity.

DURING THE 1960 presidential campaign, leaders of the National Association of Evangelicals - including Harold John Ockenga of Boston's historic Park Street Church - joined other Protestants in warning the nation about the danger of electing a Catholic, John F. Kennedy. Last year, the conservative evangelical spokesman Gary L. Bauer saw the matter very differently.

''When John F. Kennedy made his famous speech that the Vatican would not tell him what to do,'' Bauer told USA Today, ''evangelicals and Southern Baptists breathed a sigh of relief. But today evangelicals and Southern Baptists are hoping that the Vatican will tell Catholic politicians what to do.''

The deep suspicion that in 1960 characterized evangelical attitudes toward Catholics - and Catholic attitudes toward evangelicals - has moderated considerably. What has changed? Why have the changes taken place? And how did Pope John Paul II contribute to


(Excerpt) Read more at boston.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Editorial; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: catholics; christianity; evangelical; evangelicalpope; evangelicals; jfk; johnpaul2; johnpaulii; johnpaulthegreat; legacy; nextpope; pope; unity

1 posted on 04/10/2005 2:55:51 PM PDT by RWR8189
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To: RWR8189
''When John F. Kennedy made his famous speech that the Vatican would not tell him what to do,'' Bauer told USA Today, ''evangelicals and Southern Baptists breathed a sigh of relief. But today evangelicals and Southern Baptists are hoping that the Vatican will tell Catholic politicians what to do.''

I wish the next Pope would excommunicate a few of the heretical Catholic politicians in the United States.

2 posted on 04/10/2005 3:02:07 PM PDT by wagglebee ("We are ready for the greatest achievements in the history of freedom." -- President Bush, 1/20/05)
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To: wagglebee

Roman Catholics and American Evangelicals have more in common than either have in common with people like Teddy Kennedy.


3 posted on 04/10/2005 3:05:00 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: RWR8189

Well .. I think two things could have happened - either the Pope was an Evangelical - or he began to see the Evangelical movement within the Catholic church and understood it to be from GOD.


4 posted on 04/10/2005 3:41:05 PM PDT by CyberAnt (President Bush: "America is the greatest nation on the face of the earth")
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To: muawiyah

- In ecumenical circles the claim is made with increasing frequency that Rome now accepts the doctrine of justification by grace alone. The recently approved agreement between the Lutheran World Federation and the Vatican, the "Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification," makes this claim. Many supporters of the Promise Keepers movement have written to me making this claim. Those who promote the idea that there are "Evangelical Catholics" often make this claim.

That the Roman Catholic Church does NOT believe in salvation by grace alone through faith alone by the finished atonement of Jesus Christ alone is evident in the following indisputable facts:

JUSTIFICATION BY GRACE ALONE DENIED BY TRENT

At the Council of Trent (1545-1563), the declarations of which are still in force, the Roman Catholic Church formally condemned the biblical doctrine of faith alone and grace alone. Consider the following declarations of Trent:

"If anyone says that justifying faith is nothing else than confidence in divine mercy, which remits sins for Christ's sake, or that it is this confidence alone that justifies us, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA" (Sixth Session, Canons Concerning Justification, Canon 12).

"If anyone says that the justice received is not preserved and also not increased before God through good works, but that those works are merely the fruits and signs of justification obtained, but not the cause of its increase, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA" (Sixth Session, Canons Concerning Justification, Canon 24).

JUSTIFICATION BY GRACE ALONE DENIED BY VATICAN II

In its most formal and authoritative statements since Trent, Rome has continued to deny that salvation is by grace alone through Christ's atonement alone through faith alone without works or sacraments. Consider the following statements of the authoritative Vatican II Council of the mid-1960s, called by Pope John Paul XXIII and attended by more than 2,400 Catholic bishops --

"For it is the liturgy through which, especially in the divine sacrifice of the Eucharist, 'the work of our redemption is accomplished,' and it is through the liturgy, especially, that the faithful are enabled to express in their lives and manifest to others the mystery of Christ and the real nature of the true Church" (Vatican II, Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, Introduction, para. 2).

"As often as the sacrifice of the cross by which 'Christ our Pasch is sacrificed' (1 Cor. 5:7) is celebrated on the altar, the work of our redemption is carried out" (Vatican II, Dogmatic Constitution on the Church, Chapter 1, 3, p. 324).

"... [Christ] also willed that the work of salvation which they preached should be set in train through the sacrifice and sacraments, around which the entire liturgical [ritualistic] life revolves. Thus by Baptism men are grafted into the paschal mystery of Christ. ... They receive the spirit of adoption as sons" (Vatican II, Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, Chap. 1, I, 5,6, pp. 23-24).

