Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

The Schiavo Stakes: What the Fight's Really About
New York Post (online) ^ | Mar. 25, 2005 | John Podhoretz

Posted on 03/25/2005 5:40:55 AM PST by Zivasmate

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 41-6061-8081-100101-111 next last
To: SoothsayerToo

"And what is all of your response to all of this, if you did not get your way; You threaten to take your marbles and go home, just like the immature kids we all knew growing up. My advice to all with these attitudes: Grow up, there is much more to being a conservative republican than just this one issue."

But it is the most important conservative issue. Everything else is secondary. And that is the sanctity of human life. And you don't have to be Evangelical to believe that. But you must believe that G-d plays the most major role in our lives.


81 posted on 03/25/2005 7:41:13 AM PST by Zivasmate (" A wise man's heart inclines him to his right, but a fool's heart to his left." - Ecclesiastes 10)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 72 | View Replies]

To: cyn
However, FL statutes are that any cremation MUST be run by the district's medical examiner office and be approved. This approval is given only after the ME office is satisfied that the death is not due to violence or suspicious circumstances, homicide, or suicide. The ME office is meant to cooperate with, but to be totally independent of, any law enforcement or hospitals or courts.

Generally, in a hospital setting, few actual autopsies are performed unless there is a question as to the cause of death. In Terri's case the obvious cause of death will be kidney failure, and the ME will probably not feel compelled to perform an autopsy.

The ME will perfom an autopsy at the request of the family, but as her legal guradian is Mr. Schiavo I doubt that one will be requested.

One might conclude that Michael's desire to insult and hurt Terri's family goes far beyond simply causing her death.

It's been a brutal court battle where they've done their best to paint him as unfit to be Terri's guardian. I imagine that there are some very hard feelings all around.

82 posted on 03/25/2005 7:41:30 AM PST by Zeroisanumber
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: politeia
I defy anyone to find legal authorization, even in Florida law, for this order.

Chapter 765, Florida Statutes 2004 <-- Link

It's in there. If I wasn't so exhausted over this, I'd point you to the details. Here are links to some posts where I quote and discuss clauses ...

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1370346/posts?page=96#96
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1369665/posts?page=818#818 <-- See 818, 829, 855

83 posted on 03/25/2005 7:44:52 AM PST by Cboldt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: mlc9852

If they are giving her morphine, then they are giving her IM INJECTIONS. That means that this poor victim of judicial ignorance has to bear and endure a needle thrust into her hips, thighs or arms every three to four hours! Because she doesn't have an IV! Because they are dehydrating her to death! What these morons don't GET, is that the morphine won't circulate in a system that HAS NO VOLUME! SO the drug will sit in her sytem, she won't really die any sooner to meet THEIR needs for her to die, but she will have to endure this during the last days of the life that her former husband guaranteed would be full of pain and suffering.

As an ICU RN for 15 years, when I saw an order for IM morphine, I would call the Doctor for an order to start an IV to give IV morphine. It is simply more humane. But Greer has negated this simple common sense humanity.

What I can't get past is the fact that Michael wouldn't let her have a room with a window to see or sense the sun for all those years. It is too cruel. I've never witnessed such psychological cruelty in all my years of nursing. When we had a long term neuro patient like Terry in neuro ICU, many nurses along with the family family gave them a pleasant environment as possible. Balloons, TV, music. We all knew that stimulating (when appropriate) a patient gets them better, gets the brain going. Michael knew this too. Thus the rationale for NO INPUT of any kind. No subtle warmth from the window, no sense of a day or night. SO cruel, it breaks my heart.

If Michael thinks she has only a reptilian brain, then the reptiles in any zoo are given a much better life than Terri. When was the last time Terri was out in the sunshine? Before I die, I will have the answer to that question.

But the brain is more than a CAT scan and she obviously enjoys love in her life from the family and the hard working nurses. Have you read The Holographic Brain?

SO, because of Greer's order for no IV, Terri's last hours will be filled with the PAIN of intermittent SHARP STINGING in her arms and thighs. And because she is dehydrated, they will most probably HIT BONE, very painful.

Welcome to the brave new world of convenience killing.


84 posted on 03/25/2005 7:45:56 AM PST by coronado
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: catch

Just like a certain religion that relishes and sacrifices their people to the Death God.


