Posted on 03/24/2005 3:29:58 PM PST by carl in alaska
Legal experts say that if Florida Gov. Jeb Bush defies state judge George Greer and orders state troopers to rescue Terri Schiavo, he and any other officials who participate in such a move risk a contempt citation from Greer that could put them in jail.
But with a powerful ally in the White House, Terri Schiavo's would-be rescuers have nothing to fear from the runaway judge.
In 2001, President Clinton pardoned drug dealers, international money launderers - even FALN terrorists, who were spared in a blatant bid to win votes for his wife's Senate campaign.
The episode taught a bewildered nation that the powers of the president to pardon anyone he wishes are absolute and irrefutable.
Today, Clinton is the most popular American politician in the world and his wife is the frontrunning candidate for her party's presidential nomination. In other words, the Pardongate scandal's lasting political fallout was nil.
He even pardoned his own brother, who had been convicted of selling cocaine.
Should Gov. Bush decide to rescue Terri Schiavo by force in violation of Judge Greer's order, President Bush could do the same for his brother - along with any other officials the right-to-die judge tries to punish.
Would there be controversy? You bet. Would the Bush family's political enemies try to capitalize? Absolutely.
But a nation that forgives one president for pardoning terrorists will certainly forgive another who uses his pardon power to save a life.
Once Terri Schiavo begins to receive the treatment she's been denied for more than a decade, her condition will almost certainly improve. Nurses who have cared for her have already testified she can speak and eat without a feeding tube, in stark contradiction of Judge Greer's findings.
Terri's recovery, however minimal, would serve as powerful evidence that the Bush brothers did the right thing in coming to her rescue.
In the meantime, the nation would be spared the haunting specter of its government starving an innocent citizen to death.
That's right and neither will George. All his "err on the side of life" is gas.
I think you're misreading what squarebarb meant in her post. She's not advocating a Waco style assault or anything like that. She's giving us a political analysis and talking about the way Jeb may be perceived by a lot of voters in this case. Unless he has an ace in the hole that I'm not aware of, Jeb seems to have handled this last week rather clumsily. Why did he mention this Florida statute that could allow DCF to take custody of Terri if Judge Greer can just issue an injunction preventing such action? This looks pretty bad right now and Jeb is looking like he can't even manage a confrontation with a state court judge.
OK, I'll read that article, because I'm curious about your position on this issue. Thanks for the link.
Sounds like an impeachable conspiracy-to-evade-the-law sort of thing to me.
No it wouldn't. The media would spin this in such a way that it would be impossible.
The President can not pardon for a state offense according to the DOJ anyway.
http://www.usdoj.gov/pardon/pardon_instructions.htm
In relevant part: "Under the Constitution, only federal criminal convictions, such as those obtained in the United States District Courts, may be pardoned by the President. In addition, the President's pardon power extends to convictions obtained in the Superior Court of the District of Columbia and military court-martial proceedings. However, the President cannot pardon a state criminal offense."
I stand corrected.
Yes, according to DOJ, and according to Article II of the U.S. Constitution, which is blindingly clear on the matter.
I know this sounds kind of ludicrous, but as governor could Jeb pardon himself? Not that he would ever be charged with any crime.
>> To demonize and condemn thoughtful people for drawing this conclusion, which is the conclusion of our legal and political system, is grandstanding on par with the worst of the Left.
Get a clue. The only grandstanding in this matter is by the out-of-control tyranny we call a judiciary.
In man's court, to be declared innocent, you must plead innocent. In God's court, to be declared innocent, you must plead guilty.
God has mercy on who he will have mercy, compassion on whom he will have compassion. Political power will NEVER change that.
But you, and others of similar persuasion, will go through your life in fear of losing political power, never realizing that it is God who promotes one, and demotes another. Your priorities seem to be out of phase with God's priorities. I said out of whack earlier, which is the same thing.
Technically, yes he could pardon himself. But then the state legislature could also impeach him.
This looks pretty bad right now and Jeb is looking like he can't even manage a confrontation with a state court judge.
How exactly should Jeb manage this in your opinion that doesn't involve breaking the law with multiple felonies including kidnapping?
Not to mention putting law enforcement lives in jeopardy. What if someone panics and fires a shot and people die in the street outside the hospice.
Jeb would have those deaths hung around his neck forever and he would be impeached and do jail time as well.
So what is your plan, I would really like to know.
Jeb's political future is over if he does not act, and anything W had planned to get passed in his second term with support from his party base is also gone south.
Dirtboy is not a moron - he's one of the best FReepers here and I enjoy his posts.
Some may trust in horses (lawyers) and some may trust in chariots (judges), but we will trust in the name of our GOD!Forgive me, God, for thinking they are the power. YOU ARE THE POWER. I praise YOU for giving ME the KEYS TO THE KINGDOM. I BIND all devils - you cannot kill, steal, or destroy this woman. You are under my feet because JESUS CHRIST is in me. All of this is for your glory - to call an ungodly nation to REPENT and turn back to YOUR WORD AND OBEY YOU.
Even worse, is that the Dems will turn it around against him.
I appreciate the theological ramifications and all, but most of us choose to deal with earthly forces. I'm guessing from your response that you think that war is unnecessary. God will demote the bad guy.
I guess we'll just disagree. In my experience, it's necessary to use the skills God gave us to win. And that includes thinking.
Yes, according to DOJ, and according to Article II of the U.S. Constitution, which is blindingly clear on the matter.
Again, the language in Art. II seems clear enough. But who's to say that the courts won't read something into it that isn't written? The Supreme Court has found all kinds of unwritten things in the Constitution, like the right to privacy, the right to an abortion, the right to homosexual sodomy, etc. The high court conceivably could rule that "offenses against the United States" includes state crimes. There are no US Supreme Court cases directly addressing this issue. I guess it's never come up, and I don't think W would try to challenge the rule, but if he wanted to try it, I guess he could...
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