"From the most ancient times in the Church good works were also offered to God for the salvation of sinners, particularly the works which human weakness finds hard. Because the sufferings of the martyrs for the faith and for God's law were thought to be very valuable, penitents used to turn to the martyrs to be helped by their merits to obtain a more speedy reconciliation from the bishops. Indeed, the prayers and good works of holy people were regarded as of such great value that it could be asserted that the penitent was washed, cleansed and redeemed with the help of the entire Christian people" (Vatican II, Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, Apostolic Constitution on the Revision of Indulgences, chap. 3, 6, pp. 78,79).

ROME DENIES SALVATION BY GRACE ALONE IN ITS DEFINITION OF JUSTIFICATION

Rome's gospel is a confused combination of faith plus works, grace plus sacraments, Christ plus the church. It redefines grace to include works. It confuses justification with sanctification. It confuses imputation with impartation. It views justification not as a once-for-all legal declaration whereby the sinner is declared righteous before God and is granted eternal life as the unmerited gift of God, but as a PROCESS whereby the sinner is gradually saved through participation in the sacraments. There is no eternal security in the Roman gospel because salvation allegedly depends partially upon a man's works. According to Roman Catholic theology, Christ purchased salvation and gave it to the Catholic Church to be distributed to men through its sacraments. This is not only a false gospel, it is a blasphemous usurpation of Christ's position as only Lord and Savior and Mediator. The authoritative Addis and Arnold Catholic Dictionary, with the Imprimature (ecclesiastical authorization for printing) of E. Morrough Bernard, 1950, says justification "consists, not in the mere remission of sins, but in the sanctification and renewal of the inner man by the voluntary reception of God's grace and gifts" This dictionary plainly states that the Roman Catholic doctrine of justification is contrary to that of the Reformation, noting that "the Council of Trent was at pains to define most clearly and explicitly the Catholic tradition on the matter, placing it in sharp opposition to the contrary tenets of the Reformers." Our Sunday Visitor's Catholic Encyclopedia, published in 1991, defines justification as "THE PROCESS by which a sinner is made righteous, pure and holy before God." "Justification in the Catholic Tradition comes about by means of faith in Christ, AND in a life of good works lived in response to God's invitation to believe. ... That works are clearly required in the New Testament for union with Christ is seen in the many parables such as the Good Samaritan, Lazarus and Dives, and others" (emphasis added).

ROME DENIES SALVATION BY GRACE ALONE IN DOZENS OF OTHER WAYS

Not only in most authoritative declarations and not only by its definition of justification, but in dozens of other ways Rome denies the once-for-all sufficiency of Christ's atonement, His sole mediatorship, and the doctrine of salvation through faith alone by grace alone without works.

Rome denies justification by grace alone BY ITS DOCTRINE OF BAPTISMAL REGENERATION. The New Catholic Catechism (1994) dogmatically declares: "The Church does not know of any means other than Baptism that assures entry into eternal beatitude; this is why she takes care not to neglect the mission she has received from the Lord to see that all who can be baptized are 'reborn of water and the Spirit.' God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism..." (1257).

Rome denies justification by grace alone BY ITS DOCTRINE OF THE MASS, by claiming that in the mass "the sacrifice of the cross is perpetuated" and "the work of our redemption is carried out" (Vatican II, Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy).

Rome denies justification by grace alone BY ITS DOCTRINE OF THE SACRAMENTS: "The Church affirms that for believers the sacraments of the New Covenant are necessary for salvation. ... The fruit of the sacramental life is that the Spirit of adoption makes the faithful partakers in the divine nature by uniting them in a living union with the only Son, the Saviour" (New Catholic Catechism, 1129).

Rome denies justification by grace alone BY ITS DOCTRINE OF PURGATORY, claiming that "the doctrine of purgatory clearly demonstrates that even when the guilt of sin has been taken away, punishment for it or the consequences of it may remain to be expiated or cleansed" (Vatican II, Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy).

Rome denies justification by grace alone and the sole Mediatorship of Christ BY ITS DOCTRINE OF CONFESSION. "One who desires to obtain reconciliation with God and with the Church, must confess to a priest all the unconfessed grave sins he remembers after having carefully examined his conscience" (New Catholic Catechism, 1493). "Individual and integral confession of grave sins followed by absolution remains the only ordinary means of reconciliation with God and with the Church" (New Catholic Catechism, 1497). "The sacrament of Penance restores and strengthens in members of the Church who have sinned the fundamental gift of ... conversion to the kingdom of Christ, which is first received in Baptism" (Vatican II, Decree on Confession for Religious).

Rome denies justification by grace alone and the sole Mediatorship of Christ BY ITS DOCTRINE OF THE PAPACY: "For 'God's only-begotten Son ... has won a treasure for the militant Church ... he has entrusted it to blessed Peter, the key-bearer of heaven, and to his successors who are Christ's vicars on earth, so that they may distribute it to the faithful for their salvation'" (ellipsis are in the original) (Vatican II, Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, Apostolic Constitution on the Revision of Indulgences, Chap. 4, 7, p. 80).

Rome denies justification by grace alone and the sole Mediatorship of Christ BY ITS PRIESTHOOD: "The purpose then for which priests are consecrated by God through the ministry of the bishop is that they should be made sharers in a special way in Christ's priesthood and, by carrying out sacred functions, act as his ministers who through his Spirit continually exercises his priestly function for our benefit in the liturgy. By Baptism priests introduce men into the People of God; by the sacrament of Penance they reconcile sinners with God and the Church; by the Anointing of the sick they relieve those who are ill; and especially by the celebration of Mass they offer Christ's sacrifice sacramentally" (Vatican II, Decree on the Ministry and Life of Priests, chap. 2, I, 5, p. 781).

Rome denies justification by grace alone and the sole Mediatorship of Christ BY ITS DOCTRINE OF MARY: "In a wholly singular way she cooperated by her obedience, faith, hope and burning charity in the Saviour's work of restoring supernatural life to souls. For this reason she is a mother to us in the order of grace" (New Catholic Catechism, 968). "... Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us gifts of eternal salvation. ... Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked in the Church under the titles of Advocate, Helper, Benefactress, and Mediatrix" (New Catholic Catechism, 969).

Rome denies justification by grace alone and the sole Mediatorship of Christ BY ITS DOCTRINE OF THE SAINTS: "Thus recourse to the communion of saints lets the contrite sinner be more promptly and efficaciously purified of the punishments for sin" (New Catholic Catechism, 1475).

Rome denies justification by grace alone and the sole Mediatorship of Christ BY ITS DOCTRINE OF FORGIVENESS THROUGH THE CHURCH: "There is no offense, however serious, that the Church cannot forgive. ... Christ who died for all men desires that in his Church the gates of forgiveness should always be open to anyone who turns away from sin" (New Catholic Catechism, 982).

Rome denies justification by grace alone BY ITS DOCTRINE OF INDULGENCES: "An indulgence is a remission before God of the temporal punishment due to sins whose guilt has already been forgiven, which the faithful Christian who is duly disposed gains under certain prescribed conditions through the action of the Church which, as the minister of redemption, dispenses and applies with authority the treasury of the satisfactions of Christ and the saints. ... Indulgences may be applied to the living or the dead" (New Catholic Catechism, 1471).

CONCLUSION

Rome has not changed its doctrinal position or its claims to be the one, true, holy, apostolic church. It is engaged, rather, in a clever ploy. It is using the ecumenical movement to bring the separated sons home to the papa (which is the meaning of the term pope), and it is succeeding brilliantly. The amazing fact is that Rome has not hidden its goal in ecumenical relations. Consider the following statement from Vatican II:

"The term 'ecumenical movement' indicates the initiatives and activities encouraged and organized, according to the various needs of the [Roman] Church and as opportunities offer, to promote Christian unity. ... The results will be that, little by little, as the obstacles to perfect ecclesiastical communion are overcome, ALL CHRISTIANS WILL BE GATHERED IN A COMMON CELEBRATION OF THE EUCHARIST, INTO THE UNITY OF THE ONE AND ONLY CHURCH, which Christ bestowed on his Church from the beginning. THE UNITY, WE BELIEVE, SUBSISTS IN THE CATHOLIC CHURCH AS SOMETHING SHE CAN NEVER LOSE" (emphasis added) (Vatican II, Decree on Ecumenism, chap. 1, 4, p. 416).

For those who claim to be Evangelical Catholics and who claim to believe that salvation is by grace alone, I say you are deceiving yourself and others by remaining in the Roman Catholic Church which explicitly denies what you claim to believe. God’s curse is upon those who preach a false gospel and Rome certainly falls under that curse. The Bible warns that those who affiliate with error become partakers with that error.

Do not be deceived, friends.

"And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues" (Revelation 18:4).

"Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables" (2 Timothy 4:2-4).


5 posted on 04/10/2005 3:58:08 PM PDT by joesnuffy (The generation that survived the depression and won WW2 proved poverty does not cause crime)
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To: muawiyah

Whoever said Teddy Kennedy was a Catholic????


6 posted on 04/10/2005 4:00:04 PM PDT by Thumper1960 ("It is true that liberty is precious; so precious that it must be carefully rationed."-V.I.Lenin)
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To: joesnuffy

Keith Green and Last Days Ministries put out a series called the Catholic Chronicles around 1980. It was very hard-hitting, and many Catholics read it and got saved. But many complained, as did many Protestants and--alas--they pulled it.


7 posted on 04/10/2005 4:23:06 PM PDT by guitarist
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To: joesnuffy

I found it online!:
http://users.ev1.net/~damonm/catholic-chronicles/chron_3.html
Link came from a complete Catholic links (pro and con) site:
http://users.ev1.net/~damonm/catholic-chronicles/chron_3.html


8 posted on 04/10/2005 4:37:36 PM PDT by guitarist
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To: joesnuffy

Sorry, 2nd link was wrong. It should be:
http://www.cbhs.org/rmartin/links.htm


9 posted on 04/10/2005 4:38:38 PM PDT by guitarist
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To: joesnuffy

Sorry again! The 1st page of the Green series should be:
http://users.ev1.net/~damonm/catholic-chronicles/main.html


10 posted on 04/10/2005 4:39:56 PM PDT by guitarist
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To: joesnuffy

Romans 10:9
That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Most Catholics profess those same beliefs.

If it is indeed the Grace of God and nothing that we do that saves us, doesn't that same Grace apply to Catholics as well?
Isn't Grace the UNMERITTED favor of God?
We Christians spend too much time thinking that our particular way of worshipping God is superior to others. G-d will be the ultimate judge.


11 posted on 04/10/2005 5:31:56 PM PDT by brwnsuga (Proud, Black, Conservative!)
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Comment #12 Removed by Moderator

To: joesnuffy

When Catholics speak of good works they are referring to the following:

KJV Matthew 19:

"16: And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17: And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
18: He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
19: Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
20: The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
21: Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
22: But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.
23: Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
24: And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
25: When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
26: But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible. "

and

29: And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.


and Matthew 25:

31: When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
32: And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
33: And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
34: Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
35: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
36: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.
37: Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
38: When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
39: Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
40: And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
41: Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44: Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45: Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46: And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

So in Christ's eyes, righteousness means 'good works' that are in fact the true manifestations of infused Faith.


13 posted on 04/10/2005 6:17:43 PM PDT by wiley
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To: joesnuffy

The Catholic Church has always and will always teach that salvation is by grace alone.

Its just that our understanding of the efficacy of God's grace appears to be much greater than the limits you put on it.


14 posted on 04/10/2005 6:19:43 PM PDT by Tantumergo
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"Evangelicals"

There is that word again in a liberal newspaper.

Anyone else making the connection yet?


15 posted on 04/10/2005 6:24:03 PM PDT by baystaterebel (F/8 and be there!)
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To: joesnuffy

Epistle of James 2,14-26:

What use is it, my brethren, if a man says he has faith, but he has no works? Can that faith save him?
If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food,
and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, be warmed and be filled," and yet you do not give them what is necessary for [their] body, what use is that?
Even so faith, if it has no works, is dead, [being] by itself.
But someone may [well] say, "You have faith, and I have works; show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works."
You believe that God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder.
But are you willing to recognize, you foolish fellow, that faith without works is useless?
Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he offered up Isaac his son on the altar?
You see that faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected;
and the Scripture was fulfilled which says, "AND ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS RECKONED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS," You see that a man is justified by works, and not by faith alone.
And in the same way was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works, when she received the messengers and sent them out by another way?
For just as the body without [the] spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.


16 posted on 04/10/2005 6:37:03 PM PDT by j23
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To: j23; Salvation

In my opinion, the notion of Sola Scriptura (Scripture alone) is entirely untenable if you look at the history of Christianity. The Christian Bible in any form approaching the one we have now only emerged past 400 AD, after Christianity had already gone through an explosion of conversion and establishment (and when I say "we" I'm being generous because I make no distinction of the rather conspicuously missing books from the Protestant "Bibles"; books that in fact were in the Bible until they were unceremoniously ejected by Protestants). Furthermore, texts must have been rare, and the literacy of the people in those times was much, much lower than modern literacy rates. And, as has been said, there are indeed numerous passages of Scripture that refute the "Bible seminar" approach to Christianity.

As for "good works," etc., here are some other interesting New Testament passages to look at:

James 1,22-27
1 Peter 1,13-16
1 Peter 2,11-12; 15
1 Peter 2,19-20
1 Peter 3,10-14
2 Peter 1,5-8
2 Peter 1,19-21
1 John 2,3-6
1 John 2,28-29
1 John 3,4-10
1 John 3,20-24
1 John 4,20-21
1 John 5,1-3
2 John 12
3 John 11; 13-14


17 posted on 04/10/2005 8:40:55 PM PDT by Norman Bates (In memoriam: Pope John Paul II†, Theresa Marie Schindler†)
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To: baystaterebel
"Evangelicals"

There is that word again in a liberal newspaper.

Time magazine did a big article on 25 influential Evangicals.

Several of them were catholic.

The media just doesn't get it.

18 posted on 04/10/2005 10:17:05 PM PDT by Sonny M ("oderint dum metuant")
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