85 posted on 03/25/2005 7:46:34 AM PST by Two-Bits (May You Never be looked on with Pity from your love ones but only with love and compassion!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 52 | View Replies]

To: All

UP AGAIN.


86 posted on 03/25/2005 7:46:57 AM PST by Miss Behave (Man who fart in church sit in own pew.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 62 | View Replies]

To: Theodore R.
Iowa. We have a small but dedicated Lutherans for Life group here. Pastor Woolsey is only in his 30s and just had his second child about a month ago. He is passionate about the life issue. He says there is none more important and he's leading his flock that way.

The good news: It's working. Our church is growing.

87 posted on 03/25/2005 7:53:16 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 73 | View Replies]

To: ArGee
In the end this isn't about Terri. She will go to her Lord and be much happier. This is about us and what we have become. And what we have become is a nation that murders people when they are no longer wanted.

When being unwanted is a capital crime G-d help us all.

Amen!!!

88 posted on 03/25/2005 7:55:47 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 57 | View Replies]

To: Cboldt
I just read the text of the Florida statute you provided the link for and found the following two sections that relate to this issue:

10) "Life-prolonging procedure" means any medical procedure, treatment, or intervention, including artificially provided sustenance and hydration, which sustains, restores, or supplants a spontaneous vital function. The term does not include the administration of medication or performance of medical procedure, when such medication or procedure is deemed necessary to provide comfort care or to alleviate pain.

3) The Legislature recognizes that for some the administration of life-prolonging medical procedures may result in only a precarious and burdensome existence. In order to ensure that the rights and intentions of a person may be respected even after he or she is no longer able to participate actively in decisions concerning himself or herself, and to encourage communication among such patient, his or her family, and his or her physician, the Legislature declares that the laws of this state recognize the right of a competent adult to make an advance directive instructing his or her physician to provide, withhold, or withdraw life-prolonging procedures, or to designate another to make the treatment decision for him or her in the event that such person should become incapacitated and unable to personally direct his or her medical care.

This defination of "Life-prolonging procedure" does not grant any judge the ability to order someone cannot recieve food and water by mouth since it is obviously not "artificially" provided. Neither is it an "intervention" any more than feeding a baby is an "intervention." Was there some other part of Florida statutes that would make Greer's order legal or have I missed something?

89 posted on 03/25/2005 8:12:16 AM PST by politeia
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 83 | View Replies]

To: politeia
Was there some other part of Florida statutes that would make Greer's order legal or have I missed something?

I'm tired, and don't want to make Greer's and the court's argument for you. The legal connections are fully fleshed out in appelate decisions. If you can find an error of law in one of those, then you win.

I don't like the outocme. I think it is abhorrent. You asked what statute Greer's authority came from, and now you have it.

90 posted on 03/25/2005 8:16:58 AM PST by Cboldt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 89 | View Replies]

To: Sam Cree

You are right, and I was wrong to express myself that way. I meant to convey that we all need to work to correct this sad situation, and keep at it until we make a difference.


91 posted on 03/25/2005 8:30:57 AM PST by MainFrame65
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 77 | View Replies]

To: swampfox98

Terri Schiavo is being killed to cover up Medicaid fraud by Sunshine Hospice. Dept. of HHS is prosecuting them now. The system protected Schiavo from abuse allegations and he provided a body to the hospice to defraud Medicaid. Criss-Cross.


92 posted on 03/25/2005 8:32:44 AM PST by massgopguy (massgopguy)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: ALOHA RONNIE

The Mental Patient


93 posted on 03/25/2005 8:35:10 AM PST by massgopguy (massgopguy)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: MainFrame65

My apologies too, I am probably acting overly sensitive. I have to admit that it did happen here in FL, so it's useless to pretend it won't be taken as another reflection on the state. I love FL, but it's true that weird stuff never stops happening here.

The implications of the decisions on Terri are ominous for us all, I think.


94 posted on 03/25/2005 8:35:58 AM PST by Sam Cree (Democrats are herd animals)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 91 | View Replies]

To: Diogenesis

He is now on God's Death Row. Sentence to be carried out when he least expects it.


95 posted on 03/25/2005 8:40:28 AM PST by DarthVader (John "Diarrhea of the Mouth" Kerry = Vile Smelling Excrement)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: ALOHA RONNIE
Where were all the nurses and witnesses before these very last days...?
Why did so many remain silent til now?
Why did we not hear their voices?
So many years have gone by.
Time was not of the essence?
Where were they, I ask.

A nurse fired for not following Michael's orders? She deemed them abusive to Terri's care.
Allegations surface. Nurses afraid of his "bullying". Family pictures turned to face the wall. Misuse of insulin by her husband? Needle marks all over her body? Vile in the waste receptacle hidden from view?
No rehab though the court awarded over a million for Terri's care?

How did this alleged chain of improper care and abuse continue to be of no major public interest til now?
Neglect all around.
Neglect in reporting improprieties of her care to superiors and family?
Neglect to inform the proper authorities of alleged past spousal abuse?
Neglect to ferociously fight to strip Michael of his role as sole guardian?
Where was this doctor from the Mayo clinic months, years ago?
Why not until now do we read an ex-girlfriend and stalking victim of Michael's, claim he admitted to ne'er a discussion of a "living will" as "They were only 25..Why would they discuss that then"?
Claims Michael referred to Terri as "bitch"?

Little national attention was given this story til Terri's last days. We now witness a torturous, barbaric death of a woman who was never allowed due process.
The Judicial fighting the Executive Branch -vise versa.
The "Bible thumping" Republicans battle the newly named "Deathocrats".

The family grieves. The country grieves.
Interviews continue between politicians, as if we care what they think?
Do they not only think of the next election?
Other politicians unusually silent.
Mayor Koch's lackadaisical smile perched on his elf-like face made me scowl; as he describes Terri as finally experiencing "dignity" in this manner of death.
Michael Jackson adorned with distinguished service medals as he slowly makes his way to court.
Interviews ongoing with grieving Schrivo family members.
Death Reality TV.

Where will all the flowers go?
I hope with Terri's passing.

96 posted on 03/25/2005 8:47:03 AM PST by fight_truth_decay
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 66 | View Replies]

To: Zeroisanumber

Hi, zero -- As we look at motivation on both sides, one side comes off looking better than the other.

The most damning evidence I see is the fact that Terri has not been allowed out of her room, out and about in her wheelchair for at least 5 years. In the early 90's she was. What's with that? That's not the humane, ordinary care any other patient in Terri's condition would have received! I know, I used to care for patients like that, and have also heard that from others. And that's just the tip of that iceberg.

Similarly, if it is so crucial to kill Terri, why would MS not let her family have her body, even if he needs to have it cremated for some reason? I stand by my assessment.


97 posted on 03/25/2005 8:56:29 AM PST by cyn (it's sarcasm, but Jim King really said it.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 82 | View Replies]

To: Cboldt
I am not even sure that the order to not feed Terri by mouth was ever appealed since the Judge only denied in on March 9 I believe. There is a thread from last night that had a pdf file of this denial by Greer and I think I remember the date correctly. Are these the appelate decisions you are referring to?

I know you are tired but I really would like to understand why you think the legality of the order to not feed her by mouth has already been challenged and settled as separate from the feeding tube removal appeal. There has been nothing in the media about this and nothing in the threads you provided explained this either.

98 posted on 03/25/2005 9:03:15 AM PST by politeia
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 90 | View Replies]

To: fight_truth_decay

You did not hear them because the media ignored their affidavits and their witness until now. The physicians reports have also been out for years -- incl. that of a local physician I got to talk with in Oct '03.

Recently I was at a press conference where the Schindlers and others talked about Terri's responsiveness and the details of her care -- for example, no swallowing test since early '90s, and that her wheelchair has been broken for many years, Michael has not had if fixed or replaced, and he has refused new ones offered. Bob Schindler confirmed a funny story that had been posted to the internet, incl. here on FR of visiting a very responsive Terri (she ignored her dad and fixed her attention on atty. David Gibbs).

There were no questions from the media (I did), and no connecting the dots. As a freeper, I kick myself now for not pressing that (hello!) obvious discrepancy in stories -- as in, "What!! I thought she couldn't respond to anything! But you say. . .". I don't want the media to report it as fact, but I DO expect them to take advantage of the opportunity to clarify the issue, the various sides, for themselves.



99 posted on 03/25/2005 9:06:55 AM PST by cyn (it's sarcasm, but Jim King really said it.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 96 | View Replies]

To: WKB

I recommend the spelling "Floridicide."

flor RID ih side.


100 posted on 03/25/2005 9:08:48 AM PST by Petronski (If Reichskanzler Greer can kill Terri, who will be next?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 41-6061-8081-100101-111 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson